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<jcater> nite all
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<reinhard> wb jbailey
<jbailey> =) Thanks reinhard
<reinhard> i think registering new projects on savannah is your favourite hobby, isn't it? ;)
<jbailey> heh - have you been watching my user id? =)
<reinhard> IOW you seem to be quite active in the last days :)
<reinhard> no but i check the "new projects" list every few days
<reinhard> and in like every one that sounds so interesting to me that i have a closer look your name appears :)
<jbailey> =)
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<jcater> mornin all
Nick change: dnZzzz -> derek
<derek> hiya
<jcater> howdy
<ToyMan> mornin/ guys
<derek> hi ToyMan
<derek> reinhard: you arent allowed to look at other projects, no one told you that you could stop coding
<ToyMan> derek: you Access-enabled yet
<ToyMan> hi
<derek> nope :(
<derek> still no stinking monitor
<derek> and windows isnt a 'monitorless' operating system
<ToyMan> did you try to open it in access 2000?
<derek> yes
<derek> it wants to 'convert it' (as access 2000 has entirely new architecture)
<derek> if i do that it works
<derek> HOWEVER, then i have no way to get back to you
<derek> i.e. verify it all works with your stuff
<ToyMan> hmm. just put a copy of xp office on a box
<ToyMan> that's access 2000 , right?
<derek> there is an option to open as access as 97
<derek> i was SO excited
<derek> until i noticed it made everything readonly :(
<ToyMan> shit
<ToyMan> heads
<derek> 2000 and XP dont know how compatiable they are
<derek> i assume they are at least same engine so should be relatively compatiable
<derek> i will get 97 up here pretty quick
<ToyMan> i was hoping i could use the xp box for my access dvlpmnt
<ToyMan> ko
<ToyMan> what's holding up your monitor?
<ToyMan> (besides your desk) ;)
<derek> i got email it shipped yesterday
<derek> so hopefully will be here by weekend
<derek> if i get time tonight i will grab old 14" out of garage and set it up
<derek> and get things rolling
<derek> we really want to create an action plan
<derek> for things
<derek> with dates etc
<ToyMan> that sounds good
<derek> and be much more 'official' than informal help
<ToyMan> ?
<ToyMan> more official?
<derek> i.e. accountable
<ToyMan> you mean, like taking it on as a formal project?
<derek> yes
<ToyMan> ahhh
Nick change: derek -> dnWork
<reinhard> i will be back on monday
<reinhard> bye
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<Mr_You> re
<dneighbo> ra
<Mr_You> ja rastafari
<Mr_You> goin to play golf with dad and bro, just thought I would read some scroll back ;-) 
<dneighbo> golf some for me too
<Mr_You> well bbl
Action: Mr_You &
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<dneighbo> anyone try msn.com today in mozilla?
<dneighbo> the monopoly lives and breathes baby
<jcater> ??
<jcater> what's it do?
<dneighbo> um
<dneighbo> try it
<dneighbo> :)
<dneighbo> in konq or mozilla or galeon
<dneighbo> any non ie 5.0 or greater browser in fact
<dneighbo> and you will get a lovely
<dneighbo> F*** YOU! No MSN for you.
<dneighbo> you can get latest version of internet exploder here <link>
<dneighbo> seriously give it a try
<dneighbo> you might cry
<dneighbo> it really is a war
<jcater> crap
Action: dneighbo grunts but can not deliver, try again later
<jcater> dude!
<jcater> a suburb here in memphis is basically declaring war on Apple
<jcater> man, cygwin is HUGE
<jcater> cygwin MUST be trying to sell CDs... why else would cygwin be so much trouble to download/install
<dneighbo> rofl
<dneighbo> remember this discussion the other day
<dneighbo> and i was pretty much told i was an invalid
<jcater> well, I guess I join your ranks
<dneighbo> cause i couldnt just cliek setup.exe on cygwin and have it magically work
<jcater> it's taking me all day to install cygwin
<dneighbo> and i was fairly adamant i didnt want us to have ANYTHING rely on it
<jcater> I'm trying to get the XFree/Win32 port to work
<jcater> (not make us dependent :)
<dneighbo>  Unfortunately, Microsoft® .NET Passport does not support the Web
<dneighbo> browsing software you are using. Please use supported browsing software such
<dneighbo> as Microsoft Internet Explorer version 4.0 or later, or Netscape Navigator
<dneighbo> versions 4.08-4.82.
<dneighbo> If you use Netscape Navigator 6.1: due to possible data security
<dneighbo> issues, you cannot currently access .NET Passport using Netscape Navigator
<dneighbo> 6.1. We take security seriously and are working with Netscape to resolve
<dneighbo> these issues as soon as possible so that .NET Passport can support Netscape
<dneighbo> Navigator 6.1. Until that time, please use supported browsing software. We
<dneighbo> apologize for this inconvenience and thank you for your patience.
