jcater: sent you bug report from stan (WO# 101) might be same thing you guys are talking about here not sure oh, joy! another ticket? Action: jcater rushes to his inbox no that would be mean i made it workorder to save you the trouble of turning into one from a ticket muhahaha jcater: soon you wont be on irc your 'interaction' with the GNUe project will be via DCL NO SHIT evil derek Action: dneighbo envisions jcater having conversations with his friend DCL Gateway when that day comes, it will officially be time for the jcater fork :) so DCL how are you doing today, its hell at work today, msg me later and we can talk about the new work orders you have for me dneighbo: ah #101's same problem as i had jcater promised a fix, don't worry :) i verified didnt exist earlier but didnt know if you submitted or jcater did (thus the 'might be duplicate' in notes) silage rocks Action: ajmitch didn't submit, bad ajmitch ok, boys and gir... gotta stop that we have no women here ok, gentlemen in fixing this problem I think it'll be the appropriate time for me to add the tab traversal attributes to gfentry's what should this attribute be called? taborder="1" traversal="1 hmm jcaterisahottie="1" ajmitch.debian.co.nz now points to my box :) Action: ajmitch thinks taborder donuthole="1" my only problem with "taborder" is it sounds too ui-centric s/ui/gui but I can't think of anything better SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-15.wasp.net.au) joined #gnuenterprise. focusorder as tab is bad as with key maps it might not be tabs :) and arent trigger prefocus-in prefocus-out etc? Action: dneighbo thanks drochaid where ever he is nothing like a good pantera fix compliments a gnuey ;) yeah focus that's the word I was looking for Action: jcater completely didn't get the pantera / gnuey reference SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-15.wasp.net.au) left irc: Excess Flood SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-15.wasp.net.au) joined #gnuenterprise. SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-15.wasp.net.au) left irc: Excess Flood SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-15.wasp.net.au) joined #gnuenterprise. should focusorder originate at "1" or "0" or is that like me asking if I should be using vi or emacs, or kde or gnome :) 0 (btw, it's kde + kate ;) psu (psu@manorcon.demon.co.uk) joined #gnuenterprise. SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-15.wasp.net.au) left irc: Excess Flood SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-15.wasp.net.au) joined #gnuenterprise. reinhard (~rm@M704P000.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. hi good morning all hi hi psu molesters united seem to be getting beat on by everyone Leeds (who in my opinion looked bad against newcastle) beat up the molesters rather easily the other day could it be money doesnt ensure victory ;) muhahahaha molesters?!? Action: dneighbo wonders if psu gets hint im not a MU fan ;) manchester united equivalent of the New York Yankees or Dallas Cowboys oh, crap in Premier League Football reinhard is up that means I'm really late for bed time for bed :) well, or he is up early wife is gonna shoot me jcater: ja ;) well since you are dead stay up and work ;/) this is not good fr CST ppl Joke from radio today How many Man Utd fans does it take to change a lightbulb? Three one to change the lightbulb, one to buy the special Man Utd Lightbulb Changing 2002 replica shirt and one to drive the minibus from Surrey ;-) roflmao oh that is good sh really be 4 - one to buy the prawn sandwiches as well... How many chillywilly's does it take to change the lightbulb? Four. One to design the ODMG interface spec One to code the server One to code the client And One to start cursing at it until it finally works doh! Action: jcater ducks man, those are low flying trouts tonight hehe of course, I just imagine the ones about me i like that one "How many jcater's does it take to change a light bulb" "one" how many jcaters does it take to change a lightbulb 13 "You just have to get the donut in the light first" 12 to eat the dozen donuts one to change the light bulb cause dcl told him too lol well how many dneighbo's does it take to change a lightbulb? none Action: psu votes we stop referring to dneighbo as masta and use that to refer to DCL um me suspects one jcater could eat more