only code I have grokked much is the stuff in src/_featuretest...which is where some experimental stuff is ie siesel's doing it all ;) well.. Action: chillywilly is working on something in src/_featuretest only thing I can think to do is use GNUe backend and customized CGI to talk to the database directly :-( same approach as DCL will I find any web code in cvs? I think I have the old code somewhere gnue.org is broken www.gnuenterprise.org seems PHPNuke is b0rked hmm? at http://www.gnuenterprise.org you get PHP errors although someone said ash was moving or something jc posted about it might be relates its fixed related hmmm yea oops funky :) Action: jcater hides Action: chillywilly blames jcater ;) Action: jcater looks around who, me? Action: chillywilly goes back to cleaning up his mess of papers on the desk/table ok will look into implenting the php forms client we have a php forms client jan wrote it yeah siesel oh oh you mean use it nevermind sigh I need gnue integrator like in a month jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) left irc: "home" anyone really know what is integrator suppoed to do? spposed darn my fingers failed me again rtfm :) there is no manual it doesn't exist only person I ever saw discuss it was da masta manual exists its on gnuenterprise.org which for some reason is down :( the old thing? Action: dneighbo_ supposes jcater dsl is down? no, he went home [19:31:24] <-- jcater has quit ("home") ? i meant re: gnuenteprrise he's hosting it? i have it tracerouting to his dsl adn stoping for right now he is (he was our official mirror) how does that work with a dsl? he's got a static IP? or you have done some other trickery? SachaS_away (~Sacha@dialup-196-159.wasp.net.au) left irc: Read error: 113 (No route to host) blame canada I blame nickr instead No! he who tells others to cast balem elsewhere should look unto thyself ;) er, blame canada is the switzerland of the west ajmitch you around a question that has bothered me the last few minutes thinking about something simliar there is a distinction between english and british english (very noticeable) they say there there is a difference between australian english and british english (but americans cant tell the difference) is there a difference between australian english and new zealand english? Action: ajmitch is around if so (can the brits tell the difference? or only the aussies and kiwis?) sure there's a difference one has many sheep references ;) you probably wouldn't notice much of a difference and sheep-like connotations but would a brit? chillywilly: yeah, the aussies are jealous dneighbo_: probably not interesting lol kiwi == wannabe uk-ster ;P south african folks sound just like brits to me, but the brits claim they dont soudn same australian/new zealand i can usually tell as brits have a more morbid, depressed twang than the upbeat aussie tone south africans are easy to tell from brits do kiwis have tyhe same kinda accent as the aussies? aussies & kiwis sound different aussies can't speak properly reinhard still claims that arnold schwazenger is from remote part of austria and sounds funny even to austrians but i think he is just pulling our legs so that when we meet him in person someday there are some south africans that have quite an afrikaaner accent he can say the "GNUe App Server is BAAACK!" and we will die laughing hehe Action: chillywilly wonders if jc has a southern accent Action: ajmitch has some south african & aussie friends no darn jamest: I was looking at a map of the U.S. the other day...I can't see how anyone would want to live in Kansas...perhaps you can tell me what Kansas has going for it? um jamest and jason both sound normal sane cost of living AZ is nice and hot but dry, WI well we get all kinds of wether, we have the packers, and lake Michigan same levels of traffic i.e. no over exagerated 'aw schucks gomer accents' ;) er sane air is mainly comprised of um, air chillywilly i wouldnt mind some parts of kansas much nice clean air Milwakee is pretty smog-free city nice and laid back Action: chillywilly can drive a couple hours north and get even better air I suppose Action: chillywilly doesn't live *in* the city anyway Action: chillywilly lives in the burbs plus if you have family in the area thats a lot of it eastern ks is fairly wooded honestly, the traffic keeps me out of anything bigger i used to commute 64 miles each way then 102 miles each way every day to work Action: chillywilly hates chicago Action: dneighbo_ remembers jamest about dying at the traffic on the 10 mile drive from hotel to downtown in SF and i was thinking wow this is 100 times better than commute to work every morning and I'm willing to bet my drive time was still less than that of big city commuters jamest: probably Action: chillywilly wants to move to montana to get away from everyone ;) theor poplation density is 0.5 people/sq. mile its 25 miles one way to work for me no traffic i make in 40 minutes moderate traffice 60 minutes, heavy traffice 75 minutes they only have 600,000 people living their 600,000 something er, there anyway, back to