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<revDeke> gack
<revDeke> where are all the peoples
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<chillywilly> is big brother trying to connect to opn?
<chillywilly> there he is!
<jcater> welcome back, guy
<havoc> hell, big companies like MCI and American Airlines are in bankruptcy right now
<dyfet> was away
<jcater> chillywilly: he was trying to connect to opn :)
<jcater> but he's all better now
<jcater> gnuebot on the other hand
<jcater> is on a machien I can't access
<chillywilly> which one does loggin'?
<jcater> both do
<jcater> they are backups
<chillywilly> ah
Action: chillywilly looks up how to execute a commnd via ssh
Nick change: dyfet -> dyfet-away
<jcater> chillywilly: ssh chillywilly@whatever /path/to/whatever --whatever-options
<chillywilly> yea
<chillywilly> pretty simple
<dyfet-away> (i like the bayonne library idea...)
<ajmitch_> what lib idea?
<dyfet-away> that jcarter said earlier
<dyfet-away> (but im away...:)
<ajmitch_> ok
<chillywilly> hmmmmm
<chillywilly> stupid mail servers
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<dtm> Everyone please log in to http://voxilla.org/xoops and submit a news article containing any content as long as it's clean!  Testing!
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<ajmitch__> hmm
<ajmitch__> what happened to m y poor xchat
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<ajmitch> hi jamest
<chillywilly> damnit what's a switch for grep that will only display the filename that has the matching string in it?
<jcater> -l iirc?
<chillywilly> thanks dewd
<havoc> chillywilly: H?
<chillywilly> -l is the ticket
<havoc> ah, H prints file for each match
<havoc> I always for grep -Hnr
<havoc> do
<havoc> geez
Action: chillywilly pets xargs
<chillywilly> hmmm, seems monty-python.gnu.org has been refusing everything I've ever sent to a gnu.org list
<chillywilly> case it tries to relay frodo.libertyetech.com back to me
<chillywilly> bastid
Action: chillywilly reonfigured exim
<ajmitch> cool
<chillywilly> I'll just setup my smtp to relay for frodo that should fix it
<chillywilly> all the way back to Dec 5th
<aa_> \q
<aa_> oops... wrong one
<aa_> 'night all!
<ajmitch> night
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<chillywilly> fixed it
<chillywilly> stupid thing
<chillywilly> I needed to relay mail for 192.168.1.0/24
<chillywilly> I know I had that in there from the last time
Nick change: dyfet-away -> dyfet
<dyfet> jcarter: are you there?
<ajmitch> hehehe
Action: chillywilly looks at ajmitch
<jcater> jcater is
<chillywilly> ajmitch_ (i.e., ajmitch with a tail)
<jcater> I don't see a jcarter though
<jcater> :)
<ajmitch> chillywilly: yeah, i wish that it'd timeout
<dyfet> jcater: lol i added a r...
<ajmitch> so should i install yoper?
<dyfet> jcater: for bayonne...what would be calling it?  the app at the form level or the app server?
<jcater> um
<jcater> it would be within a trigger
<jcater> so you could do it either place I suppose
Action: jcater would be testing at the form level though
<jcater> if I did some stuff
<dyfet> jcater: if the app server can do it, and the app server is on the same machine as bayonne, you can issue a control request to bayonne's fifo directly
<ajmitch> it's funny to see yoper beating out even gentoo & debian on the www.distrowatch.com rankings
Action: chillywilly has never even heard of yoper
<dyfet> dan, i have...
<jcater> wtf is yoper?
<ajmitch> another gnu/linux distro
<dyfet> yep
<chillywilly> dyfet: good for you dave ;)
<jcater> lovely
Action: jcater hugs his debian
Action: chillywilly pets debian
<chillywilly> good boy
<ajmitch> but yoper is from NZ! :)
<chillywilly> ack!
<chillywilly> then I definitely need to stay away
<chillywilly> ;)
<ajmitch> heh
<jcater> "Yoperize stands for converting an existing Office to YOS within one weekend with no disruption to users or service. How is it possible? Watch this space."
<jcater> *snicker*
<jcater> what, an office of 1?
<dyfet> yep, matches the "army of 1"
<dyfet> jcater: so we can integrate bayonne as it stands right now...
<havoc> what is YOS?
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<ajmitch> yo
<havoc> ho
<chillywilly> ho
<chillywilly> and a bottle of rum
<jbailey> and a bottle of rum?
<chillywilly> HEH
<havoc> I was waiting for that :)
<dtm> is anyone having troubles registering a username or posting articles on voxilla.org/xoops ?
<ajmitch> nope
<ajmitch> because i haven't tried :)
<dtm> well then.