than one donut hey my lexer works now but it takes 3 to manage the coders to do it I called it a little whore roflmao you &*&^% work damn you! crap i need to be to work early Action: dneighbo is away: sleep chillywilly: actually it helps to talk dirty to it oooooh, yoou so sexy ah so that's why SciFi called their show Lex ? heheh one can dream :) "let me run my fingers through your curvy, sensuosus python indenting..." but it's spelled Lexx ;) "oooo, can you parse my objects for me, baby?" chillywilly: oh, yeah whoop! Action: psu is away: cold shower parse this... ;P now, psu aren't you an accountant? you know DNS is a PITA to configure I thought accruals did it for accountants? "oh yea, I wann execute yout method" lemme just inherit some of that lovin chillywilly: use webmin ;-) never! then stopcomplainin cause its easy :-P heh without webmin that is psu: websites looking good! err nly thing that confuses is me is that debian by default has lcalhost and broadcast zones the website I'm not sure what to stick in them you don't need to mod them ok that's good Action: Mr_You names his zone files db.domain.com k is there any kind of convention? and I'll pile multiple db files in a domain.com dir. or is that your own? I don't recall. if anything derived from named docs the named docs suck the DNS howto and debian network admin manual are what I used ;) Action: psu is back j/k, I haven't RTFM except for those 2 docs jcater: actually, "websites" in plural will be technically correct one I manage to get www.gnu.org webmasters to reply to my e-mail... what should I get when I do dig -x 127.0.0.1? int he stupid howto it has an NS entry...I just have localhost Action: psu imagines a joke response like the old "make love" "Yeah, really dig that localhost, man..." but localhot can be NS entry fr localhost right? ;) Nick change: reinhard -> rm-away my named.conf includes primary.conf and secondary.conf which eventually will be managed by a custom app leave locahost alone ok or run make-localhost but it should have done that already http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/DNS-HOWTO-5.html I have a caching dns by default it works noe modifications needed just had to point the resolv.conf to it why do they play with localhost in section 5.2? of that howto my nameserver is chillywilly.ath.cx sscondary is chillywilly.shacknet.nu (same machine though so it is just half-assed) try whois libertyetech.com ;) it's real slow though :( chillywilly.ath.cx has a boring page yes, I know ajmitch: hey, no fair, that was the same as ash's front page for a couple of weeks ;-) Mr_You: you d the dir thing for subdomains? I think the debian convention seems to be db.domain.com ok psu (psu@manorcon.demon.co.uk) left #gnuenterprise ("I can usually freak out the Americans who realise how late it is for them if I'm off to work..."). jcater (~jcater@cpe-024-165-223-104.midsouth.rr.com) left irc: "I'm really late getting to bed!" I use the subdir for keeping track which "main domain"/account owns which domains ok Arturas (~arturas@bit.codeworks.lt) joined #gnuenterprise. Hello btami (~tamas@ip102-205.ktv.tiszanet.hu) joined #gnuenterprise. good morning hi btami hi Isomer (dahoose@port-62-167.jet.net.nz) joined #gnuenterprise. Arturas (~arturas@bit.codeworks.lt) left irc: "Client Exiting" Arturas (arturas@bit.codeworks.lt) joined #gnuenterprise. chillywilly (danielb@mke-24-167-202-50.wi.rr.com) left irc: "Free Your Enterprise! - http://www.gnuenterprise.org" Arturas (arturas@bit.codeworks.lt) left irc: "Client Exiting" Arturas (arturas@bit.codeworks.lt) joined #gnuenterprise. ninja (~rossg@rossg.dial.nildram.co.uk) left irc: Remote closed the connection SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-15.wasp.net.au) left #gnuenterprise ("Client Exiting"). ninja (~rossg@ip-195-149-26-1.nildram.co.uk) joined #gnuenterprise. Nick change: rm-away -> reinhard SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-142.wasp.net.au) joined #gnuenterprise. is latest cvs version working? i get an error from what i understand is two days old commit nihilnihilnihil (~nihilnihi@217.154.56.112) joined #gnuenterprise. I have searched google, altavista, yahoo, etc and i got just of couple of decent results. Can anyone tell me a cool website where i can find mpegs, avis and divx showing Linus, RMS, Miguel de Icaza and GNU Linux in action? hmm, you want catfight videos? i reckon you do not know where to find what i am looking for?. Have you seen Revolution OS? Revolution OS is not about catfights nope ok np, netx! nihilnihilnihil (~nihilnihi@217.154.56.112) left #gnuenterprise ("Client Exiting"). Nick change: filc_sleep -> filc Action: Arturas is away: Lunch rossg_ (~rossg@ip-195-149-26-245.nildram.co.uk) joined #gnuenterprise. ninja (~rossg@ip-195-149-26-1.nildram.co.uk) left irc: Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) JohannesV (~jve@M691P023.