sheesh --- Thu Nov 15 2001 sheesh I've only wasted the last few days trying to get the fscking jade/openjade/docbook crap to install dude, I seriously get pissed at hacing to install non-free software for a GNU projects docs days that could have been spent WRITING docs apt-get install blah onm ash jcater: i've had that same problem which is why i resorted to lyx months ago s/onm/on chillywilly: I apt-got it and apt-got couldn't do it right EITHER! how can I build the docbook docs then? magic? I honestly don't know but apt-get docbook crap was broken as of last night mmm i hope you all are developing on GNU/Linux and not windows..... Action: jcater whistles and ignores Maniac :) jcater: what are you using? at the moment slackware and debian but I will be rebooting slack into Win98 shortly and I use Win98 + RedHat at work for development cause you suck but that's out of necessity dude if I can build this docbook stuff I can then bitch slap you all? um no btw, if LyX is such a big deal, we'll HAPPILY delegate this documentation stuff to someone else as we'd rather be coding anyway :) lyx's graphics library is non-gpl I'm not writing your docs for you this is an issue the developers are aware of but do not, at this time, have the time to rectify I'll have real GEAS docs to do soon chillywilly: last I checked this is OUR project :) Maniac: because they are fucking KDE nazis that's who the original lyz authors are mathhias, et. al. lyx matthias well, my understanding is, they are working toward UI independance, to make it able to use differnt toolkits ie. kde, gnome, xyz as time/coding permit jcater: I am supposed to document code I haven't hardly even looked at? chillywilly: we aren't documenting code Maniac: yes they are but until then it is not even functional without libxforms the code is already documented chillywilly: such is the cruel reality of life jcater: I got afew warning but html docs built for the module guide ajmitch (me@203.173.237.156) left irc: Ping timeout: 181 seconds Maniac: shouldn't be the reality of GNU....use fscking texinfo then :P ajmitch (~me@p28-max7.dun.ihug.co.nz) joined #gnuenterprise. chillywilly: so GNU projects cannot use non-GNU software in any portion of their project? no, they shouldn't use non-free software libxforms would reqwuire me to add non-free section to sources.list thus I will not do it and cannot read the damn docs can use non-GNU tho sure that's not my point though chillywilly: your KDE hatred is showing, btw I know KDE is fine actually wow but then again they did use QT before it was actually free and then the original foundere goees and writes lyx with aq non-free GUI toolkit....so I have not much love for him shoudl get psu to put that in the KC, chillywilly admitting KDE is fine ;) cool it's now my birthday happy birthday jcater do y'all know what I want for my birthday??? what? I want chillywilly to get a clue!!!! happy bday rofl oh, that and Kahn's Codebreaker's book jcater: screw you....go use lyx Action: ajmitch wonders if he can compile geas before the end of the year no madlocke? :-( ajmitch: you mean the chinese year, right? jcater: ummm death to LyX grrrrrr lyx rocks ;) dude as soon as some GNUtastic individual comes up with a GNUified Lyx i will stop using it why do I need moderator approval to post to the list? hmm cos somebody doesn't like you? they must've seen your language/temper in the main channel oh damnit wrong email hehe fuck watch it ra3vat (ds@195.239.64.87) left irc: Ping timeout: 181 seconds see you scared ra3vat off no, I DOS'd his computer well he's on a russian phone connection what did you do, ping it once? so it was easy :) howdy well? it only took 1.5 hours of waiting in line jcater: dude, go eat an damn krispy kreme and go to bed jamest: don't say it jamest: just the man I wanna bitch at apt-get lyx <----- wonder why that didnt work..... but I gots me an Xbox M$ is so cool sigh here we go err, cue oooo jamest XBox uses DirectX! all the good gaming platforms do :) jamest: instaling LyX is not good for my soul jamest: can you get me one? but it doesn't require DirectX chillywilly: i don't know what you did, but the lyx site is down ajmitch: they had some left you seriously have an Xbox? yip it's in my lap directx rocks, can't we use it? jamest: this is the M$ game box? i just came home and was typing while i unrap it yup chillywilly: yip, ms's game console jamest: umm why do you have one? jamest: you bought it? they bought the rights to Shenmue II, and thus own'd my arse chillywilly: I tried to just take it but they insisted I pay for it ok, jamest has sold out... jamest: first lyx, then kde, now this!! hell yes he has dude, after spending the last two weeks as GNUe's bitch trying to get this release ready don;t even say it i have a little credit because that is just unacceptable enough for an xboxc :) nope not the way I see it :) hmm who in here asked for chillywilly's opinion? raise your hands jcater: who asked for yours? Action: jcater peers thru his monitor jcater: next I'll be setting up my pasport account and riding the .NET that figures jamest: yeah, to play shemnu chillywilly: jamest is anathema anyway, I've got to go see if this thing will work with my 20yr old tcv tv :) jamest: i tried setting up passport but it said i had to upgrade from IE3.0 l8r guys l8r get SOME rest :) Action: chillywilly needs to go find the real GNU Enterprise this one has been bought Action: Maniac goes to play with his python Maniac: aren't we sure of ourself? lol jcater: nice way to read that :) dtm (dtm@m206-221.dsl.tsoft.com) got netsplit. oh, DOS'd him too /msg Maniac do that to chillywilly nite all ok