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<BigJimDwyer> How is GNUe doing?
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<btami> hello
<ra3vat> hello
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<btami> hi all
<btami> help!
<btami> i can't print from lyx
<btami> (common-techref.lyx)
<btami> Error while executing db2dvi 'techref.sgml'
<btami> ?
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<sledge_> hi there
<sledge_> everyone alife? *g*
<reinhard> hey sledge_
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<sledge_> hey :) nice to see you. quite some geas code coming in, nice work
<reinhard> huh?
<reinhard> did i commit anything?
Action: reinhard can't remember
Action: reinhard must have been coding in his sleep
<reinhard> ;)
<sledge_> the last few days, i mean
<sledge_> it's 413 lines, but i still can follow the code
<sledge_> ;)
<reinhard> lol
<sledge_> most work seems to happen on gnurpc, right?
<reinhard> yeah
<reinhard> because it's not me who does that :)
<sledge_> :)
<sledge_> btw, i'm heavily messing around with a designer bug
<drochaid> Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, because you are crunchy and
<drochaid> taste good with ketchup.
<sledge_> have you taken your pills today? :-)
<drochaid> I don't have an attitude problem, you have a perception problem.
<sledge_> i see. (or don't, if you are right)
<drochaid> Eat one live toad the first thing in the morning and nothing worse will happen to you the rest of the day.
<drochaid> and many other wise words of wisdom courtesy of Dogbert ;)
<sledge_> i give up, you got me crazy
<drochaid> My reality check bounced.
<drochaid> Last night I lay in bed looking up at the stars in the sky, and I thought to myself, where the heck is the ceiling?
<sledge_> reality is what you suffer from when you don't take drugs.
<drochaid> please tell me to stop ;)
<sledge_> me to stop ;)
<drochaid> LOL
<drochaid> ah, good enough I suppose :)
<drochaid> well .. almost good enough ...
<drochaid> I can only please one person per day.  Today is not your day.  Tomorrow is not looking good either.
<sledge_> but i think there actually *is* a dragon in the property window code
<drochaid> lol
<sledge_> now i see why there are no comments in the code - noone dared to reveal his identity *g*
<drochaid> I always comment my code .. but then, I'm not a developer ;)
<sledge_> :)
<sledge_> (btw, typing :) in vi is not beautiful when in command mode)
<drochaid> :o
<drochaid> but vi is the god of all that is and shall be, it is bliss and calm ... nothing can match its ease of use!!!
<sledge_> har har
<sledge_> i use it because no one of my friends can *eg*
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<sledge_> hi jan!
<siesel> hi sledge.
<siesel> you're surfing with claranet?
<sledge_> wtf is claranet?
<siesel> I just can't remember to which provider pppool.de is connected.
<sledge_> oh
<sledge_> it's mobilcom
<sledge_> pppool provides the dialin afair
<siesel> no flatrate?
<sledge_> nope :(
<siesel> :(
<sledge_> i'm quite uncertain about my future, regarding military service (blargh) and studying
<sledge_> but if i move out, i'll get my dsl :)
<siesel> I suggest to move into a WG with a shared dsl line or to an "studentenwohnheim" with 10/100 Mbit ethernet.
<siesel> jamest, you here?
<sledge_> that'd be nice too
<siesel> hi chilly. 
<jamest_> sorta here
<siesel> sledge: do you know how to get the path of an module at runtime? I want to access a file in the same directory of the module
<sledge_> not without looking into the docs
<sledge_> i remember there is one (i think somewhere in sys or os)
<siesel> jamest: i've made some changes to setup-cvs.py. I'd have liked to ask you for comments before I commited it, so I just did it. Can you have a look over it (when you've time)
<jamest_> sure
<siesel> sledge: thx
<siesel> jamest: good. btw. their is still one problem with the gtestcvs command now. You have to be into common/src/commdrivers/_test to test the rpc server. So if it doesn't work, you know why.
<jamest_> ok
<jamest_> btw you looking for python module path ?
<jamest_> i think the inspect module will give you that
<siesel> jamest: btw. dbdriver/popy introspection support is broken. I have a "bit" dirty fix, and am not shure if i should commit it.
<siesel> ok. I try that.
<jamest_> you already committed the setup stuff?
<siesel> yep.
<jamest_> and what is dirty about the popy stuff
<siesel> popy returns the oid as an string. but the composition of the new query uses a "%d" to insert the oid -> error
<siesel> my patch is dirty, because I patch it in the _pqsql directory and not in the popy code itself.
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<jamest_> ew
<jamest_> what we've typically done is copy the non-std function from _pqsql into the driver and patch there
<jamest_> what that not work in this case?
<siesel> it will work. I've just been too lasy.
<siesel> server.py is fixed. now the whole test case should work.
<jamest_> cool
<siesel> you've tryed it out?
<jamest_> i can't at the moment
<jamest_> not sure it'll even work on my sparcs here
<jamest_> looked at cvs diff on setup-cvs.py
<jamest_> you just added support for an appserver cvs command right?
<siesel> I've  added "gacvs" which calls "geasRpcServer.py" and gtestcvs which calls "common/GTest.py".
<siesel> GTest.py outputs a menu and you can choose which testcase you like to run (f.e. donut rpc test client, test server, geasRpcClient, or the appserver/test"
<jamest_> :)
<sledge_> okay, i still don't get it. this bug sucks.
<siesel> which bug?
<sledge_> designer: property editor doesn't work when it has scrollbars
Action: siesel hates non properly working GUI librarys
<sledge_> right
<siesel> jamest: another question:  whats about  quoting of table and row identifiers? To my knowledge this is not  done at the moment. Is that right?
<jamest_> for the generated sql?
<jamest_> i probably should
<jamest_> i = we
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<siesel> just asking, because I like to give names as "my dear table row"
<jamest_> yeah
<jamest_> i wonder if all db's support that?
<jamest_> mysql<cough>
<jamest_> :)
<sledge_> fuck it
<jamest_> sledge_: ?
<sledge_> this designer bug makes me crazy
<sledge_> it's just illogical
<jamest_> ah
<jamest_> yip
<jamest_> the wxpython demo does not suffer from that bug
<sledge_> ah
<jamest_> i keep meaning to compare their code to ours 
<jamest_> but have not done so
<sledge_> i assume that our code has trapped into a side effect
<sledge_> of the wx code
<sledge_> i hade side effects *grrr*
<siesel> i think that every db use a different quoteing style. so there should be a function "quote_identifier" in GDataobjects which can be overwritten by the drivers code
<jamest_> would it go there or in _dbsig
<siesel> dbsig would be ok. I just don't know which object would be the best for that. whats about DBSIG_DataObject?
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<siesel> btw: the patch for popy just works if its in _pgsql i don't know why.