<dneighbo> now that is funny
<jcater> roflmao
<jcater> omg
<jcater> I just tried w/knoq
<jcater> I was sure you had to be yanking my chain
<dneighbo> i am not
<dneighbo> this is really really incredible
<dneighbo> in midst of all monolopy stuff
<dneighbo> i will say for sure one thing m$ doesnt lack
<dneighbo> is balls
<dneighbo> really big ones
<jcater> you got that right
<jcater> well, I guess that breaks my msn.com dependency
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<ToyMan> shit
<ToyMan> heads
<jamest> ?
<jamest> did I come at a bad time?
<jcater> :)
<ToyMan> refering to MS...
<ToyMan> this is like the McCarthy era thing...
<jcater> jamest: use mozilla or konq
<jcater> and visit msn.com
<ToyMan> the commie committee
<jcater> (or lynx even)
<ToyMan> at some point people will say
<ToyMan> are'nt you going just a BIT too far???
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<jcater> hmm
<jcater> I think we scared gnuebot away
<jcater> I always wondered if gnuebot and bigbrother secretly fought in the background
<ToyMan> heh
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<jamest> hmmm
<jamest> telling konq to lie about who it is doesn't help either
<jcater> jamest: what's really interesting is if you try to use Passport
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<jamest> well, I guess I better go buy about 50 copies of XP
<jcater> it tells you due to "security concerns" (you know how proactive MS is :), you cannot use non-MS browsers
<ToyMan> I just put a copy on my wife's computer
<jamest> lol
<ToyMan> it hasn't crashed yet...
<jamest> ToyMan: ain't it purdy
<ToyMan> kinda like playing with my old toys
<ToyMan> fisher price kinda
<jamest> my record for WinME crashing was this
<jamest> open new computer box
<jamest> plug in computer
<ToyMan> a little fat-happy look
<jamest> turn on
<jamest> have it crash while doing initial startup
<ToyMan> i just wanna know how to get all the 'reminders' to buy MS stuff off the screen
<jamest> ?
<ToyMan> and i notice that after promising not to do the smart tags thing in IE 6...
<ToyMan> they went ahead and did it anyway
<jamest> MS Customer: Why are you sticking that up my butt?
<jamest> MS: We're not sticking anything up your butt.
<jamest> MS Customer: Yes you are.  You're standing behind me and I can see you sticking it up my butt.
<jamest> MS: No.  No we're not.  We promise.
<jamest> MS Customer: But I can feel it!
<jamest> MS: You must have issues.  I mean, if we were sticking something up your butt (which we're not) it'd be for your own good cause we think you're swell.
<jcater> MS: You misunderstand our intentions.. we are actually pulling something out of your butt.  You should be thanking us.
<jamest> lol
<jamest> I'm actually debating on getting rid of my last 5 of my 6 NT machines
<jamest> either with win2k or kde&linux
<jamest> the major hangup is of course.....drumroll....Office
<jamest> or there would be no doubt about going GNU/Linux
<jcater> but, james, now is the ideal time to upgrade to XP
<jamest> why?
<jcater> prices will never be this low
<jcater> :)
<jamest> what's it running per seat?
<jcater> I dunno
<jcater> haven't had the inclination to look
<jcater> our MS stations will not go past Win98
<jcater> most are Linux+KDE
Action: ToyMan got it at the right price...;)
<jcater> ToyMan: now that's not what we mean by "Free Software" :)
<ToyMan> the only time that theft seems....sacred
<jamest> anyone know of the follow type of network drive
<jamest> I'd like to take all my empty space on client system (lots of huge ide drives w/ little on them)
<jamest> and create a pool of empty space
<jamest> that is setup in a raid like fashion
<jamest> so that data is split across multiple machines
<jamest> and if a user reboots that machine the data is still available
<jamest> lol
<jamest> i just saw the yahoo article on msn.com
<jamest> they "suggest" other browsers
<jamest> but I don't see anywhere you can turn if you don't take their "suggestion"
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Action: jcater hates computers
<chillywilly> why?
<jcater> because they overcomplicate our lives
<chillywilly> heh, I think that could be said for a lot of things
<jcater> true
<chillywilly> mostly computers make things easier though
<chillywilly> :P
<jcater> nah
<jcater> we just tell ppl that so they'll pay us
<chillywilly> it would cost an arm and a leg to develop GNUe without a computer even if only used for communication via IRC
<jbailey> chillywilly: If you didn't have a computer, would you still care? =)
<chillywilly> yes
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<jcater> argh!!!!!
<jcater> I strongly dislike cygwin's setup
<chillywilly> eh?
<chillywilly> what's so bad about cygwin?
<jcater> um
<jcater> third time I've had to restart it
<jcater> (after going for 2-3 hrs)
<chillywilly> what sorta connection?
<jcater> dedicated DSL
<chillywilly> why would it take 3 hours over DSL?