i'm going to read my python book better? jcater (jason@HubA-mcr-24-165-193-222.midsouth.rr.com) left irc: "bedtime" Action: Maniac is back (gone 43:11:19) really? fucking wuss he's lucky he left or? well, it's been fun night all; bye dtm (~dtm@m206-221.dsl.tsoft.com) returned to #gnuenterprise. Nick change: Maniac -> Maniac-{z} isn't it funny how ppl wanna ignore you when they know you are speaking the truth? yet they can't stand to hear it reinhard (~rm@62.47.44.7) joined #gnuenterprise. hi reinhard dtm (dtm@m206-221.dsl.tsoft.com) got netsplit. morning dtm (~dtm@m206-221.dsl.tsoft.com) returned to #gnuenterprise. reinhard: dude, should somone using GNU project software be required to install non-free software in order to read and edit the documentation? i.e., install LyX which require non-free xforms in order to read the and edit the forms documentation am I craxy for thinking this is shitty? nope i think having to use lyx is wrong for a GNU project Action: reinhard thinks that the only valid documentation format for a gnu project is texinfo but i 've had this discussion before and i lost well I agree with you I will NOT install lyx and make vrms unhappy cool.. this savannah software is a good thing oh sorry there's another valid documentation format i forgot text/plain :) "We've finished our beer, it's time to win our freedom. :) " thats cool heh hmm, i still have a savannah account... maybe we should move to SF since it is more feature filled than savannah and hell it's easier to use they want you to sign over all your rights exactly so the answer is no heh well, no it is more convienient that way just like lyx is dammit we shoudl switch to windows for development yeah it's much easier ;) noooo we should target the Xbox sigh: You're not a member of any public projects get gnue running on the Xbox on savannah I want to run GNUe on my apple airport Mr_You: xbox is made by M$ i want gnue to run on my gnu/hurd box chillywilly since when? ;-)) well I wasn't sure you were getting my sarcasm our minimum server configuration will be a 486DX w/ 16MB of RAM and a 1GB HD Mr_You: i have a p100 w/ 16mb ram and 1gb is used for gnu/hurd ;) yeah, it would be very minimal install heh hehe it's a little slow ;) am trying to compile geas now is texinfo hard to learn? is it any worse than docbook? there can be worse? hell I had to read the whole damn book to use it (docbook) woo, i'll see if this compile actually gets off the ground I bet if I were to go through th trouble of converting all the docs and making templates for various types of docs they stll would use lyx yep reinhard: we need to be the txinfo police hmmm.. we'll need a web cvs interface for webware ;-) ehh people will still want php module installed regardless heh Mr_You: sorry? huh? i am gonna be using webware a fair bit this summer (need it to do some websites), so i will be able to learn it :) what web cvs interface for webware? oh I was just dreamin.. ok you mean a webcvs thing written with webware? yeah I'd like to get madlockes code so I can start playing with GNUe and web integration very soon yeah hmm, we need to put hot coals under madlocke... like a sf port to webware ;-) (why not?) ;-) well, chillywilly & i are already planning a phpnuke-like forum using webware yeah.. will bug jamest about madlocke tommorow or so well, i am, i guess; ) yeah cool we hope to make it a GNU project I would like to begin work on a GNUe CMS app yea, we thought that gnue web forms and geas would make a nice base for it mmm, this could be useful too bad I cannot read the damn forms tech reference without being a non-free whore bitch moan bitch moan (yes I am not gonna let it go) or by using klyx which is old as dirt yeah apparantly it was a stright port from kde 1.1.2, unmaintained apart from that and you get bugs like massive fonts 1.1.2? yes it doesn't worj with the newer kde? yeah, it does k but it was ported from old kde, no changes apart from porting dammit, i can't compile stuff probably half the libs, etc are antique we should just use friggin texinfo yes texinfo is GNU standard, right? yes alexey (alex@195.151.214.33) joined #gnuenterprise. cvs update: cannot read entries file: Input/output error [01:33] Last message repeated 1 time(s). cvs update: cannot rewrite CVS/Entries.Backup: Read-only file system cvs [update aborted]: cannot open CVS/Entries.Log: Read-only file system wth? ouch where you trying to update on? those errors are on your local machine, i think something is read only but i could be wrong ;) ok, I sjould code for bit before going to bed Action: chillywilly goes off to get some pepsi Action: Mr_You unmounts and fscks one HD has I/O problems.. not sure if its the cable tho both HDs are I guess had to force an fsck on reboot bleah ouch good thing only the deb mirror is on the < 60GB ;-) I've had problems with these Seagates before.. I seriously hope its not a HD problem again but something with the machine/cable cause these are new HDs old machine ah those lovely seagates just toss the fscker out the window :P yeah, one seems to be working fine for a while now I dunno, but this cable might be going bad, cause they both failed to show up til I double checked cables.. the connections that is yuck sigh oh well, see where this is gonna go uggh dtm (dtm@m206-221.dsl.tsoft.com) got netsplit. mdean (mdean@mkc-65-28-73-63.kc.rr.com) got netsplit. alexey (alex@195.151.214.33) got netsplit. reinhard (rm@62.47.44.7) got netsplit. nickr (nick@e-172-IP26.empnet.net) got netsplit. Mr_You (rouzer@mankind.boredom.org) got netsplit. Maniac-{z} (darryl@h24-82-132-209.wp.shawcable.net) got netsplit. jamest (~jamest@fh-dialup-201085.flinthills.com) left #gnuenterprise. Maniac-{z} (darryl@h24-82-132-209.wp.shawcable.net) returned to #gnuenterprise. nickr (nick@e-172-IP26.empnet.net) returned to #gnuenterprise. Mr_You (rouzer@mankind.boredom.org) returned to #gnuenterprise. reinhard (~rm@62.47.44.7) returned to #gnuenterprise. alexey (alex@195.151.214.33) returned to #gnuenterprise. dtm (~dtm@m206-221.dsl.tsoft.com) returned to #gnuenterprise. mdean (~mdean@mkc-65-28-73-63.kc.rr.com) returned to #gnuenterprise. derek (derek@cpe-24-221-112-50.az.sprintbbd.net) left irc: Ping timeout: 181 seconds derek (~derek@cpe-24-221-112-50.az.sprintbbd.net) joined #gnuenterprise. chillywilly (danielb@d126.as14.nwbl0.wi.voyager.net) left irc: Remote closed the connection sacha (~sacha@203.190.196.12) joined #gnuenterprise. Hi reinhard hi sacha I mentioned once, that I will do a masters in cs next year. I will do it in relation with ebXML and maybe your gnue. In February 2002 I will go back to Liechtenstein (from Australia). Is it possible to meet you then? previous message is for reinhard :) sacha: sure if you don't meet me in irc to fix an appointment you can write a mail to reinhard@gnue.org reinhard: cool. I guess that will be around 10th February. OK. I write down your email. ta I am looking forward to next year. I will go to Sweden to meet a guy from www.openebxml.org as well. I am really looking forward to :) maybe a short comment: the ebXML standard wants to create a global electronic marketplace. With ebXML companies have the possibility to define (and re-use) business process including their document exchanges. Defined is also the structure of the documents within a "business transaction". The content could come from a ERP system. :) roflmao on the telephone just somebody said to me "thank you mr. bytewise" alexey (alex@195.151.214.33) got netsplit. reinhard (rm@62.47.44.7) got netsplit. nickr (nick@e-172-IP26.empnet.net) got netsplit. 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Isomer_ (dahoose@210-86-56-131.jetstart.xtra.co.nz) returned to #gnuenterprise. ajmitch (~me@203.173.236.118) returned to #gnuenterprise. nickr (nick@e-172-IP26.empnet.net) returned to #gnuenterprise. Mr_You (rouzer@mankind.boredom.org) returned to #gnuenterprise. dtm (dtm@m206-221.dsl.tsoft.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 181 seconds sacha (~sacha@203.190.196.242) left #gnuenterprise ("Client Exiting"). ToyMan (~stuq@c5300-2-ip42.albany.thebiz.net) joined #gnuenterprise. jamest (~jamest@129.130.6.20) joined #gnuenterprise. ToyMan (~stuq@c5300-2-ip42.albany.thebiz.net) left #gnuenterprise ("Client Exiting"). Isomer_ (dahoose@210-86-56-131.jetstart.xtra.co.nz) left irc: Ping timeout: 182 seconds Isomer_ (dahoose@210-86-56-131.jetstart.xtra.co.nz) joined #gnuenterprise. chillywilly (~danielb@d86.as28.nwbl0.wi.voyager.net) joined #gnuenterprise. ToyMan (~stuq@c5300-2-ip42.albany.thebiz.net) joined #gnuenterprise. alexey (~alexey@195.151.214.34) joined #gnuenterprise. ra3vat (ds@195.239.66.32) joined #gnuenterprise. hi all hello are hello ra3vat hello hello reinhard, jamest hi ra3vat hello daniel Nick change: Maniac-{z} -> Maniac Nick change: dres_ -> dres jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) joined #gnuenterprise. 'sup ack plz make it go away \kick chillywilly this the no AI channel darn I can't make it go away \troutslap jcater mornin jcater mornin Maniac \troutslap Maniac any html dudes here? anybody can tell me if there is something like an #include in raw html? i have several pages and i want a part of the page look the same for all pages reinhard: only if your server supports Server Side Includes but those are usually considered security risks um then i guess they don't support it no other chance? do i have to enter the header and that stuff into every single document page? chillywilly: what the fuck were you thinking sending an email like that to our public list??? what the fuck were you thinkin making me have to install non-free software? no on e made you install crap I still cannot read the forms tech reference sigh! well that's what I would have to do in order to read it it was in the last tarball release in text format! and IIRC html! install libxform0.88 and on the web in HTML! and if I wanna change something? I mean are all GNUe sources gonna be in friggin lyx? vi works real good on .lyx files oh that is crap um and docbook has a better editor! no more so than docbook lyx uses it's own little commands not like i can just look th shit up we shouls use texinfo then if docbook is such a hassle i wrote all the fucking docs in texinfo and that wasn't good enough so it was docbook why would it not be good enough? which is great if you can build the tools however i can't and it's not from lack of trying nor can I what was wrong with texinfo? don't ask me as I don't know people wanted docbook we did docbook and the docs went from being a few large files you can go texinfo->docbook to lots and lots of files and a fuckload of utilities that you can build on any system as long as it's some sub-derivative of GNU/Linux look I am not tryint to be a jerk I just cannot stand the fact of how contradictory it is to have to use lyx when I cannot get a free gui for it yet...it sucks it really comes down to this if people want docbook that is fine with me and what if you wanna hack docs on the serve? fuck docbook I want texinfo :P however the people that are willing to put the effort into the user_guide and tech_ref (jcater and myself) fuck it all... read the source code! are sick of fighting docbook so it's either docbook and no docs from us yes, so dump it then it is not worth it...but lyx