<sledge_> i give up
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<sledge_> bye then
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<siesel> hi jcater
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<dneighbo> im going to be the big devils advocate here
<dneighbo> i see lots of commits, but we still need to release :)
<dneighbo> our dog died today :( but i will be home today because of it
<dneighbo> im half tempted to package what we have an release
<dneighbo> no matter how dorked
<dneighbo> as its barely worse than pointing everyone to cvs
<dneighbo> and since no one will communicate in this channel (only via private messages) no one knows where things stand
<jamest_> sory about the dog
<jamest_> the recent commits are trying to fix some issues prior to release and work final bugs out
<jamest_> as we're jumping to 0.3.0
<reinhard> jamest_: you really want to do even/odd before 1.0?
<jamest_> i don't want even/odd at all anymore
<reinhard> sorry to drop in here but i don't think this makes much sense
<jamest_> but I'm in the minority
<jamest_> :)
<dneighbo> it does
<jamest_> I'd go 0.2.0 but the changes in forms/designer are much greater than a 0.1.0 to 0.2.0 release :)
<jamest_> I'm 1/2 tempted to say this is a 0.5.0 release in alot of ways
<dneighbo> reinhard: it just doesnt seem to make sense cause we never release :)
<dneighbo> jamest_ i have no problem with it being .5
<jcater> dneighbo: we do too
<jcater> just not that often :)
<dneighbo> if anyone asks we simply say its your fault
<dneighbo> from working with sun for so long :)
<dneighbo> that you thought skipping numbers was the 'right' way
<jamest_> :)
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<jamest_> if things release today we have the following issues
<jamest_>   setup.py still installs gnue.conf which isn't needed anymore
<jamest_>   drowdown key errors in the displayHandler
<jamest_>   database issues w/ pypgsql and 7.2.1 postgres (at least for me)
<jamest_>   no windows testing
<jcater>   lots of untested i18n changes
<jamest_>   your trigger issue
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<jamest_> the i18n is cake to disable for a release
<jamest_> just modify GBaseApp to always call the dummy _()
<jcater> it's the _() that I was referring too :)
<jcater> don't know what exceptions, if thens, etc, have a _()
<jcater> that we haven't had code run against :)
<jamest_> I'm really hoping to be ready for release near the weekend as my remodling is winding down
<jamest_> and have been working to roll out the stuff internally today for testing
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<dneighbo> gnue.conf isnt needed?
<jamest_> nope
<jamest_> well
<jamest_> testing today shows it is
<jamest_> but it should not be
<jamest_> some recent changes to gnue.conf broke my installs
<jamest_> so I got ticked
<dneighbo> ah
<jamest_> the system now has all defaults in a .py file
<jamest_> that can be overridden by gnue.conf
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<sledge_> hi back
<jamest_> when time permits I'll make the new config system write config files too
<jamest_> it's real close to that today
<jamest_> then our installer can create them on the fly
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<jamest_> if needed
<siesel> cool
Action: siesel read the log
<sledge_> where can one read the log?
<siesel> http://www.gnuenterprise.org/irc-logs/gnue-public.log
<dneighbo> jamest_ sounds dangerous to me
<jamest_> ?
Action: dneighbo doesnt think defaults belong in a py file
<jcater> ?
<dneighbo> i propose from now on if we go into a segment where we are getting ready for release we branch the code
<dneighbo> so things like rewriting the conf system and doing i18n and such
<dneighbo> are in the branch
<dneighbo> and we dont have to 'wait'
<dneighbo> to do releases
<dneighbo> as this is always what kills us
<dneighbo> is 'features' not fixes keep getting added in the last push for a release
<dneighbo> this is why we need roadmap more clearly defined
<dneighbo> so we can say xyz will be in next release
<dneighbo> anything not xyz goes in a branch
<jcater> well the config system is where "feature
<jcater> " vs "fix" gets murky
<dneighbo> agree, but it was never in the original 'fix' list for the next release
<ra3vat> siesel:  "You have to be into common/src/commdrivers/_test to test the rpc server." What does it mean? Is it enough to run setup-cvs.py to prepare all things for testing?
<dneighbo> i realize a lot is dictated by 'need'
<dneighbo> but i think if we kept a version branch to help us stay focused it would help
<dneighbo> but wouldnt prevent people from adding stuff that was 100% necessity
<dneighbo> btw: this is the same issue debian woody is having so its not a direct criticism per say
<dneighbo> there may not be a good answer
<siesel> ra3vat: you just run setup-cvs.py as normal and then call gtestcvs 
<sledge_> hm
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<Arturas> Hello :)
<sledge_> hi
<siesel> hi 
<siesel> arturas: I' ve question about i18
<ra3vat> Arturas: hello
<Yurik> Arturas: hi
<Arturas> siesel: go
<ra3vat> siesel:     from gnue.appserver.test import *
<ra3vat> ImportError: No module named appserver.test
<sledge_> jcater?
<jcater> yes?
<sledge_> seriously, have you had thoughts about redesigning designer?
<siesel> the gettext initialisation is made in GBaseApp.__init__ , so GBaseApp.__init__ has to be called first in inherited objects. But command line parameters are parsed by GBaseApp.__init__, i.e. they have to come first.
<dneighbo> Creating appserver/scripts/gacvs
<dneighbo> Traceback (most recent call last):
<dneighbo>   File "./setup-cvs.py", line 334, in ?
<dneighbo>     createCVS ('appserver/scripts','gacvs','appserver/geasRpcServer.py')
<dneighbo>   File "./setup-cvs.py", line 15, in createCVS
<dneighbo>     file = open(os.path.join(scriptdir, script),'w')
<dneighbo> IOError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: 'appserver/scripts/gacvs'
<dneighbo> dneighbo@aegagrus:~/cvs/gnue$ 
<dneighbo> from cvs 10 seconds ago
<dneighbo> doing setup-cvs.py
<siesel> but command line parameters are i18lized
<Arturas> siesel: command line parameters are not going to be i18lized
<ra3vat> dneighbo: add appserver/scripts directory manually
<dneighbo> ra3vat: no
<dneighbo> i COULD do that
<dneighbo> but that doesnt fix the problem
<jcater> sledge_: I've had real work to deal with for the month, so designer UI hasn't been at the top of my list
<ra3vat> i did that and setup-cvs passed 
<dneighbo> i.e. the script needs to be fixed
<ra3vat> agreed
<dneighbo> ra3vat: thats fine, but i dont want to do tech support for everyone that runs setup-cvs.py
<sledge_> jcater: i understand, it was more a general question
<dneighbo> :)
<siesel> sorry. I just tested it on my computer and didn't get a new clean cvs
<dneighbo> someone else want to patch or want me to
<ra3vat> i still can't get gtestcvs working
<siesel> one moment.
<siesel> ra3vat: please update cvs again.
<dneighbo> siesel: you address the setup-cvs ?
Action: siesel ducks
<ra3vat> siesel: now it works, thanks :)
<siesel> dneigbo: to add an appserver/scripts directory to cvs I just have to "cvs add  appserver/scripts" right?
<dneighbo> i believe so
<dneighbo> and from what i can tell that is all that is needed for the fix
<^chewie> Go Peru! http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/4/25157.html
<^chewie> heh
<^chewie> how's everyone today?
<siesel> ok. i hope it works now.