<chillywilly> it only took 1 hour to install via modem
<chillywilly> for me
<jcater> well, guess I'm just 'flicted
<chillywilly> with masta's disease no dount
<chillywilly> doubt
<chillywilly> http://www.gnome.org/applist/view.php3?name=Goats&prevpage=listrecent.php3&entrylimit=20
<dneighbo> im 'flicted too
<dneighbo> i am sitting on oc3
<dneighbo> and it took me 5 days to install
<jcater> :)
<dneighbo> as i had to start and stop
<dneighbo> start and stop
<jcater> I can download ISO's in a few hours
<dneighbo> about 100 times
<dneighbo> as damn thing could never 'finish'
<jcater> but not this in 6 hrs :)
<chillywilly> plz, I dun wanna hear it until I experience it I will just say you are a bunch of whiners :P
<dneighbo> im a whinner i admit it
Action: jbailey is away: fleeing the building.
<dneighbo> anyone here do case modding?
<dneighbo> or get mame working?
<dneighbo> ximian learns quality control:
<dneighbo> Do you guys remember this:
<dneighbo> "All of the Evolution user-visible strings will be frozen by
<dneighbo> Monday October 21st 12:00pm UTC"?
<dneighbo> I still can see new/modified strings every day...
<dneighbo> from their mail list :)
<ToyMan> how do you get on the mail list?
<ToyMan> i tried the instructions from their site with no response
<ToyMan> the bsd version of evolution just limps along..
<ToyMan> no contacts, appointments, tasks...
Action: jcater breaks into the hallelua chorus
<jcater> I finally got cygwin downloaded :)
<jamest> jcater: must be something wrong with you
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<chillywilly> there's something wrong with all of you
<chillywilly> that goes without saying
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<dneighbo> hi neilt
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<neilt> hello all
<jcater> later all
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<dneighbo> ah ha mdean exists
<mdean> if exists (select 1 from mdean) print 'hello'
<jcater> if (mdeam): raise DerekSurprised
<dneighbo> mdean : i havent read todo for a bit
<dneighbo> BUT we are hitting a wall on something (small wall for now)
<mdean> -wall?
<jcater> (small lead wall :)
<dneighbo> we are updating 'accounts' 'contacts' to be much more robust and FLEXIBLE
<dneighbo> but we are seeing a GREAT value in DCL as a communication tool to customers
<dneighbo> as well as a billing tool
<dneighbo> and todo tool
<mdean> yes
<dneighbo> the todo tool works fine
<mdean> so are we
<dneighbo> but the communication tool is flawed
<dneighbo> if the accounts dont have same products
<mdean> what tool? ;-)
<mdean> I'm working on getting this all together for work, so it is coming
<dneighbo> it should be fairly easy to implement who can view what
<dneighbo> by product
<dneighbo> but then the next step becomes billing (or services)
<dneighbo> example
<dneighbo> i have customer
<dneighbo> foo with products x and y
<dneighbo> and customer 
<dneighbo> bar with products a and b
<mdean> choir ;-)
<dneighbo> i want foo to only see stuff for x and y and bar with a and b
<dneighbo> BUT the next item is services
<dneighbo> say my company does
<dneighbo> network installs
<dneighbo> programming
<dneighbo> support
<dneighbo> etc
<dneighbo> and bills at different rates for each
<dneighbo> i might be working for foo on product x doing db programming sometimes and support other times
<dneighbo> at which point products and services need to be 'separate'
<dneighbo> i had been cool with only being one and just changing the label
<dneighbo> but that was because i didnt see dcl as a communications tool
<mdean> your use of services sounds like it could be an action
<dneighbo> i.e. the customer would never see dcl
<dneighbo> mdean: thats very possible
<dneighbo> or billing type
<dneighbo> or something
<mdean> as I said, I am going to be working on this stuff (minus billing) for work, so it will come
<mdean> I am going to need to implement RBAC as well
<dneighbo> im throwing out problems, not necessarily demanding they be solved in a particular fashion :)
<chillywilly> mdean: RBAC? really?
<mdean> chillywilly: yup - better than what's in there now ;-)
<chillywilly> we were looking at that too for security in GNUe
<dneighbo> if you all would just use phpGW middleware you wouldnt have to worry about security ;)
<chillywilly> eh?
<chillywilly> why?
<dneighbo> im being smartass
<chillywilly> oh, ok
<mdean> hehe
<dneighbo> subsitute phpGW w/ dotGNU or dotNet or dotDream as you please
<chillywilly> screw you man
<chillywilly> and on that note I am going to church ;P
<chillywilly> good bye
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<jcater> roflmao
Action: dneighbo must run 
<dneighbo> well drive
<jbailey> run, dneighbo, run!
<jcater> drive carefully
<dneighbo> be back later hopefully all will be around later
<jcater> it's a mad world outside of irc
<jcater> s/outside of irc//
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<dtm> greetings all
<jcater> howdy
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<dnWork> hello
Nick change: dnWork -> derke
<jcater> hiya
Nick change: derke -> derek
<jcater> rofl
<dtm> hi guys.
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<derek> hey i just noticed
<derek> derke sounds like der key or dorky :)
<jcater> :)
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<Mr_You> re
--- Fri Oct 26 2001