has issues for others too yes it does we don't have a good solution but we're trying to get docs made psu: I don't think this discussion should be in the KC ToyMan (~stuq@c5300-2-ip42.albany.thebiz.net) left #gnuenterprise ("Client Exiting"). how about plain ol' text then for now until you decide to format it :P I casn read that wihout being installing evil software s/being// Nick change: reinhard -> rm-away ToyMan (~stuq@216.238.225.42) joined #gnuenterprise. dneighbo (dneighbo@mail.libertydistribution.com) joined #gnuenterprise. Nick change: Maniac -> Maniac-yawa jamest: I can figure your Xbox pruchase if you install GNU/Linux on it :P somebody_ (darryl@h24-82-132-209.wp.shawcable.net) joined #gnuenterprise. Maniac-yawa (darryl@h24-82-132-209.wp.shawcable.net) left irc: Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) from a spam email We are running out of our earths most precious resourse---WATER. tell me again how we are running out of water? lol the friggin planet is 2/3 water that's hilarious and to those saying oceans dont count um, dneighbo: fresh water is a BIG prob guess they have never heard of desalination? expensive and not doable in many areas dneighbo: yes, ToyMan is right toyman expensive perhaps, but far from saying we dont have water mind you im not saying go and waste water don't have / can't afford <- same thing the main aquafir (sp?) in the west, the ogoala ##$%^@#%$% (whatever) is running dry which means the price of all the agri that comes from there will go up or the agri will go away i dont think we will have issues with water, (i.e. i think other problems will plague us first) on a global scale yeah like LyX usage :) maybe not. It's a big issue in a lot of places heh yes i think to certain areas and certain industries water sources are an isse we had htis discussion on oil for example if oil got outrageously expensive because we were running low we would cope as long as there are whales to be slaughtered we will have oil right? i.e. people wouldnt be using good old gas guzzling SUV's etc and technically people lived for a long ass time w/o need for 'electricity' sorry not that kinda oil etc i think water shortages would be similar you cannot live without water i think people would adjust,but anyhow this is the gnue channel you will die chillywilly this is true but industries that 'hog' water or 'regions' that hog water would adapt that's the terrorists next move for example, i wouldnt have grass in arizona cutt off the fresh water supply if water was expensive here and it SHOULD be expensive here as we are in the friggin desert but its not :) you water hog you :P yes i am you have grass?!? i make up for it in energy consumption though im a cheap bastard and electricity is expensive here :) which is funny water == we make none, have none == cheap electricity == two huge power plants + nuclear power plant == expensive go figure i think with electricity the kicker is that california is such a hog yea that they can sell so much there at 3x what they to us neilt (~neilt@dialup-209.244.143.94.Dial1.Providence1.Level3.net) joined #gnuenterprise. damn CA our price reflects that crap i forgot we have hoover dam making electricity too so 4 major plants in fact i think we supply more energy to calif / nevada than they do themselves dneighbo: fwiw 50% of wars on earth of last 100 years were/are about water that makes no sense as to why your electricity is expansive then expensive neilt: you ok with my mail? rm-away: really? yes chillywilly: if you look close enough, yes neilt: cool just sent a response, but I am ok anyway chillywilly: for example the wars in israel the main points about golan etc are who controls the water resources of the area anyway i'm now really away :) neilt (neilt@dialup-209.244.143.94.Dial1.Providence1.Level3.net) left irc: Client Quit rm-away : i disagree, i think 85% of the wars on earth have been about religion :) well actually have be about power, but fought in the name of some religion :) dneighbo: not on religion dneighbo: on power dneighbo: water == power just like oil == power ToyMan (~stuq@216.238.225.42) left #gnuenterprise ("Client Exiting"). ToyMan (~stuq@c5300-2-ip42.albany.thebiz.net) joined #gnuenterprise. Mr_You (rouzer@mankind.boredom.org) left irc: Ping timeout: 181 seconds zzzz (~zzzz@user-112ulgk.biz.mindspring.com) joined #gnuenterprise. hello alexey (~alexey@195.151.214.34) left #gnuenterprise ("Client Exiting"). zzzz (zzzz@user-112ulgk.biz.mindspring.com) left irc: "Client Exiting" Nick change: jcater -> jcLunch ra3vat (ds@195.239.66.32) left irc: Ping timeout: 181 seconds ToyMan (~stuq@c5300-2-ip42.albany.thebiz.net) left #gnuenterprise ("Client Exiting"). chalu (~chalu@user-112ulgk.biz.mindspring.com) joined #gnuenterprise. hi [11:46] Last message repeated 1 time(s). Nick change: rm-away -> reinhard ToyMan (~stuq@c5300-2-ip42.albany.thebiz.net) joined #gnuenterprise. chalu (chalu@user-112ulgk.biz.mindspring.com) left irc: Remote closed the connection reinhard (rm@62.47.44.7) left irc: Ping timeout: 181 seconds reinhard (~rm@62.47.44.7) joined #gnuenterprise. l8r jamest (jamest@129.130.6.20) left irc: "[x]chat" reinhard (rm@62.47.44.7) left irc: Ping timeout: 184 seconds reinhard (~rm@N801P007.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. reinhard (rm@N801P007.