<ra3vat> siesel: tests 2,3 of gtestcvs passed, 0,1 - fails
<sledge_> ^chewie: busy, it seems :)
<ra3vat> siesel: what is test server?
<siesel> what error msg do you get?
<ra3vat>     from gnue.common.commdrivers._test import test
<ra3vat> ImportError: No module named _test
<siesel> a simple rpc server test from common/src/commdrivers/_test
Action: dneighbo is wondering how many tests we want in our tree
<siesel> one moment. cvs add __init.py__
<dneighbo> my fear is that it will be utter hell to package debians
<dneighbo> as debian packaging requires (iirc) 
<dneighbo> applicatoin
<dneighbo> tests/samples
<dneighbo> documentation
<dneighbo> to all be separate packages
<^chewie> dneighbo: I can help with this if you'd like
<^chewie> dneighbo: I just have to come to understand how setup.py does things
<dneighbo> Traceback (most recent call last):
<dneighbo>   File "./setup-cvs.py", line 334, in ?
<dneighbo>     createCVS ('appserver/scripts','gacvs','appserver/geasRpcServer.py')
<dneighbo>   File "./setup-cvs.py", line 15, in createCVS
<dneighbo>     file = open(os.path.join(scriptdir, script),'w')
<dneighbo> IOError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: 'appserver/scripts/gacvs'
<dneighbo> dneighbo@aegagrus:~/cvs/gnue$ 
<dneighbo> problem appears to still exist
<dneighbo> please also note
<dneighbo> Creating navigator/client/gncvs
<dneighbo> Creating common/scripts/grpcdoc
<dneighbo> Creating common/scripts/gtestcvs
<dneighbo> Creating appserver/scripts/gacvs
<dneighbo> Traceback (most recent call last):
<dneighbo> should be be calling this appserver/scripts/gacvs?
<dneighbo> or appserver/server/gacvs ?
<^chewie> you don't need to package the examples and tests in separate packages if you don't want too, although it would be nice
<siesel> does appserver/script/ directory exists?
<dneighbo> ^chewie: it think you have to for debian
Action: ^chewie shakes his head
<^chewie> it's a general convention, but you don't "have too"
<^chewie> trust me ;-)
Action: ^chewie is a debian developer, he knows these things ;-)
<dneighbo> siesel: no it does not
<siesel> server is possible too. 
<dneighbo> siesel: im not saying right or wrong
<dneighbo> im just noticing the tools are 
<dneighbo> name/client/...
<^chewie> it would make sense to have gnue-common, gnue-forms, gnue-designer, gnue-doc (with samples, tests, etc)
<dneighbo> i will defer to jbailey but i prefer
<dneighbo> gnue-forms
<dneighbo> gnue-forms-samples
<siesel> and common/scripts, but common/scripts is just for small tools
<dneighbo> gnue-froms-doc
<dneighbo> siesel: my opinion is if this is just a tester 'script' script is fine
Action: ^chewie nods.
<dneighbo> if it is to actually be the RPC daemon for appserver we should probably make it server or something other than scripts but i would ask jcater/jamest as they created the naming convention :)
<dneighbo> cvs $GNUECVS update -Pd
<dneighbo> going to see if it exists yet
<dneighbo> did you check in the files?
<dneighbo> btw: now that i think about it you have to do
<siesel> I think gacvs will be the CVS name for the application server (reinhard, what do you think?) 
<dneighbo> cvs add filename
<dneighbo> then
<dneighbo> cvs commit filename
<dneighbo> the add wont commit it just queue's it for commit
<siesel> so appserver/server is the choice.
<dneighbo> ok
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<reinhard> siesel: that's ok for me
<siesel> dneighbo: its seems that i can't add an empty directory. I've tried to add appserver/server, but it don't work.
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<jamest_> siesel: sure you can
<jamest_> whatcha need added and I can do it real quick if it's giving you problems
Action: siesel want's to be enlightened
Action: siesel leans back.
<siesel> please do it quick
<jamest_> what do you need?
<jcater> siesel: what is the appserver/server directory you just added?
<siesel> a directory named "server" in the appserver directory.  nothing else
<jcater> I get that much
<siesel> cool. I hope it fixes that setup-cvs.py issue.
<jcater> but what is it for?
<dneighbo> siesel: im supposing it needs to have the file that gets executed?
<dneighbo> dneighbo@aegagrus:~/cvs/gnue/forms/client$ ls
<dneighbo> CVS  gfclient.in
<dneighbo> dneighbo@aegagrus:~/cvs/gnue/forms/client$ 
<siesel> the gacvs script will be installed in appserver/server.
<dneighbo> dneighbo@aegagrus:~/cvs/gnue/designer/client$ ls
<dneighbo> CVS  gfdesigner.in
<dneighbo> dneighbo@aegagrus:~/cvs/gnue/designer/client$ 
<dneighbo> dneighbo@aegagrus:~/cvs/gnue/common/scripts$ ls
<dneighbo> CVS  gnue-diag.sh  gnuedtd  pyxslt
<dneighbo> dneighbo@aegagrus:~/cvs/gnue/common/scripts$ 
<siesel> I don't know if it needs this *.in files
<dneighbo> are what are in the other similar directories
<dneighbo> from a fresh cvs
<siesel> possibly the normal setup needs these *.in files.
<jcater> the standard directory is scripts/ not server/
<jcater> just fyu
<jcater> or fyi even
Action: jcater is away: lunch
Action: drochaid offers jcater a intrel or two
<dneighbo> jcater: i was curious then
<dneighbo> why the forms/designer use 'client'
<dneighbo> instead of scripts
<jamest_> legacy
<dneighbo> its my understanding this gacvs is actually the application server (not just a test script)
<dneighbo> jamest_ ok
<jamest_> we should probably fix form/designer
<dneighbo> siesel: so leave as is, as stated before i said we shoudl ask jamest_/jcater as it was their standards :)
<dneighbo> i just wanted to point out there was an inconsistency not that one way or the other was correct :)
<siesel> jamest:  how can i uncommit stuff. or should i just leave it this way for a while?
<dneighbo> siesel: it works now
<dneighbo> but as you now know i screwed up by asking you if it should be server or not
<dneighbo> and no easy way to remove a directory
<dneighbo> jamest: will have to do this on the cvs side
<dneighbo> siesel: what is your sample
<siesel> which sample?
<siesel> or do you mean, how to test the appserver?
<ra3vat> siesel: DB000: AttributeError: 'BakingUnit' instance has no attribute 'get_flavor'           
<ra3vat> siesel: when playing with test server
<siesel> playing= the normal version, or did you change something?
<ra3vat> normal
<siesel> xmlrpc or pw_xmlrpc for the client?