putzing with my papers there's about 900K people living in the southern part of NZ and that's just over half the land area of NZ there's 3.1 million in WI alone roughly heh, only 3.8 million in NZ of which 2 million are sheep right? NY has the highest density yea, what's the ratio of sheep to people? ;) jamest: 3.8 million people, lots more sheep :) lol Action: ajmitch can't recall the ratio, but it's dropping about 11:1 ratio woah 33 million sheep roughy? roughly that explains a lot ;P no 45 million got about 9 milion cows :) 33 is roughly 45 ;)...without attempting to do too much math in my head hah I should've rounded ;) jamest (~jamest@fh-dialup-201046.flinthills.com) left irc: "[x]chat" dneighbo_ (~dneighbo@65.101.4.211) left irc: "hi ho hi ho im hungry so its off to home i go" Dlakan (~Dlakan@c5-ctn-21.dial-up.net) joined #gnuenterprise. Dlakan (~Dlakan@c5-ctn-21.dial-up.net) left #gnuenterprise. Isomer (dahoose@port-62-159.jet.net.nz) left irc: Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) SachaS_away (~Sacha@134.7.3.213) joined #gnuenterprise. jdegreg ([GEKMATSvK@200.43.231.140) joined #gnuenterprise. what is the state of development of this project ? hmm I'm getting ready to work on a project for production and others are using it in production environments SachaS_away (~Sacha@134.7.3.213) left #gnuenterprise ("Client Exiting"). some parts are beta quality some are alpha quality Y'd like to see it when it hits the 'market', I mean when companies start trusting in free software well its not really about trust um companies already trust in free software not all of them of course but lots of them what is it then ?, where I live, companies only use software from where they can get support. I work at a mayor phone company in Argentina, and they even prefer to use ilegal copies of software before tring gnu software well they have ethical issues A short time ago we faced the problem of choosing a "version control system" for new software been developed outside the mainframe. you shoulod look at papo folks mostly in VB and some in HP-UX, I suggested using a CVS repository ... jdegreg: have you heard of SAP AG? many users in germany of SAP R/3 use SAP-DB which is GPL (Free Software) I havn't but that sounds very good, I think we should make free versions of known software I mean keeping compatibility but going open source ... continuing with the CVS story, they choosed MS Visual Source Safe ( because it comes with Visual Studio) even when it wasn't free, and not apropiate for a unix environment Then they found out the cost o buy licences for all the developers, and decided to go unlicenced you mean illegal? thats wacked yes, this is Argentina , .... ( I shoudn't say it ) ahh well I understand.. tough times there, but still guess its the reality there but solutions do exist in Free Software There are very poor laws about software, and even the ones that exist, are not enforced buy any government agency Of cource solutions exist well.. I'm not so much against consumers pirating software that cost $150-$400+, but a business should do not run illegally the problem is the people, old profesionals, old concepts, a lot of mainframe 'IBM' in their heads ( I mean the people taht takes the decitions ... ( I'm sorry for my english ) ..., don't get me wrong, we have very good public (free) Universities here, and many private (paid) ones that are very 'soft' The problem is the public ones push you very hard, and the private ones give you your degree because you pay, 'the customer is always right' Profesionals from thoose privete universities are flooding the market ..., and many get to desition places (ie: team leaders , area managers), that's only trouble Well I think I got out of topic .... Well folks, I'll go to sleep now, looking for inspiration ... to convince my boss of the goodnes of open source. have him talk to the vialibre folks are you near cordoba? I'm in Buenos Aires. let me dig up the url for you im sure john and co can help convince your boss Cordoba is the second biggest city. do they have experience with gnu ? chillywilly (danielb@mke-24-167-202-50.wi.rr.com) left irc: "woooooosh!" http://www.vialibre.org.ar/ LOTS hooha their boss is one that help draft legislation/letter for peru I'll have a look at their page, thank you for pointing me at them ! they all work on GNUe as well good people When I get my degree about next year, and have spear time, I want to help in some project like yours. jdegreg: just don't let em get to ya, or you'll end up as insane as they are i seen it happen (I've been working for 4 years now, in different companies, and I think there is a NEED for change.) Companies are afraid of the change because they want their data secure, then they choose Oracle, they want their programs to look good, then they coose Visual Basic, then they get stuck with the companies they have choosed for 'security' many times desitions got taken just because the salesman gives the systems manager a better 'tip' for choosing them, it's sad. I think it happens everywhere, but it could be avoided. I know from experience that