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: Ping timeout: 183 seconds reinhard (~rm@62.47.44.7) joined #gnuenterprise. reinhard (rm@62.47.44.7) left irc: Ping timeout: 181 seconds reinhard (~rm@62.47.44.7) joined #gnuenterprise. duh ToyMan (~stuq@c5300-2-ip42.albany.thebiz.net) left #gnuenterprise ("Client Exiting"). its a netspliting world out today eh Nick change: jcLunch -> jcater um the last 3 reconnects were on my side jcater (jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) left irc: "rebooting" jcater (~jason@65.105.10.202) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater can you please respond to the fellow on the list asking for help i woudl but am actually busy for a bit I'll try and dont have newest cvs and i know the path location stuff changed because of windows installs for gnue.conf but I know nothing of GEAS i think he is fine on geas as he says it starts no errors and created the tables which is what a functioning one does so i think he is good to go there i will respond as well but if you can address the forms/designer/etc installs and get his images etc working i will address the other areas ok we really need a good and simple webpage which basically says yes i started to look at phpnuke "GNUe is not yet there, we have only parts of it" and i think we can make it work we get so many mails lately saying things like "i downloaded gnue, so where can i enter my invoices now?" :) as there is some of its DEFAULT stuff that hogs space and hides the important links lower i.e. i think we can still have the news and such just need to make it easier to find things and probably make the news section smaller and start lower and have a blurb above where news is now that states links to common things like status pages how to install dneighbo: just an idea, please don't flame me: and HOW to HELP what about a rather static page for an overview of the project thats what gnu.org is for its just not been maintained im not against static for the most part the idea was dynamic would make it easier to let OTHERS maintain as it takes 8 months to get a gnu account so if fred says i'll help maintain the website you either end up mailing patches around or you wait 8 months to get him an account which is NOT ideal however the current way isnt working famously either :) i had hoped to get some more things going as well reinhard (rm@62.47.44.7) left irc: Ping timeout: 184 seconds and will do so with install of dcl etc but i dont want to put much time into it, so any volunteers ******************************** Can I have people test a new Windows installer binary at http://www.gnuenterprise.org/~jcater/prerelease Let me know of any problems reinhard (~rm@62.47.44.7) joined #gnuenterprise. Also, this version supports ODBC! ******************************** what about a rather static page for an overview of the project and a static pages each for the several parts of the architecture (forms, reports...) those static pages could be on www.gnu.org/projects/gnue and on the top of www.gnuenterprise.org we have something like "if you want to know what gnue is actually, please look _here_ " so no matter if i come from gnu side or from gnuenterprise.org i always are directed to the same information -- is what i wrote while being disconnected :) http://freespace.virgin.net/andrew.harrison4/ reinhard that is fine, but really tehre is a dynamic page for each of those already just no one has maintained it so static or dynamic i think is not the point we need someone to MAINTAIN the website that is the REAL problem :) IMHO as we had SAME issues when we only had gnu.org site it was grossly outdated the new site was supposed to encourage people to help update it hasnt done that and has made things harder to find (sigh) anyone testing those prereleases for me???? i think with a little work we could make it easier to find and hopefully encourage others to help maintain jcater: what prerequisites do i need? Windows i will test it lol let me get actuals imported here first jcater: what else? reinhard: it's fully self-contained python etc? it supports ODBC, PostgreSQL, and MySQL out of the box reinhard: nope this is it pretty nifty, eh? nope = nope you don't need it it's contained or nope = nope it's not contained? the former kewl all you need is this executable but i need a db right? well ok, I give you that :) yes, you need a database backend :) k well, actually not necessarily any forms that run w/o database? our helloworld2.gfd file runs w/o database k plus designer can design without databases can you give me url again? (i think i was disconnected at that time) already found it reinhard (rm@62.47.44.7) left irc: Ping timeout: 181 seconds reinhard (~rm@N801P007.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. the Start menu folder should be named "GNU Enterprise", not "GNUe" IMHO ah yes and agree it didn't tell me to reboot windows after installation this can't be correct j/k the README.txt file contains a reference to INSTALL.win32 oh sorry seems that README.txt is not valid for me anyway um seriously i am impressed this is near unbelievable i have been away from forms too long the installer looks great only thing maybe in the start menu a item is created for gnue forms which issues an error because no form is given ping is this installer python specific or can we use it for c programs (geas) too? (once they run under windows) ajmitch (me@203.173.236.118) left irc: Ping timeout: 181 seconds reinhard: sorry, back now it's Inno setup a generic free installer (nothing python about it) also, we are aware of the Icon issue I think we're gonna do a Welcome form that is executed by default if someone selects GNUe Forms from the Start menu is this configurable? reinhard (rm@N801P007.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: Ping timeout: 182 seconds what do you mean? reinhard (~rm@N801P007.