<ra3vat> xmlrpc
<siesel> one moment i've to get the cvs version in a seperate tree
<dneighbo> yes to test appserver
<siesel> dneighbo: i got a fresh cvs version, but there is no appserver/server directory in there
<dneighbo> i got a fresh one
<dneighbo> and there is :)
Action: siesel have to check my cvs binaries
<dneighbo> grabing again to triple check
<dneighbo> rm -rf gnue/
<dneighbo> cvs co gnue
<dneighbo> dneighbo@aegagrus:~/cvs$ ls gnue/appserver/scripts/    
<dneighbo> CVS
<dneighbo> dneighbo@aegagrus:~/cvs$ 
<dneighbo> it exists
<dneighbo> and the setup-cvs.py works
<dneighbo> but where is your test application
<siesel> just call gtestcvs
<ra3vat> siesel: grpcFile=__file__[:len(__file__)-9]+"donuts.grpc" from _test/server.py
<dneighbo> hmm guess i need xmlrpc :)
<siesel> yes its a problem. i don't work with .pyc
<ra3vat> siesel: sometimes it is initialized with .../sdonuts.grpc
<dneighbo> DB000:   File "/usr/lib/python2.1/urllib.py", line 400, in open_file
<dneighbo> DB000:     return self.open_local_file(url)
<dneighbo> DB000:   File "/usr/lib/python2.1/urllib.py", line 413, in open_local_file
<dneighbo> DB000:     return addinfourl(open(url2pathname(file), 'rb'),
<dneighbo> DB000: IOError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: '/home/dneighbo/cvs/gnue/.cvsdevelbase/gnue/common/commdrivers/_test/sdonuts.grpc'
<dneighbo> dneighbo@aegagrus:~/cvs/gnue$ 
<siesel> dneighbo: apt-get install python-xmlrpc
<dneighbo> is error i get
<dneighbo> siesel: already did
<dneighbo> when i choose 1)  GNU RPC test server     
<dneighbo> 2) seems to work though
<dneighbo> Your choice: 2
<dneighbo>  
<dneighbo> Creating session object ...
<dneighbo> Logging into the session ...
<dneighbo> Creating list object ...
<dneighbo> Setting up list object ...
<dneighbo> Populating list ...
<dneighbo> Retrieving first instance ...
<dneighbo> These are the values of the first instance:
<dneighbo> James T. Kirk
<dneighbo> Enterprise Road 17
<dneighbo> Gnutown
<dneighbo> Thank you for playing!
<dneighbo> i cant run 0 or 3 w/o 1 working though (or so it would seem)
<siesel> dneighbo: this is the test for the appserver, which is working.
<siesel> ra3vat: updated _test/server.py to solve both problems
<siesel> dneighbo: what is the error you get for 3 ?
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<drochaid> hey psu
<psu> hi
<psu> did ya miss me?
<psu> maybe you should take better aim...
<drochaid> oh dear
<drochaid> I think everyone just went off and hung themselves in response to that attempt at humour psu ;)
<dneighbo> siesel: for 3 i didnt run as it said i needed 1 which failed
<siesel> for 3 you have to start up the application server. i.e gacvs
<ra3vat> siesel: xmlrpc test works now
<ra3vat> siesel: pw_xmlrpc complains on i18n _() messages
<ra3vat>   File "/home/ds/cvs/gnue/gnue/.cvsdevelbase/gnue/common/commdrivers/pw_xmlrpc/ClientAdapter.py", line 63, in ?
<ra3vat>     raise GComm.AdapterInitializationError, \
<ra3vat> NameError: There is no variable named '_'
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<kiOwA> Hi.. I'm taking a peek at GNUe, but I'm finding information about available packages/templates very hard to find. The ~neilt/ links are also outdated..
<psu> hi kiOwA
<psu> the website is out of date - we have a redesign in the works
<kiOwA> Hmm, I might have found a link that actually works now >(
<psu> for the moment
<kiOwA> :)
<psu> just ask away here ;_
<kiOwA> Is there an easy way of just getting a tarball or something for each individual package and see what fits?
<kiOwA> Right now all that seems to be a big mess of what is available and what fits here and there..
<siesel> ra3vat: another i18 error.... I'm tracking the bug down... 
<ra3vat> siesel: test socket (option 3) gives
<ra3vat>   File "/home/ds/cvs/gnue/gnue/.cvsdevelbase/gnue/common/commdrivers/_helpers/AsyncSocketServer.py", line 53
<ra3vat>     if not len(self.__socketfile:
<ra3vat>                                 ^
<ra3vat> SyntaxError: invalid syntax
<psu> kiOwA: at the moment, the tools are pretty much all we have 
<psu> (Forms, Reports, etc)
<ra3vat> siesel: and another error after fixing that
<psu> if by "package" you mean Financials, HR, Payroll, SCM etc
<psu> then all of those are stalled at the moment
<psu> some we have proposals for, some we don;t
<psu> the sticking point has been 
<ra3vat> siesel:   File "/home/ds/cvs/gnue/gnue/.cvsdevelbase/gnue/common/commdrivers/sockets/CommDriver.py", line 118, in __init__
<ra3vat>     raise AdapterInitializationError, \
<ra3vat> NameError: There is no variable named 'AdapterInitializationError'
<kiOwA> Ah, ok.. From the FAQ and such it seemed as if there were several available for you to try out..
<psu> that although we *could* write packages using two-tier
<psu> ie forms talking direct to database
<psu> we don;t really want to
<psu> we really want to use n-tier
<siesel> sorry forgot to say: sockets doesn't work
<ra3vat> ok
<psu> ie forms talks to appserver talks to database
<psu> however
<psu> the appserver has caused us problems
<psu> the first version was contrib by a company 
<psu> and did what it did well
<psu> but not really what we wanted 
<kiOwA> ok..
<psu> (probably because of lack of input from our part)
<psu> so we have ju7st started an appserver re-write
<psu> once that is bearing fruit 
<psu> we can start on the packages for real
<psu> In the meantime, 2 tier (forms to database) is *very* usable 
Action: dneighbo is away: car work
<psu> for people who want to write their own apps
<kiOwA> Ok...
<psu> hence the frequent jokes about "Microsoft Access replacement"
<psu> i.e. we are that even today
<kiOwA> And using the forms-thingie that shouldn't really pose much of a problem you mean ;)
<psu> but no-one in their right mind would write a full ERP package 
<psu> in M$Access 
<kiOwA> There are many who are not.. 
<kiOwA> Probably..
<psu> kiOwA: No - several of the guys here use Forms in production
<drochaid> psu: you mean I should stop my current project? :o
<psu> for what I would call "mini-distributed" business apps
<psu> i.e. anything where you need a slightly bigger set up than Access, FoxPro or the like
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<psu> but having to maintain the clients isn't too big an issue
<kiOwA> I don't use M$-ware.. And I program in python, so your project seemed like my best bet ;)
<psu> either because you don't have many client PCs
<psu> or because you use something like LTSP
<psu> kiOwA: we live & breathe python here
<psu> even I've become infected
<psu> needed to do a simple file splitter the other day
<psu> in my former naughty life, I would have used QBASIC or M$ Excel macros
<kiOwA> Ehh..
<psu> instead I broke out the python book & did myself a quick 6-liner
<kiOwA> Just opening a filedescriptor with x bytes ;)
<psu> found myself with an insatiable craving for donuts after I'd finished...
Action: psu cues X-files style music...