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) :q oops JohannesV (~jve@M691P023.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. btami (~tamas@ip102-205.ktv.tiszanet.hu) left irc: ToyMan (~stuq@smtp.dstoys.com) joined #gnuenterprise. jbailey (~jbailey@CPE014260028338.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #gnuenterprise. Action: Arturas is back (gone 01:38:05) Nick change: reinhard -> rm-away bye SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-142.wasp.net.au) left #gnuenterprise ("Client Exiting"). jbailey (~jbailey@CPE014260028338.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) left irc: "Client Exiting" siesel (root@zhonghua.sinologie.uni-bonn.de) joined #gnuenterprise. hi all derek, you here? Nick change: rm-away -> reinhard jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) joined #gnuenterprise. hello Jason :) morning hi Jan Hi Jason, hi Arturas siesel: in some log found you mentioning that windows does not support links however, in windowsNT and etc. (ntfs file system) there is support for file links i.e. it should be possible to modify setup-cvs.py to work on windowsNT ? in respect of file-system based links, yes (at least it should be :) Action: siesel is doing some cleanup of the samples directory ra3vat__: you're here? yes Hello hi ToyMan (~stuq@smtp.dstoys.com) left irc: "Client Exiting" ToyMan (~stuq@smtp.dstoys.com) joined #gnuenterprise. filc (~filc@public1-cosh3-3-cust111.cosh.broadband.ntl.com) left irc: "Client Exiting" ****************************** Arturas, siese, JohannesV and me have just decided to meet IRL we will meet at the Linux World Expo in Frankfurt which takes place October 29-31 lupo/sledge: please contact us if you read this filc (~filc@public1-cosh3-3-cust111.cosh.broadband.ntl.com) joined #gnuenterprise. we would like to invite btami, too and all other interested developers from europe like psu Action: reinhard is running out of names... details will follow after we have talked with lupo ****************************** (did i forget something?) reinhard: excellent speech :) oh, dear are you guys forming a coupe? :) "We will not take those American's crap any longer" :) you'd like so? :) of course if somebody from outside of europe wants to come he will be our special guest :) I wish I could afford it wife and I would love to go to europe but it ain't going to happen any time soon especially with our bookstore grrr [10:31] Last message repeated 2 time(s). I fixed GNUe Forms last night (lots and lots of changes) but apparently my cvs commit did not take (or I had some unmerged changes and I missed the warnings) so any Forms programmers... the bugs in cvs are fixed, they are just sitting on my home computer at the moment and it's behind a firewall, so I can't get to it :( Action: jcater curses under his breath :) did you fix do some fixes in GConnection.py? /fix/ / I don't recall working in GConnections there was a bug introduced by the netrc patch, which makes login to mysql, appserver fail. mainly I was working in GF* trying to fix the focus order crap introduced by the boxes-as-containers siesel: no, I definitely didn't work on that Action: jcater needs to get a mysql setup as we seem to be having several issues :( siesel: what's it doing? it does: loginData.setDefault("_username") which set loginData["_username"] to None, if its not defined but mysql.connect raises a TypeError if it gets an "None" instead of string so the setDefault should be replaced by "if not loginData.has_key("_username"):\nloginData["_username"]="". The same for _password Action: jcater is looking at that code what's the point of loginData.setdefault('_username') loginData.setdefault('_password') was that introduced by the patch, or was that old, I wonder? The other bug of mysql is that it creates endless resultsets. should be a problem