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. well, if you can configure which form is displayed then you can make it load the "opening" form of your application In that respect, all you have to do is create a shortcut pointing to your GFD file yeah I know and clicking that will automatically open that form I just thought it might be a nice touch to make the opening form customizable :) shrug Feeping Creaturisms! :) Error: Error while communicating with datasource Error: parser: parse error near or at "::" for samples/geas/ uh crap i think i should try another form sorry i didn't say anything :) how can i populate a db for usage with a specific form? Action: reinhard doesn't believe his eyes what are you not believing? um at first sight i would say "hey jcater has reimplemented delphi" :) joy, exchange down for 4 hours now and no ETA and I can NOT open outlook w/o exchange connection Action: jcater has never used delphi and i have critical file that is in email so i cant get work done isnt this lovely jcater: this stuff is so great i can't even find words for it btw: reinhard its not delphi (YET) dneighbo: was just teasing you :) im working on getting him to re do the UI slightly so it will be a delphi/vb clone wrt to layout as i think both those company sunk millions in UI testing and since both are similar probably pretty effective, but it still kicks butt :) and not bad for all the cash we have dumped into jcater i mean i think he has spent more on gnue than we have paid him :) how do i add a new control to a form? Right-click on the grid area btw i can't close a property editor window once it popped up PrettySoon(tm) we will have icons that you click to create objects yep block1->new->label but i see nothing sigh see, that's why we put these out for ppl to test :) seva_ (~seva@212.109.63.21) joined #gnuenterprise. Nick change: seva_ -> sevik_ sevik_ (seva@212.109.63.21) left irc: Client Quit i must say this is impressing sevik_ (~seva@212.109.63.21) joined #gnuenterprise. Nick change: somebody_ -> Maniac Maniac (darryl@h24-82-132-209.wp.shawcable.net) left irc: "Client Exiting" anybody knows how to supress this message? ajmitch (~me@p17-max2.dun.ihug.co.nz) joined #gnuenterprise. Warning: Remote host denied X11 forwarding, perhaps xauth program could not be run on the server side. ssh -X or ssh -x when i use ssh implicitely? (e.g. in cvs) depending on version (ssh1/ssh2) unsetenv DISPLAY :)) or use some wrapper around ssh and set CVSRSH to it i can't do that when i am working in xterm, can i? unset DISPLAY i mean CVS_RSH you can, but you cant start new windows from this xterm i made a wrapper sevik_: thanks a lot np :)) another helpfull thing - check for SUDO_USER and using it in -l to ssh :)) so you can sudo cvs commit/sudo cvs update/etc why should i want that? i use cvs for some configs :)) ah which owned by root usually :)) ok understand any word on the web ware code from madlocke? what exactly was madlocke looking at doing? chillywilly its coming webcode? webware ? webware.sf.net webware bye chillywilly (danielb@d86.as28.nwbl0.wi.voyager.net) left irc: what is it with you guys and python? nickr: python rocks :) you a perl weenie? nickr: speed and managability I like perl, but I don't think its a good language for doing big things in speed=speed of deployment I'm more into objective C although I'm finding it very tedious lately sevik_ (seva@212.109.63.21) left irc: "My damn controlling terminal disappeared!" maybe gonna get into smalltalk instead nickr : python == twice the oop + .5 * effort Still, I think smalltalk is forme sevik (~seva@domino-web.kiev.ua) joined #gnuenterprise. w [15:05] Last message repeated 1 time(s). psu (psu@manorcon.demon.co.uk) joined #gnuenterprise. Mr_You (rouzer@208.184.52.150) joined #gnuenterprise. re hi Mr_You hi Mr_You, psu ToyMan_ (~Stuart@c5300-3-ip203.albany.thebiz.net) joined #gnuenterprise. nite all reinhard (rm@N801P007.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: "Omnis enim res, quae dando non deficit, dum habetur et non datur, nondum habetur, quomodo habenda est. -- Aurelius Augustinus" I like the comment on the gnue front page from zllsy if these products keep you from implementing your business plans, something is gravely wrong. " of course, it may be the business plan itself that is wrong There's got to be some sort of sensible middle ground between the Oracle/Ellison "no customisations" approach (a.k.a. "Have it your way with Burger King") s/your/our s/Burger King/SAP and the sort of stuff you get "the product must do X, because we've always done it that way" I suppose it's inevitable that my freedom as a hypothetical GNUe user to add in my own business processes that give me competative advantedge is also someone else's freedom to re-write GNUe to conform to out-of-date business practices I suppose a GNUe consultant will have to be more honest in that the answer to the question "Can the s/w be made to do X" is always "Yes" but the correct answer may be "Yes, but why do you want to?" lol how true #include chicken-sexing.py or other hypothetical business process but why would you want chickens, when you can have GOATS! uh oh... Maniac (darryl@h24-82-132-209.wp.shawcable.net) joined #gnuenterprise. Maniac (darryl@h24-82-132-209.wp.shawcable.net) left irc: Client Quit never mind goats I was reading a linux mag on the bus to work today Maniac (darryl@h24-82-132-209.wp.shawcable.net) joined #gnuenterprise. & got a sudden uncontrollable urge to get a cuddly penguin they look so cute... lol I think our mascot should be a MULE myself our=GNUe as it gets no respect but is one hell of a workhorse but is hardworking but goats are fine, too :) and kicks out if aggrevated ? i get called an ass enough, no need