<psu> The other benefit of hopping onto GNUe now
<siesel> ra3vat: the error messages i18 problems are fixed. It will tell you now which files you have to download to get pw_xmlrpc running
<psu> is that if you write an app in 2-tier (i.e. forms talks to d/b)
<psu> once the appserver is ready to rumble 
<psu> moving to 3-tier (forms talks to appserver talks to d/b) 
<psu> should be an easy conversion
<kiOwA> Ok.. nice..
<psu> basically take all your triggers and business logic out of forms
<psu> and put it into appserver
<psu> depending how it works, we might even be able to write an automatic sucking script
<kiOwA> Guess I'll have to take a closer peek at your work later on then. It might be what we're looking for (even if it does involve a bit more coding then we anticipated).
Action: psu looks at that and wonders if he should change that for the benefit of the US guys
<psu> basically, if you need an off the shelf ERP package to go live tomorrow
<psu> then no, we're not that
<psu> If you need a convenient toolkit to write database apps of simple to mid complexity
<psu> we're here already 
<kiOwA> I was looking for something that I could customize the hell out of... And shrink-wrapped isn't my kind of style.
<psu> We like customisation
<psu> as GNUe packages will be GPL, nothing to stop you re-writing source 
<psu> but 
<psu> even beyond that, we already have concept of "templates"
<psu> which you can apply to packages
<psu> e.g. in UK, we have a complicated tax deduction system for building works
<psu> called CIS
<psu> I would anticipate that UK users 
<psu> would just apply the CIS template over top of AP
<psu> and have full CIS functionality
<psu> same for US oddities like 1099 reporting
<ra3vat> siesel: ok, downloading now
<psu> (someone must explain what that is to me someday)
<kiOwA> I'm neither us or uk, so ;) .no here..
<siesel> l8r
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<psu> to me, a pure shrink-wrapped ERP is almost an oxymoron
<kiOwA> Was thinking about creating a customers-base with everything that evolves around. We were already thinking about starting that work using webware (python-wrapper for web).
<psu> ok
Action: jcater is back (gone 01:03:02)
<psu> we have a PHP-based web client in CVS 
<psu> not sure of current status
<psu> & the guy who wrote it just left before you said that ;-)
<psu> In general, I would say that 
<psu> if the database connectivity is the significant part of your project
<kiOwA> Well, it won't be a problem for us as long as python is runtime both on m$ and linux.
<psu> we are definantly what you want
<kiOwA> It's very reliant on the db, yes..
<ra3vat> psu: and also forms driver for webware with the same status :(
<psu> as all the d/b connectivity is built in
<psu> The Forms client works on both GNU/Linux and Windows
<psu> ra3vat: I'd forgotten that one. Is it in CVS?
<ra3vat> psu: no, it did not get there
<psu> In fact, M$ Windows is probably marginally easier to install at the moment
<kiOwA> Well, we have debs, so ;)
<psu> Not sure what the status of our debs are - I know nickr has been working on them
<psu> debs = debian packages, not debutantes ;-)
<kiOwA> Well, they seem to be working fine here, so..
<psu> before nickr reaches for the libel writ...
<ra3vat> well, pw_xmlrpc test works reporting: Sending glazed yeast donuts to Jason Cater
<psu> ra3vat: that's not a bug, it's a feature ;-)
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<kiOwA> Well, gotta go for the day, but this seems to me to be what I need... So thanks and happy working with your project.
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<ra3vat> psu: or prerequisition? :)
<psu> or a dependnacy?
<bobacus> On the web site, why are the Kernel Cousin announcements a week behind? #27 was announced on the mailing list on Saturday, but #26 is what has been announced on the web site.
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<psu> bobacus: because we don;t always get around to approving them timely 
<psu> Actually, given there is a link on the left hand toolbar these days
<psu> & it's always posted to gnue-announce 
<psu> maybe that's enough?
<bobacus> psu: hmmm maybe. Just wondered if an automatic script was running awry :)
<psu> nope. I am the automatic script
<psu> and I don't *think* i'm malfunctioning ;-)
Action: bobacus realises he's been talking to a bot :)
<psu> we had an infobot on the other day
<psu> it was fun for a while
<psu> of course, like parrots at the zoo, 
<psu> no=one could resist the urge to teach it naughty words ;)
<psu> actually, drochaid is our resident expert on talking birds 
<drochaid> makes a change, most people tell me I'm talking bollocks ;)
<psu> in the kingdom of the blind, the one-eyed man is king
<psu> I only said you were *our* resident expert...
<drochaid> at least until some bright spark decides that eating the seeing eye will give sight to all
<psu> most of us probably couldn't tell one end of a talking bird from the other
<psu> unless it was actually talking, natch...
<drochaid> you might find it easier if it was taking at the time
<drochaid> heh
<drochaid> psu: you're a sensible chap ... at least until I decide otherwise ;) ... what is your feeling about having biometric support built into GNUe?
<drochaid> back in 20
Action: drochaid is away: I'm a fluffy yellow tree :P
<drochaid> wtf?!?
Action: drochaid is back (gone 00:00:20)
<drochaid> try again ...
Action: drochaid is away: Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, because you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
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<psu> hi siesel. just after you left, kiOwA was
<psu> asking about web clients
<psu> how is the PHP one going?
Action: psu is too lazy to read commit-gnue
<siesel> PHP is working great in combination with postgresql. 
<psu> cool
<psu> does it use GNUe Common or is that "planned"?
<siesel> now its standalone. just copy the two php files into your web directory and it should work
<siesel> but i've planned to use python common over RPC. so I begann to add an modular database adapter system, and worked a bit on the RPC stuff...
<StyXman> if I was to add a new widget, where should I add the description suitable for Incubator to work?
Action: drochaid is back (gone 00:24:20)
<siesel> RPC is now running, but it makes not much sense to use the actual common/dbadapters per RPC in the phpclient. I.e. phpclient will just work with postgres for a while.
<drochaid> psu: any thoughts on my question?
<psu> I don't know
<drochaid> good answer :)
<siesel> but as soon as possible i will commit my new version to cvs. 
<psu> I guess I would perceive it as an add-on
<psu> main issue is that most clients today are PCs and have no biometric support
<psu> unless you buy the £50 fingerprint detector
<psu> I know sklein is the main player on security issues
<psu> but he rarely shows up in IRC
<psu> he obviously has a life ;-)
<drochaid> shocking ;)
<siesel> psu: do you mean life or wife? ;)
<psu> siesel: maybe both ;-)
<drochaid> surely if he had a wife he'd be on IRC as much as possible :)
<siesel> rofl
<psu> biometrics are a possible solution to a real problem
<psu> in that some orgs have a culture of password sharing
<psu> which can't be allowed if you are going to make the best use of ERP
<drochaid> indeed
<psu> becuase you have to be able to depend on login being who they say they are
<psu> and things like LDAP & single log-in can make things worse
<psu> as people don;t think thru
<drochaid> at TSc, I could guarantee being able to access at least 40% of the desktops by using a password to do with x-files
<psu> that giving your secretary your p/w to print off that word file
<psu> also gives her access to the requistion screen in Purchasr Order Processing
<psu> for that luxury cruise s/he always wanted 
<drochaid> lol
<drochaid> I firmly believe a person should be identified by who they are, and not what they know
<psu> at my old place, the payroll system had passwords as a primary key on the d/b
<drochaid> :o
<psu> that was how we found out that one user's cat had the same name as another user's son in my office
<psu> not that they should have been using either as p/w
<drochaid> LMFAO
<psu> but it was 6 chars max
<drochaid> 6 chars MAX??