companies choose VB because they know they can always hire someone who knows it. yeah thats generally why people purchase certain software.. because they know they can hire someone to work on it Yes, but that's not always the solution to their problems, anyone can programn in VB, but only a few know it upside-down, We can use any language, so they can find anyone who can program in anything. There could be a little extra training time ..., but that's it. Well, I'll leave you now, It's about 1 in the morning here, and I have to work tomorrow ... thank you for sharing your thouths. come back sometime ;-) see how easy it is to make GNUe apps ;-) I will. See you all. adios adios amigo. (bye friend) si ;-) adios amigo jdegreg ([GEKMATSvK@200.43.231.140) left #gnuenterprise. jcater (~jason@cpe-024-092-089-068.midsouth.rr.com) joined #gnuenterprise. hi jcater yo jcater (~jason@cpe-024-092-089-068.midsouth.rr.com) left irc: "Client Exiting" psu (psu@manorcon.demon.co.uk) joined #gnuenterprise. hi psu hi aj Isomer (dahoose@port-62-151.jet.net.nz) joined #gnuenterprise. hi Isomer It's kiwi time on #gnuenterprise ;-) hah dneighbo (~dneighbo@cpe-24-221-112-50.az.sprintbbd.net) left irc: Read error: 113 (No route to host) I will shortly have two Debian PCs both sharing a dial-up (not at same time, natch) yay How can I stop the laptop receiving mail via SMTP? do I just comment out smtp line in etc/services? or is there more to it than that/ s///? you could turn off the mailserver on the laptop yeah, but I might want to receive local mail as *nix programs have a habit of e-mailing root with intersting info seems all you need to do is comment out exim in /etc/inetd.conf and kill -HUP or restart the inet process hmm thnx I guess that would kill mail locally, so you may want to use hosts.allow and hosts.deny well maybe not problem is I don't want to bounce the mail - just keep it on ISP's server until I connect with the "right" machine# cause locally the app might use command line or other.. not port 25 connections Action: psu may have to sacrifice local mail in that case well I would just use the hosts.allow/deny then cause then it will function normally and send the mail when it gets a connection but keep in mind some defaults, such as it may wait 4 hours+ before it attempts after the first attempt you can override this by running sendmail -q to clear the queue what's truly bizarre is that I'vejust check etc/inetd.conf and smtp/exim is already commented out it's probably not loaded by inetd ah init? yeah Action: psu sounds like he knows what he's talking about - worrying SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-169.wasp.net.au) joined #gnuenterprise. check and see if its running yep - 169/exim I suspect init.d is loading it so I can look at that seems like debconf sets it up somewhere Action: psu is going to have to leave this & head to work soon I see got some things to check, anyway thanks for the help look at /etc/init.d/exim it checks to see if its set in inetd.conf then runs in daemon mode yeah I wish I knew how to check which things are managed by debconf ;-) np, ttyl thx again psu (psu@manorcon.demon.co.uk) left #gnuenterprise ("reinhard away == no good quit msgs"). SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-169.wasp.net.au) left #gnuenterprise ("Client Exiting"). Arturas (arturas@213.226.153.20) joined #gnuenterprise. Hello paci (~paci@212.94.129.20) joined #gnuenterprise. ciao SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-169.wasp.net.au) joined #gnuenterprise. paq (~paq@202.155.120.221) left irc: Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-169.wasp.net.au) left irc: "Client Exiting" SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-169.wasp.net.au) joined #gnuenterprise. jamest (~jamest@fh-dialup-201046.flinthills.com) joined #gnuenterprise. ariel (~ariel@ppp-217-133-241-9.dialup.tiscali.it) joined #gnuenterprise. hi all howdy hello hi Action: Arturas is away: Lunch :) jamest (~jamest@fh-dialup-201046.flinthills.com) left irc: "[x]chat" paq (~paq@202.155.120.221) joined #gnuenterprise. Action: Arturas is back (gone 00:48:29) SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-169.wasp.net.au) left irc: Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) jamest (~jamest@hobbes.math.ksu.edu) joined #gnuenterprise. dneighbo (~dneighbo@65.101.4.211) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) joined #gnuenterprise. Remosi (dahoose@port-62-131.jet.net.nz) joined #gnuenterprise. someone here tried both suse and debian? Isomer (dahoose@port-62-151.jet.net.nz) left irc: Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) Action: dneighbo has i ran suse for 2 days i didnt like it at all but that was a long time ago once you get into the groove of debian, its like an addiction You miss the little things you didn't even realize how much debian has stbain (GunAndGiz@ip68-10-44-170.rn.hr.cox.net) joined #gnuenterprise. greetz neep thank you :) Action: Arturas is going to move to debian :) Sweeeet im suprised m has forced you to yet Action: dneighbo remembers m running debian on about