to tag it on a tshirt i might wish to wear :) rofl jcater: any particular's you wish me to test with your prerelease? goats eat anything if possible, odbc GNue works with any d/b i downloaded and was going to try to build a form for front in co-incidence? I think I should be told and then test db2 odbc :) or at any rate, told off dneighbo: designer/win32 is having "issues" that I'm working on http://www.linuxemporium.co.uk/images/peng03.jpg plus i already ordered jamest and jcater thier 'bells' if you add an object, it never shows up i.e the bells that go around the 'goats' neck jcater: yeah would be good to fix that :) dood was gonna suggest open in designer and its already there this install ROCKS :) i might start using the windows version :) j/k testinmg with odbc do you use the datasource name wehre it says service? yes derek (derek@cpe-24-221-112-50.az.sprintbbd.net) left irc: Ping timeout: 182 seconds jcater big troubles little china a. i think reinhard pointed out no CLOSE/MINIMIZE on property editor b. i get serious errors when trying to edit a form in designer basically i picked up a sample form and was going to connect it to my db i was able to set teh datasource to a connection and a table then set the blocks to the datasource derek (~derek@cpe-24-221-112-50.az.sprintbbd.net) joined #gnuenterprise. but if i try to change the FIELD property of a widget i get an error hi derek ;) an error? dneighbo_ (dneighbo@mail.libertydistribution.com) joined #gnuenterprise. ok now i can paste the message DB000: AttributeError: CharCellEditor instance has no attribute '_tc' DB000: Traceback (most recent call last): DB000: File "C:\PYTHON21\gnue\designer\PropertyEditor.py", line 228, in Starti ngKey bbl psu (psu@manorcon.demon.co.uk) left irc: "[=V97=] Leaving" sigh ok odbc seems to barf let me get the errors btw: tab doesnt work on the login box :) i.e. to tab from username: to password: chillywilly (~danielb@d102.as13.nwbl0.wi.voyager.net) joined #gnuenterprise. hmmm maybe i should do a new form hey dneighbo_ kick tail it works jason odbc on windows using postgres backend works rock! I tested against MS Access 2000 when my machine with db2 on it gets free i will test odbc windows against db2 :) ToyMan_ fwiw i tested using your membership table which i converted long ago to postgres :) if thats any consulation :) consolation? jcater i did find that before release we should remove all sample forms :) bah, spelling is for english majors as i was going off an old one which when i looked had serious issues :) ok TAB issue on login box is fixed we should include 1. non db form that shows some stuff and 2. a db form that we provide a script for im half tempted to say for 0.1.0 just the single one will be ok and 0.1.1 can include the new stuff ? AS one thing i want to do is make it use mdeans stuff with xslt but i dont want to hold up the train i.e. on teh sampel that uses db aware we will need to provide a 'create script' wanting to use the db tool mdean made for dcl :) so we do one xml file and a few 'transformation' files well i guess in the distro we would just ship with diff sql files so maybe we can do as part of 0.1.0 Action: dneighbo_ pulls head out butt how's the view? Action: dneighbo_ must go babysit some problem programs brb jcater: dark, but warm funky smell smell like 2 day old pizza? no 2 day old pizza smells good my butt doesnt Action: dneighbo_ tries to relay the odor to jcater ..... it smells like a box of krispy kreme's AN EMPTY BOX in other words its painful :) lol I thought that smell was all the dead trout laying around rofl wait till the crappies start to rot Action: dneighbo_ wonders what other connections he can test here oh i have mysql installed if i can remeber how to use it :) oh good Action: chillywilly trout whipe the lot of them we haven't tested the win32 mysql driver yet whips chillywilly: stfu ? shut the fsck up :D fuck off kids, keep it clean jcater: do you have a problem with me? I have no problems with anyone why do you ask? then take your own advice trout whipping is a joke you know haha funny funny ok mysql is installed and i have an odbc driver now if i can configure the darned thing :) crap its not REALLY installed sigh downloading now crapity crap crap jbailey (~jbailey@Sherbrooke-HSE-ppp3604268.sympatico.ca) joined #gnuenterprise. ajmitch (me@p17-max2.dun.ihug.co.nz) left irc: Ping timeout: 181 seconds anyone know if there's an emacs command to search for a string in all open buffers? Ctrl + Backslash?? lemme see rm -rf pffft crap have set to only allow localhost dont know how to shut that off in mysql rm -rf /bin/mysqld :P sigh I feel old :( you are old sheesh my wife wants me to cook dinner on my birthday :( well that is crap ToyMan_ (Stuart@c5300-3-ip203.albany.thebiz.net) left irc: Ping timeout: 181 seconds ok mysql tested whooo hooo jcater if i liked windows i might be impressed :) ok if enough room then no sweat :) oops wrong channel darn bitchx jason please note 04:00:17 PM: There were memory leaks. 04:00:17 PM: ----- Memory dump ----- 04:00:17 PM: wxBitmap at $16D9778, size 12 04:00:17 PM: wxTimer at $16DA848, size 32 04:00:17 PM: [17:03] Last message repeated 1 time(s). 