<chillywilly> HEH
<dtm> then there _will_ be......   Trouble.
<dtm> </voice type=robocop>
<jbailey> *sigh* I must be a geek.
<jbailey> I looked at that and went "But that's not valid XML.  I can see 3 major problems"
<ajmitch> heheh
<ajmitch> there's still hope!
<chillywilly> no beginning tag, no quotes, and no attributes in an ending tag
<Vee2d2> <voice type="robocop"/>   ?
<chillywilly> that's valid but his had content
<chillywilly> ;P
<jbailey> Vee2d2: Sure, but then the question is why is it empty?
<chillywilly> jbailey: :)
<jbailey> Is it bad schema?  Perhaps it should be optimised away. 
<jbailey> ;)
<chillywilly> someone yanked robo's voice box out?
<jbailey> Unlikely.
<jbailey> Probably was dead before robocop spoke.
<chillywilly> robocop can't die
<chillywilly> he's freakin' invincible
<chillywilly> :P
<jbailey> No, I meant the listener. =)
<chillywilly> ooooooh
<dtm> <jbailey> *sigh* I must be a geek.   
<dtm> They'll fix you.  They fix ... everything.
<dtm> <chillywilly> robocop can't die
<dtm> <chillywilly> he's freakin' invincible
<dtm> AND he's the star of the movie
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<ajmitch> hello
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<chillywilly> wb jcater
<jcater> thx
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<chillywilly> wb dyfet
Action: havoc kicks Atlantic Records in da nutz
<havoc> morons
<chillywilly> ok...
<jcater> did they tell you that you couldn't carry a tune?
<chillywilly> lol
<havoc> jcater: I do work for one of their clients
<havoc> Atlantic's sysadmins are fscking useless
<chillywilly> hmmm
Action: chillywilly needs more vanilla coke
<jcater> yuck
<ajmitch> vile
<chillywilly> kiss my ass
<jcater> double yuck
<ajmitch> even more vile
<jcater> is there a standard email header that indicates where bounces should be emailed to
<jcater> but normal replies go back to the sender
<havoc> no
<chillywilly> don't they all go to /dev/null?
<chillywilly> ;)
<jcater> hmmm
<jcater> I wonder if this is postfix-specific behavior
<jcater> but I sent an email to a non-existant account on my server
<jcater> the from was one of my email addresses
<jcater> and the reply-to was another
<jcater> it bounced back to my "from" address
ajmitch (ajmitch@ppp34.earthlight.co.nz) left irc: 
<havoc> jcater: Reply-To: is not always the same as From:
<chillywilly> rtfrfc
<havoc> jcater: Reply-To: is what should be used though
<jcater> hotmail does the same thing
<jcater> havoc: I realize reply-to can be different than from :)
<jcater> that was my point... I was wondering which one was bounced back to
<havoc> but Reply-To: isn't always there
<jcater> if it is email I am originating, it could be
<chillywilly> like in a properly setup email list 
<jcater> chillywilly: good idea... the rfc does answer my question
<jcater> at leastI think
<jcater> it's quite a dry read :)
<chillywilly> they usually are
<chillywilly> almost as dry as a W3C standard document ;)
<Vee2d2> are you sure? I'm almost positive I recall a few 'blah blah blah's in some w3c docs.. 
<jcater> Vee2d2: are you thinking of my dev guide? :)
<Vee2d2> yea, and my poor excuse for sarcasm.. =)
<jcater> oooooo
<jcater> rfc 822 did answer my question
<jcater> (go figure)
<jcater> I wanna use the Sender field
<derek> sigh what happened to the logs and this channel all day?
<jcater> bigbrother was trying to connect to irc.openprojects.net
<jcater> which freaks shut down yesterday afternoon
<derek> yeah that was dumb
<jcater> don't worry... it was a dead day
<derek> can you change the irc script
<chillywilly> no freaks
<chillywilly> it was about damn time
<jcater> I did change bigbrother late this afternoon
<chillywilly> it's been 5 months since the name change
<derek> as it logs onto irc.openprojects.net as well
<jcater> but I don't have access to freeloader
<jcater> to fix gnuebot
<derek> so i couldnt get in all day :)
<jcater> oh, yeah... forgot about irc script
<chillywilly> irc script?
<chillywilly> what's that do?
<jcater> www-data
<jcater> :)
<chillywilly> oh
<chillywilly> the web one
<chillywilly> where is it anyway?
Action: chillywilly wants poor man's irc
<derek> good news 
<derek> rolled out a new python app to 150 users today :)
<jcater> cool
<derek> last program my group has written that doesnt use free software is now replaced :)
<chillywilly> what does it do?