in _getNextRecord() ToyMan (~stuq@smtp.dstoys.com) left irc: "I like core dumps" I know that it worked 2 month ago (although I don't know why and what are the changes) jcater: is the breakage in _getFocusableEntries ? The indenting? filc: no, there's a lot more than that I ended up getting rid of that function altogether I could've sworn the commit went thru last night but updating cvs at work doesn't show my changes nor did I get a commit email :( Action: jcater could kick himself Nick change: reinhard -> rm-away jcater: that loginData thing is definitly added by the netrc patch: http://subversions.gnu.org/cgi-bin/cvsweb/gnue/common/src/GConnections.py.diff?r1=1.35&r2=1.36&f=h siesel (root@zhonghua.sinologie.uni-bonn.de) left irc: "*monkey grin*" siesel (jan@zhonghua.sinologie.uni-bonn.de) joined #gnuenterprise. siesel: I just deleted those two loginData.setdefault() lines as they look completely out of place to me Action: siesel hopes that this don't create a KeyError commenting out most of _getFocusableEntries at leasts let gfcvs start what about the sample directory? Should samples stay in each applications tree or should they be moved to sample directory containing all (forms, reports, navigator) kind of samples together? rm-away (~rm@M704P000.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) rm-away (~rm@M704P000.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. or should we split all samples up in (working/usefull) and (testing/for fun) and move the first ones in the package tree and leave the testing and fun samples in each applications sample directory rossg_ (~rossg@ip-195-149-26-245.nildram.co.uk) left irc: Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) ToyMan (~chatzilla@smtp.dstoys.com) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater: I think I remeber, that you said something about using a gdb/bdb database adapter, have you do something more than planning? jcater: don't worry - this is not a release :) siesel (jan@zhonghua.sinologie.uni-bonn.de) left irc: "llater" we need to get a concensus but I think a samples/ directory in the main gnue/ tree would be best err, he's gone JohannesV (~jve@M691P023.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: "Client Exiting" speaking as a newbie i'd think that would be easy to find too ToyMan (~chatzilla@smtp.dstoys.com) left irc: "ChatZilla 0.8.7 [Mozilla rv:1.0.1/20020916]" got basic menu bar with minimal form using nstti ToyMan (~stuq@smtp.dstoys.com) joined #gnuenterprise. ninja (~rossg@rossg.dial.nildram.co.uk) joined #gnuenterprise. bye Arturas (arturas@bit.codeworks.lt) left irc: "Client Exiting" derek (www-data@alt1.libertydistribution.com) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater: samples DEFINITELY need to be outside the tool trees only because for debian packaging samples become a separate package usable vs. notusable shouldnt happen either we deem a sample useful and keep it up to date or remove it from the tree :) my two cents why python though? Action: ninja sighs stbain (~stbain@66.207.65.76) joined #gnuenterprise. greetz neep python rocks yes it does my question is 'if not python, then what? scheme or ruby ruby is probably the only really comparable language in wide use what's wrong with C? ruby i can understand scheme you are sick ninja: why on earth would you use C to do business applications? C is nearly unmaintainable (Well not as bad as perl) C has good points C is fun and challenging why not? and the performance gain starts to become minimal but not nearly as productive as python when the codig gets bad why not? a. highly unproductive I'd be like months behind schedule if I werce doing my work project in C b. large barrier to entry thats not to say C is bad because you have to think about structure and form ocnstantl/y to get a good reselt or you end up in HELL its matter of right tool for the job barrier to entry - less so than python and in python I just need to concentrate on one object ata time and I don't have to THINK about it yeah, i'm not saying either is ideal, just thinking aloud ninja: you're smoking something funny python is 100 times more readable and simple to learn than C again im not knocking C it has its place i wouldnt advocate rewritting linux in python or anything I don't agree with derek on its 'place' I *like* writing things in C, as a diversion in the same