everything at axis cept maybe the cobalt raqs you can run it on those, too in office m is using debian dneighbo: what is rag? RAQ >dict RAQ No definitions found for "RAQ" Cobalt thinks its cute to spell things with a Q instead of a CK Jayce^ (~jayce@208.254.183.10) joined #gnuenterprise. bye :) Arturas (arturas@213.226.153.20) left #gnuenterprise. hmm the new debian installer will be awesome... just in time for debian 3.1 around 2006 :) Action: jamest loves debian but hates the lag time if moreu of the people that complained about the lag time helped instead there'd be much less. kinda reminds me of my get-rich-quick scheme I love the plan, but the lag time for the riches is starting to stink my understanding is that the lag time is starting to exist BECAUSE there's so many hands in the mix but what do I know :) argh!!!!!!!!!!!!!! well, theres an issue with too many idle/unskilled hands. hehe is there any gui mail client in existance that as friendly to the admin as pine and people not being prepared to recieve assistance and 1 maintainer per package sigh, in pine I can setup my system default to make all mail come from math.ksu.edu pine is smart enough to default the user fullname to the passwd fullname and take global imap and stmp settings all gui clients seem to expect the user to know this crap which == lots of calls to my desk pine is gui? no just fix it at the MTA it doesn't suck bad enough to warrant a gui interface mutt is gui fixing at the MTA doesn't stop the calls "um, i'm trying to read my mail and it's asking for a server to get mail from" alias mutt="xterm -e mutt" this is perfectly acceptable for a few users but not when the numbers get larger or have frequent turnover preconfigure it when you give them the computer. make their dotfiles be correct or something the point is I shouldn't have to do that sorry about the rant but its so frustrating to have to hand hold GNOME or KDE the way I do for multi-user installs Hm. imagine having all your GNUe users required to setup seperate connection files or gnue.conf files yucky very I don't agree that you shouldn't have to do that. The skel mechanism could be a little stronger though so you would like some central configuration? yes! Action: ajmitch wonders if gconf could do remote stores like that i dunno technically it could yeah,have to have system defaults overriding user options, so they can't stuff it up pine is wonderfull about handling this you have two system files pine.conf and pine.conf.fixed i have in mine say, is there an easy way to migrate foxpro apps to linux... or for the time being, compile\run them on linux? things like user-domain=math.ksu.edu smtp-server=smtp.math.ksu.edu disable-these-drivers=mbox paq: not that I know of foxpro uses some mutant dbf format, which can be exported to a real DB okay, thanks ;( ajmitch - ok, what about the apps\clients? from that db you can build forms, etc, to replace what is needed which sucks if it's a big app Action: ajmitch looks for the hacked dbf2mysql script on the server ok.. there's a whole f'in chain of apps that needs to be converted.. i guess we're doomed or something yucky it could be worse.. it could be Filemaker paq you there? there is half easy way Action: paq looks up filemaker... install postgresql yes dneighbo then on windows box install pgadmin2 then install odbc driver for foxpro on that box via pgadmin2 you can convert all your data/tables/queries etc from foxpro to postgres via point and click ah hrm... then once everything is in postgres just write forms for the tables and such conversely you could go the other way and write gnue screens for your foxpro tables sounds nice using odbc driver from gnue though i would suggest getting rid of the foxpro tables first as they are 'weak' ;) yeah... hmm... thanks much, i'll look it up sledge_ (~sledge@B2e21.pppool.de) joined #gnuenterprise. hmm, boa constructor is interesting i've only tried a very old version. have you tried it recently? ariel (~ariel@ppp-217-133-241-9.dialup.tiscali.it) left irc: "Uscita dal client" psu (~psu@manorcon.demon.co.uk) joined #gnuenterprise. hi psu hi aj I junh downloaded it it seems to work pretty well pitily not for me when i tried it about three months ago have you used cvs or 0.1.0-alpha? Nope er well I think 0.1.0 is what I have actually hrm oh yea it is 0.1.0-alpha ajmitch you heard of sonicflood yeah going to cool event with youth today ends w/ sonicflood concert http://www.azrage.com nickr: i'm surprised it works for you :) maybe it's buggy when you do things in a way that the program(mers) consider(s) "erronous" maybe sledge_ has been around dneighbo too long ;-) for www.gnuenterprise.org/irc-logs addicts I have a temp manual mirror at http://www.manorcon.demon.co.uk/irc-logs/ mainly there for GNUe Kernel Cousins purposes but anyone w/withdrawl symptoms is welcome to use 'em sledge_: I'm really only interested in the gooey builder, I'll probably use emacs to edit things once I get the gui pages all built nickr: that's good point. having to "code" a ui makes a ui sucky because you work with all your available laziness