<drochaid> that is ... maybe just a little lax
<drochaid> I use 2 fingers to login to my machine
<drochaid> no, not like that psu ;P
<psu> i said nothing...
<psu> one thing I really miss about using GNU/Linux
<psu> is being able to give the PC the "three-fingered salute" on a daily basis
<Arturas> have a nice day :)
<Arturas> bye
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<ra3vat> bye all
<drochaid> three fingered??
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<psu> CTRL-ALT_DEL
<psu> the first keystrokes a Wintel PC user learns...
<drochaid> OH OH OH Pagani Zonda on chan 5!!!!!
<drochaid> LOL psu
<siesel> l8r
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<btami> hi all
<psu> hi btami
<btami> jcater: i'v just sended a bugfix for record jumping problem
<btami> in ticket #32
<btami> jamest: may i ask you to convert lyx files to pdf
<btami> i have printing problems from lyx :(
<btami> psu: hi :)
<StyXman> if I was to add a new widget, where should I add the description suitable for Incubator to work?
<StyXman> (sorry for asking again...)
<psu> StyXman: I suspect jamest or jcater would know, but they appear busy...
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<jamest_> btami: I'll try and do so tonite
<jamest_> StyXman: what widget?
<jamest_> psu: very
<btami> jamest:ok
<btami> thanks
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<btami> night all
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<nickr> vb sucks.
<nickr> that is all.
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<gontran> grtngs all
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<psu> hi gontran
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<gontran> hi
Action: drochaid looks at nickr, the vb loving vb lover
<psu> early bedtime
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<reinhard> oops
<reinhard> is it really _that_ late??
<jamest_> it's only 3:40
<reinhard> lol
<reinhard> jamest_ fwiw appserver basic data access works
<reinhard> (read only)
<reinhard> ********************************
<reinhard> note to siesel (hope you read log)
<jamest_> cool
<reinhard> i broke the geasRpc* code
<reinhard> the interface of geasSession has changed
<reinhard> should be no biggie to fix it again
<jamest_> broken cvs?...in GNUe?....how strange
<reinhard> if i can help you please let me know
<reinhard> however RPC doesn't work here (missing packages) so it'd be cool if you could fix it :)
<reinhard> ********************************
<reinhard> jamest_: is that correct that most of our objects have the same name as the module?
<reinhard> um i mean things like
<reinhard> GDataSource.GDataSource
<reinhard> etc.
<reinhard> this is because we have a source file per class, right?
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<jcater> reinhard: not necessarily
<jcater> but there was enough code for Datasources to justify their own module
<jcater> we don't have strict rules governing what's in a module
<jcater> other than neither of us like 1000+ line files
<reinhard> did i understand correctly that 1 file == 1 module ?
<jcater> for the most part, yes
<jcater> in python terms
<reinhard> ok
<jcater> a module is either
<jcater> 1) a directory with an __init__.py file
<jcater> or a .py file
<jcater> err
<jcater> or 2) a .py file
<reinhard> ok
<reinhard> and 1) consists of a lot of 2)'s
<reinhard> ?
<jcater> yes
<reinhard> i can't do import gnue.common right?
<reinhard> i have to do from gnue.common import <filename>?
<jcater> well
<jcater> there's stuff in gnue/common/__init__.py
<jcater> and you can access those from
<jcater> import gnue.common
<reinhard> cool
<reinhard> i think after a week of python programming i start to understand the basic concepts of the language
<reinhard> ;)
<dneighbo> and who said you cant teach a REALLY old dog new tricks? ;)
<reinhard> lol
<reinhard> night all
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<jamest_> l8r
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<Mr_You> re
<Mr_You> ya'll seen the HR-XML stuff?
<Mr_You> hr-xml.org
<gontran> hmm
<Mr_You> not sure about the licensing
<gontran> TITLE TO COPYRIGHT IN THIS WORK AND ANY ASSOCIATED DOCUMENTATION WILL AT ALL TIMES REMAIN WITH COPYRIGHT HOLDERS. 
<gontran> Permission to use, copy, modify, or redistribute this Work and its documentation, with or without modification, for any purpose and without fee or royalty is hereby granted, provided that you include the following on ALL copies of the software and documentation or portions thereof, including modifications, that you make:
<gontran>     * This notice: "Copyright (c) The HR-XML Consortium. All Rights Reserved. http://www.hr-xml.org"
<gontran> * Notice of any changes or modifications to the The HR-XML Consortium files
<Mr_You> yeah, I dunno if its GPL compatible
<gontran> right, so if gnue documents how to use their markup, the copyright for that documentation has to be assigned to hr-xml.org?
<Mr_You> not sure
<gontran> maybe they could be convinced on a rewording ...
<Mr_You> I don't understand how they could require you give them copyright on the software, only the XML definitions
<gontran> looks like they want copyright on any documentation of the standard.
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<Mr_You> bbl
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<StyXman> /leave
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<dneighbo> read log, reinhard left you messages 
<dneighbo> :)
<dneighbo> for siesel
Action: siesel read the log.
<siesel> I've allready uploaded the patch.
<siesel> it is quite cool. now just a object to relative mapping, some triggers and an dbadapter/geasV2 is missing to reach the status of GEAS v1
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<esands> dneighbo: did you want to know any particulars about the debian python/gnue connections.conf/postgress issue I had?
<siesel> night.
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<chillywilly> I thought reinhard committed some stuff to cvs?
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<dneighbo> esands: sure
<dneighbo> i have to run will be back in an hour or so
<dneighbo> will you be around then?
<esands> ok
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<chillywilly> hi dsmith
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<dsmith> Hey chillywilly
<dsmith> Back in "beautiful" Auburn Hills michigan.
<chillywilly> for work?
<chillywilly> where do you actaully live OH?
Action: chillywilly is reading tutorials on http://www.w3schools.com
<dsmith> Yes.  Hinckley OH.  Before that, Cleveland.
<chillywilly> to get into these hip web technologies ;)
<chillywilly> ok
Action: chillywilly is outside of Milwaukee, WI
<chillywilly> Menomonee Falls, WI
<chillywilly> midwest rocks doesn't it ;)
<chillywilly> ?
<dsmith> The only thing good about this place is the fantastic thai restraunt we always go to.
<dsmith> I wouldn't want to live anywhere else.
<chillywilly> Milwaukee is the perfect size city, imho
<chillywilly> not too big and not too small
<chillywilly> and living int he burbs is nice
<chillywilly> in the
<dsmith> The questions is: what kind of bandwith can you get?