way I like doing algebra on occation just to prove I can do it :) nickr: i say for business applications its too unproductive *(or about anything gui) if it needs a gui C might not be best choice (though thats not a hard and fast rule) i've just been nosing through the appserver/src and was thinking 'oh well, looks like i'm going to have to learn another language then' i would have liked it to be like other GNU projects - written in C, blah blah but it doesn't matter too much the design looks great, so parts can always be re-implemented later ninja: fwiw we started in C at first what happened? and then didnt like what we were doing with glade so we moved to wxWindows (which was C++ or python) we all didnt like C++ so we thought we woudl give python a try hated it for a week and then fell in love then recently after a year of using python learning languages is good for you we decided to scrap our application server written in C expands the mind and migrate it to python doing so actually gave us a performance gain :) again i dont think any of the core developers 'hate' C just we dont feel its correct tool for GNUe fair comment :) now, java, thats a language we hate ;) Action: ninja has a little penchant for Java ! java has good and bad points Action: derek has aversion to perl for some reason mostly because it scares my children when i have it open in an editor yeah, i only use perl when backed into a corner I love perl for certain things I'd like a bastard child of perl and python sometimes. ahh, the rich tapestry of computer scientists I especially like perl for torturing small animals and derek Nick change: rm-away -> reinhard nickr: you mean like Parrot? Action: filc if finding GNUe is using quite a bit of python not covered in the *easy* books! hoo ha hey guys i know this doesn't apply to enterprise but i need a bit of advice i need to get commoncpp2 to load so i can complete my bayonne install but it says that my c++ compiler isn't working i have gcc any ideas? One thirng that I miss in python thats in perl is the 'io loop' like while () stuq_ (~stuq@smtp.dstoys.com) joined #gnuenterprise. stuq_ (~stuq@smtp.dstoys.com) left irc: Client Quit stbain (~stbain@66.207.65.76) left irc: "Ni!" i have no clue :) filc: i at times think we might be pressing python as hard as any other project nickr: for line in input.readlines(): probably almsot more so than zope as of late Action: filc is young jedi - learning to use the source reinhard_ (~rm@M689P021.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. actually we have decent teaching code in there and yoda, er jcater is pretty good teacher if you ask him to explain the ways of the force Action: derek thinks nickr is chewbacca (sp) based on some fotos and the occassional snarl out of the ether on topics ;) Action: derek now envisions chewie throwing a fit in star wars when going into the compactor and wonders if this is the noise nickr makes when we ask him to use distutils instead of autotools the current code is very cool reinhard (~rm@M704P000.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) jamest_ (~jamest@hobbes.math.ksu.edu) joined #gnuenterprise. StyXman (~mdione@ADSL-200-59-86-69.cordoba.sinectis.com.ar) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater: do you think that access to the GFClient would be very ugly? I need to call runForm from a trigger. ? is perlhead around? derek: no, I guess he's teaching somewhre. lemme ask yes, he's teaching somewere :) so you cant teach an old dog new tricks, but you have no problem letting the old dog teach old tricks to new dogs? (the end is near! that's one of the signs of the Apocalypsis :) StyXman: I was thinking about that last night lemme look at something real quick like Action: derek wonders how pooorly that had to translate jcater and his sabercat like code reflexes "real quick like" == US Southern Redneck for "Right now" for those unfamiliar with the redneck culture jcater: no need I guess I mean, I think that something should lay behind forms. and they pay me for do it. so I can do it and no quick hack my idea is to replace gfcvs script with something that can have a GFClient and a app configuration thing huh? and let, in some way, to forms ask for another formm using runForm for that you mean, like Navigator :) yes and no. Action: filc thinks navigator lets not go separate directions here