04:00:17 PM: ----- Memory statistics ----- 04:00:17 PM: 1 objects of class wxTimer, total size 32 04:00:17 PM: 1 objects of class wxBitmap, total size 12 04:00:17 PM: 04:00:17 PM: Number of object items: 2 04:00:17 PM: Number of non-object items: 0 04:00:17 PM: Total allocated size: 44 04:00:17 PM: [17:03] Last message repeated 1 time(s). just an FYI yes, that's standard fare with our 0.1.0 released :( ok i want to test on db2 darn it but have jobs running in background so will have to wait until tomorrow :( I dunno if I'll be on tonight :( thats ok I'm taking my birthday evening off :) happy brithday jcater :) brithday even damnit happy bidet, jcater I can't type it thanks how old are you now? 0x36 hex? gah happy bday wow old enough to spout hex off top of head thats pretty old lol thanks although that isn't my real age :) 0x18 would be my real age :) or octal 030 in octal wow that was redundant hopefully you dont cruise before i get to test db2 Action: dneighbo_ is trying to rush test it now :) in oracle must you do table namespacing? like here table names are somenamespace.tablename im worried the . might hose thigns ups um actually, that will hose our combo boxes but I think that's all I want to change the way combos are handled neilt (~neilt@209.244.139.169) joined #gnuenterprise. ok access 97 odbc works too so mysql pgsql msaccess97 verified now for looking at db2 :) rock! KICK ASSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! it works just queried up about 60,000 records w/ db Action: dneighbo_ is doing happy dance dude! and it didn't crash?? gnuef connects to mainframe db2 no BUT it doesnt display cursor right i.e. it says 1/1 then if you hit next it says 2/2 etc :) yeah the reason being i assume this is normal w/ odbc as i have seen it happen before is odbc doesn't tell you the number of queries returned and we don't want to load all 60,000 just to get the count :) but we do workarounds as we have time actually i LIED just haven't had time for odbc yet its only 31612 records this is SERIOUSLY cool arrrrrrrghhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Action: chillywilly beats head into desk this sucks sucks [17:46] Last message repeated 2 time(s). neilt (neilt@209.244.139.169) left irc: sucks?? jcater you realize if you didnt threaten to leave i wouldnt have tested that :) lol just wanted to make that clear :) Action: dneighbo_ is so warm and fuzzy inside i need to get linux db2 drivers working so i can test our native support yes this is SOOO huge for me here windows and db2 both separate and together i mean really huge only reason i havent pressed gnue more here is client installs were fugly now this would be EASIEST install i have to maintain :) we need text driver asap :) jamest and I actually gave up on a windows install for 0.1.0 last Friday if we had one i could use gnue right now :) we need to release monday :) regardless of state yes we do even if its not a 0.1.0 :) dneighbo_: we are by far a 0.1.0 level quality of work at least forms client is :) designer needs more polishing but, eh, we're getting there yip bbs, happy bday if i dont see you before i come back must run upstairs for a bit l err, ok Stuart (~Stuart@c5300-3-ip8.albany.thebiz.net) joined #gnuenterprise. Stuart: hello hi jcater Action: Stuart is AKA ToyMan ToyMan: hello :) left my xchat up @ work ;) nick is taken god, my unix networking learning curve is painful ajmitch (~me@p22-max3.dun.ihug.co.nz) joined #gnuenterprise. jbailey (jbailey@Sherbrooke-HSE-ppp3604268.sympatico.ca) left irc: "Client Exiting" neilt (~neilt@209.244.131.175) joined #gnuenterprise. :) Stuart you see in the log i used some of your tables (on postgres) to test out odbc driver for windows for jcater thought it might peak your interest a bit :) if designer worked better on windows i'd really start playing some working on it jcater you have account on ash that has access to anything? I have ash + root on ash why? Action: dneighbo_ needs to find jamest and get my access restated properly i want to start dcl install but dont have postgres account to create the tables cant create dcl.sourceforge.net er dcl.gnuenterprise.org etc etc etc but i dont want you spending your time doing that as i would rather see you coding up forms, designer, reports :) dneighbo_: glad you could use it :) :) it was all i had on postgres at work on test server :) Action: Mr_You loves Kung Fu movies heh. so easier than making own db for a test :) neilt (~neilt@209.244.131.175) left #gnuenterprise. jcater (jason@65.105.10.202) left irc: "nite" bye all dneighbo_ (dneighbo@mail.libertydistribution.com) left irc: "BitchX: now with 38 percent fewer calories!" chillywilly (danielb@d102.as13.nwbl0.wi.voyager.net) left irc: Remote closed the connection chillywilly (~danielb@d102.as13.nwbl0.wi.voyager.net) joined #gnuenterprise. chillywilly_ (~danielb@d102.as13.nwbl0.wi.voyager.net) joined #gnuenterprise. chillywilly_ (danielb@d102.as13.nwbl0.wi.voyager.net) left irc: Client Quit Stuart (Stuart@c5300-3-ip8.albany.thebiz.net) left irc: Ping timeout: 181 seconds dtm (~dtm@m206-221.dsl.tsoft.com) joined #gnuenterprise. hey dtm jcater (~jason@HubA-mcr-24-165-193-222.midsouth.rr.com) joined #gnuenterprise. heheh can't stay away? nope Nick change: jcater -> jcAck chillywilly (danielb@d102.as13.nwbl0.wi.voyager.net) left irc: Remote closed the connection chillywilly (~danielb@d65.as9.nwbl0.wi.voyager.net) joined #gnuenterprise. chillywilly (danielb@d65.as9.nwbl0.wi.voyager.net) left irc: Remote closed the connection alexey (alex@techkran.vladimir.ru) joined #gnuenterprise. ra3vat (~ds@195.239.64.164) joined #gnuenterprise. hi all hi ra3vat Maniac (darryl@h24-82-132-209.wp.shawcable.net) left irc: "Client Exiting" hello derek ajmitch (me@p22-max3.dun.ihug.co.nz) left irc: Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer) ajmitch (~me@p22-max3.dun.ihug.co.nz) joined #gnuenterprise. Nick change: jcAck -> jcater hmm Action: jcater looks his monitor jamest: you under there? Action: jcater looks under his mouse jamest: you under there? hmm, now where could jamest be? hiding from you --- Fri Nov 16 2001