<chillywilly> I have a cable connection now
<chillywilly> it's fast enough for me
<drochaid> cable rawkz
Action: drochaid returns to the corner
<chillywilly> corner?
<chillywilly> ;P
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<dsmith> Hey!  Anyone here use acpi?
<jcater> no
<jcater> is she cute?
<dsmith> :P
<jamest> yip
<jamest> use = disable on 2 systems as they didn't work with it and have extremely bad luck with the 1 dual I'm still running with it on
<jcater> ah
<jcater> that acpi
<jcater> yeah, same experience as jamest
<dsmith> jamest: what kernel
<jcater> I disabled them as soon as possible :)
<jamest> 2.4.17 disabled
<jamest> 2.4.18 attempted to disable but it ignores me
<esands> Where is the path defined for the images for gfcvs? I'm getting this error: "No such ... /home/nic/gnue/shared/images/shared/images/gnue-splash.png".  Obviously should be /home/nic/gnue/shared/images/gnue-splash.png and is "shared/images" is being double for some reason
<jamest> this is a issue w/ old gnue.conf
<jamest> the one that ticked me off enough to attempt to get rid of gnue.conf
<jamest> :)
<esands> heh. So is there a fix?
Action: jcater takes full credit for that one
<jamest> yip
<jamest> you running the latest cvs?
<esands> using yesterday's (NZST) cvs version
<jamest> hmmmmm
<jamest> you can try 2 things
<esands> Should I just update and rerun setup-cvs.py?
<jamest> edit your gnue.conf to remove the shared/images part from the entries in gnue.conf
<jamest> or if you're new enough cvs 
<jamest> just remove them from the gnue.conf
Action: jamest smacks jcater with a smelly gnue.conf
<esands> Yep, but: 'grep images ~/gnue/etc/gnue.conf' gives me nothing
Action: jamest is confused now
<jamest> that is where the double is comming from
<jamest> as it's hard coded in the app and it's in the gnue.conf
<esands> I'm just using the defaults from the setup-cvs.py install
<jamest> hmmmm
<jamest> it's gotta be there :(
<esands> What's the right-side of the option define in gnue.conf?
<esands> er, left side sorry
<jamest> tb_delete
<jamest> tb_something
<jamest> IIRC
<esands> This: splashScreenPNG=gnue-splash.png ?
<jcater> if you didn't manually edit the gnue.conf
<jcater> you can just delete it altogether
<jamest> jcater: I'm still having issues w/ no gnue.conf
<jamest> :(
<jamest> working on it now
<jcater> oh
Action: jcater smacks jamest with a smelly (stale) gnue.conf
<jamest> it can be empty!
<jamest> just still has to have a forms section :)
<esands> That line?  There don't seem any references to path definitions in my (from sample) gnue.conf.  Except for GEASDIR=/usr/local/
<esands> Where Hmm, I guess its time to hit it with the hard hammer: "[nic@thunder:~/devel/gnue/gnue/forms] grep -rs shared ." ;)
<jamest> :)
<esands> Where is prefix defined?  I'm guessing this "./src/GFConfig.py:    'Default'    : '%(prefix)s/shared/images/gnue-splash.png' }, " means that prefix for the setup-cvs.py version I've installed is being defined as "/home/nic/gnue/shared/images/"
<jamest> um
<jamest> er
<jamest> that's the bug I'm working on now 
<jamest> if in your gnue.conf you put
<jamest> [forms]
<jamest> prefix=/usr/local
<jamest> it may work
<jamest> or give me a few minutes :)
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<esands> Just updating from cvs, as it didn;t seem to work with the cvs version I have
<esands> I assume I have to re-run setup-cvs.py
<jamest> I have not commited the fixes
<jamest> no
<jamest> you won't have to
<esands> Particular since that has its own issues.  "IOError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: 'appserver/server/gacvs'"
<jamest> lol
<jamest> yeah
<jamest> we're trying to release this week
<jamest> so tons of new stuff is being added to cvs to make the task more interesting
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<drochaid> can someone let me know here when you release? I'm too lazy to join a mailing list ;)
<jcater> yes
<esands> Well the current cvs version doesn't work.  gfcvs simple/form.gfd still gives me the same problem.  Even with "[forms]\nprefix=/home/nic/gnue/"
<jamest> I'm sure it'll be talked about here
<drochaid> thanks
<jcater> drochaid: if you see "the donut has landed"
<jcater> that means we released
<jamest> esands: ok, just a sec
<drochaid> LOL
<jamest> i'm testing 
<drochaid> for now I need some sleep :)
Action: drochaid is away: Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, because you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.
<esands> Time learn some python, methinks, and do some debuging.  What's equiv to perl's print "$var\n"; ?
<jamest> um
<jamest> print varname
<jamest> but I'm fixing it now honest
<ajmitch> greetings
<jamest> also
<jamest> you can do 
<jamest> gfcvs --interactive-debugger
<jamest> to run the app inside a dubugger
<jamest> gnueapp --interactive-debugger should work with any gnue common based app
<esands> That implies knowledge of python's debugger though. 8)
<jamest> of course :)
<jamest> give me a sec though
<jamest> as I'm finding missing config options that aren't in the code
<jamest> that removal on gnue.conf is making unhappy
<esands> No problem.  I should start learning some python anyway. 
<jcater> I'm working on a
<jcater> gnueapp --ignore-jcater-mistakes option
<jcater> but I keep making mistakes in it
<jcater> which leads to an infinite loop
<jamest> i'd be happy to rebug it for you :)
<jcater> rebug it for me?
<jamest> yip
<jamest> rebug it
<jcater> I can handle my one rebugging :)
<jcater> s/one/on
<jamest> own even
<jcater> sigh
Action: jcater feels really bad
<jcater> when jamest corrects my spelling mistakes
<jamest> oooo
<jamest> it's working
<jamest> sigh
<jamest> esands: try cvs now
<jamest> then just delete your gnue.conf
<jamest> or rename it :)
<jamest> i know gettext is init'ing twice now
<jamest> i'm looking at it
<jamest> but we're in a storm so I wantted to get this commited prior to losing power :)
<esands> jamest: Hmm, no luck. "mv ~/gnue/etc/gnue.conf ~/gnue/etc/gnue.conf.old; gfcvs simple/form.gfd" and same error
<esands> Can someone tell me where in Programming Python is explains "%(prefix)s..."
<jamest> um
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<jamest> that should be gone now in current cvs
<jamest> it's part of the configparser module
<jamest> http://www.python.org/doc/current/
<jamest> in the global modules section
<esands> Sure, but I look at GFConfig.py and see this references to 'prefix' but they doesn't seem to be an indication of where prefix is defined?  So I'm wondering how that operator works and if prefix is being pulled from a global namespace.  (I have about 10 mintues of python experience, now. ;)
<jamest> it was part of the gnue.conf but was removed
<jamest> are you running gfcvs?
<esands> sure
<jamest> and you have no 
<jamest> ~/gnue/etc/gnue.conf
<jamest> ~/.gnue/etc/gnue.conf
<jamest> er
<jamest> ~/.gnue/gnue.conf
<esands> That was the one I hadn't known about: ~/.gnue/gnue.conf. 
<jamest> in gnue apps you have 3 config files
<jamest> $INSTALL_PREFIX/gnue.conf
<jamest> $HOME/.gnue/gnue.conf
<jamest> $INSTALL_PREFIX/gnue.conf.fixed
<jamest> read in that order
<esands> I see
<jamest> so the admin can set system wide prefs
<jamest> and force things in fixed so that users can not override
<esands> Seems like a good system.  Now onto my next issue.  ;)
<jamest> yes?
<esands> After replacing 'psycopg' with 'pypgsql' I've got gfcvs inventory/forms/company.gfd running with the appropiate images (thanks to you ;)
<esands> Actually let me think about this some. 8) 
<esands> My mistake. Didn't have an indentd server running. So postgres wasn't able to auth vis ident correctly. 
<esands> Thanks for your help. 8)
<jamest> no prob
<dneighbo> esands: seems your preliminary issues are resolved?
<esands> dneighbo: Yep. Pretty much.  Fiddling around with the sample forms at the moment.  
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<dneighbo> dont let the authorities catch you 'fiddling' yourself, you coudl get in trouble :))
<esands> 8)
Nick change: gontran_aw -> gontran
<esands> Seems to be an issue with the sample/inventory/forms/company.gfd form.  When I type in the "City" field is gets entered into the "Phone" field.
<dneighbo> that form is probably REALLY old
<dneighbo> as it was done pre-trigger rewrite
<gontran> what would be the reason for doubly importing?  EG, 'from contants import *'\nfrom contstants import *'
<esands> 2001-11-04
<dneighbo> iirc you were only supposed to enter into the ZIPCODE field
<esands> I see
<dneighbo> and a trigger would go and load the city and state for you
<dneighbo> it was quite spiff actually
<jamest> drochaid: is that us?
<dneighbo> gontran: will it even let you double import?
<jamest> er i mean gontran
<jamest> sorry
<esands> Thus the readonly="" modifier.  Still should it just beep at you when you put the cursor and try enter something into that field
<jamest> derek: yes
<gontran> dneighbo :hmm, good question.
<jamest> but if doesn't do anything
<dneighbo> jamest: is the readonly="" busted in forms
<dneighbo> re: esands question
<dneighbo> esands: let me look at the form as well, see if i can bring it up to date
<dneighbo> or you can if you so desire :
<jamest> um
<dneighbo> :)
<gontran> sources OK.  nm
<jamest> i'm pretty sure readonly works 
<dneighbo> jamest: just like prequery does ;)
<esands> jamest: Seems to just enter the data in the previous field the "cursor" was in.
<jamest> "works for me"
<jamest> :)
<jamest> i'll look in a sec...cleaning up some i18n stuff
<esands> ie. UI cues arent there
<jamest> amazing considering I barely know my native tounge
<dneighbo> oh i though you were putting in ksKS
<jamest> i R pr0grammher
<jcater> we also need a translations/PHB :)
<dneighbo> pbPB
<esands> jamest: Has your conf stuff broken the designer?
<jamest> um
<jamest> maybe
<jamest> my very last command has
<jamest>  e ../../../designer/src/Designer.py
<jamest> e aliased to emacs
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<jamest> so there, um, might be some issues in there :)
<jamest> what are you seeing?
<esands> Like: "DB000: ConfigParser.NoOptionError: No option `fixedwidthfont' in section: forms" ;)  
<jamest> oooo
<jamest> didn't hit that one 
<esands> Oh well, I guess that means its a good time for lunch and some other tasks
<jamest> i'll have it fixed in a jiffy
<esands> Bleedy edge code, test cycle. 8)
<jamest> normally our cvs is a little more stable
<jamest> as a few of us use it at work
<esands> er that should be, code, distribute, test, bug developer.
<jcater> yeah, but we are gearing up for a release
<jcater> hence the unusually buggy code
<derek> i thought this was free software thusly
<jcater> (and yes that was sarcastic :)
<jamest> so we're cramming as many bugs in as possible
<derek> distribute, bug developer, code, test
<jamest> test?
<jamest> what is this "test" thing you speak of?
<derek> jamest: im going on most sf projects die at the 'distribute' phase
<derek> jamest: see 'compile' in your computer science books
<derek> we call that 'testing'
<derek> if it compiles it passes the 'test'
<esands> jamest: Obviously your've been reading microsoft internal relase documentation. 
<esands> ;)
<esands> More bugs equals better product - since there is more after sale activity for them to point at and say.  Look at all our 'free support' 8P
<ajmitch> heh
<derek> jamest: let me know when designer buglet is fixed
<derek> i was sillly enough to grab cvs :)
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<Mr_You> derek, you interested in checking out hr-xml.org to see if its license may allow us to use some of their definitions?
<derek> as long as we have permission 'technically' we could use a definition
<derek> as its not code
<Mr_You> they require copyright notifications
<derek> but i dont know if its a good thing to do per say
<derek> Mr_You: rms or eben woudl be the authority to ask
<derek> but at this point unless someone is pursuing an HR package and jumping on it
<Mr_You> ok..
<derek> i would rather not go there
<Mr_You> it looks pretty GPL compatible to me but I just glanced
<derek> GPL compatiablity is pretty tough
<Mr_You> go where?
<derek> free software is pretty easy to obtain, just follow the rules to freedom
<derek> GPL compatiable is more tough as it requires something to be more copyleft and any thing that 'demands' acknowledgement or has odd verbiage is usually tossed
<Mr_You> I don't understand clearly.. it seems to me.. that hr-xml could be our HR package
<derek> i.e. many a licenses deemed non compatiable because the authors wanted some attribution or logo dispersed with code
<derek> BSD/Zope are two that come to mind
<Mr_You> pretty sure they just require copyright notices 
<derek> hr-xml during my last look ONLY had hiring portion spec'ed
<derek> i.e. they had format for resumes
<Mr_You> either way, its cool, cause if a biz wants that.. well they can do it
<Mr_You> they have a bunch now
<derek> and exchanging job availability
<Mr_You> a bunch
<derek> the rest were just in the 'talking' phase
<Mr_You> version numbers and all
<derek> much like one can look at us and say we have a lot (if you look at the webpage) :)
<Mr_You> yeah, but these are just XML files ;-)
<Mr_You> just bringing it up.. I imagine some biz will want it in the future
<Mr_You> or will require it per interfacing with Manpower, etc, etc
<Mr_You> if XML becomes what everyone wants it to be
<jcater> Mr_You: isn't it already
<jcater> after all, haven't you seen CancerCure.dtd ?
<Mr_You> heh
<Mr_You> XML will be great if too many protocols don't mess it up
<Mr_You> guess thats not so bad, just ignore the ones you don't want, but reinventing the wheel is waste
Action: Mr_You creates an XML telnet client/server.
<jamest> ok
<jamest> to run designer you do need a gnue.conf file with forms section
<jamest> it's the only app that loads multiple configs and it's not working properly
<jamest> i have to run but will tackle tomorrow
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--- Tue May  7 2002