<jcater> derek: irc script should be fixed now
<jcater> if you wanna test
<derek> it basically takes a text file and writes a report for it
<derek> if i would have had more time to play i would have used gnue reports
<chillywilly> so do it know ;)
<derek> but i originally wrote the program 8 months ago
<chillywilly> er, now
<derek> and made it batch and single processing (at the time i only needed batch)
<derek> they needed it changed to single (which i figured they would so provisioned for)
<derek> so when it took about 12 hours to convert, test and deploy they crapped themselves :)
<derek> liking the free software loving :)
<derek> 10 of those hours were testing :)
<derek> so what was dyfet needing?
<jcater> integrated gnue + bayonne demo
<derek> head hurts too much to read back log
<derek> cool
<chillywilly> hmmm, I have mountain dew!
<chillywilly> wooo!
<dyfet> derek: what we talked about was the idea of having the app server trigger to bayonne
<chillywilly> why would the appserver do it?
<dyfet> because it would presumably sit on the same server with bayonne since we don't have xmlrpc yet :)
<jcater> the only advantage of having appserver do it is if the appserver and bayonne server are on same system
<jcater> of course it will probably be much easier to get an xmlrpc setup for bayonne :)
<dyfet> long term yes
<jcater> man, I have a headache
<chillywilly> drink moutain dew
<chillywilly> you're going through caffiene withdrawals ;)
<jcater> dyfet: we need to get you guys hooked up with a python module
<jcater> so we can access your stuff w/in python more easily :)
<dyfet> yes, agreed, at least for the same server hack
<chillywilly> there's a C++ Python API
Action: derek thinks not necessary to use appserver
<derek> to talk to bayonne from my talking with rich
<derek> at least for most things
<derek> i think w/in 20 minutes you could have the dialout solution done
<chillywilly> he was talking about using a fifo
<derek> its as easy as a button with a 'trigger' in forms
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<derek> that has python straight up call command line
<jcater> dyfet: how is your fifo set up?
<derek> to issue the dial out
<dyfet> it's in /var/run/bayonne/bayonne.ctrl, you just feed it statements
<dyfet> it is permission locked against group bayonne typically
<jcater> is there a document on statements that can be issued?
Action: jcater searches for his bayonne cvs copy
<dyfet> no, but the source for that part of it is very small
Action: jcater feels a quick and dirty python module coming on
<jcater> mwahaha
<chillywilly> read the source luke! ;P
<jcater> is this in C?
<chillywilly> C++
<jcater> good
<jcater> I promised myself years ago
<jcater> not to torture myself with c any longer
<derek> always C++ with dave
<jcater> life was too short
<derek> some day he will learn the power of the dark side (python)
<jcater>  /msg derek just wait.... :)
<dyfet> actually, i had looked at how we could embed python in bayonne...
<derek> i have to go to bed before my head bursts
Action: derek is away: bed
<jcater> hmmm
<jcater> if you weren't married
<jcater> and we didn't know better
<jcater> that could be read in many different ways
<jcater> man, a fresh cvs co of bayonne is big
<jcater> and chillywilly was saying y'all never did anything
<jcater> shame on you chilly
<chillywilly> what?
<chillywilly> that's not true
<jcater> j/k
<jcater> eh, cool
<jcater> I see modules/python
<jcater> a good start :)
<chillywilly> is the only c++ python api Boost.Python or whatever?
<dyfet> that allows tgi fast loading of the python interpreter
<jcater> dyfet: where would I look for this file?
Action: jcater is new to your cvs structure
<dyfet> the file you want is in server/fifo.cpp
<chillywilly> I think jcater just wants a distration from reports ;)
<chillywilly> distraction
Action: jcater wants a distraction from my new web project
<chillywilly> HEH
<chillywilly> the one using that zope-based thing?
<jcater> I have many using zope
<chillywilly> zope on a rope?
<chillywilly> ;P
<chillywilly> plone?
<chillywilly> that's what I am talking about
<jcater> yeah
<jcater> I'm testing out plone now
<jcater> the developers leave a lot to be desired
<jcater> but it seems neat
<jcater> not sure if I will use it or not
<chillywilly> what the heck does it do?
<chillywilly> give me the executive description ;)
<jcater> phpNuke for Zope
<jcater> 'nuff said
<jcater> (though at least it has a slightly better base design than phpNuke did)(
<jcater> a few commands?
<jcater> I count 22 so far
<jcater> s/22/25
<chillywilly> CMS system?
<chillywilly> what do you want with that?
Action: jcater is more interested in the community aspect of it
<chillywilly> you opening some printing indstry portal site ;)
<jcater> no
<chillywilly> hehe
<jcater> online fundraising thing-a-ma-hob
<chillywilly> aaaah
<jcater> our competitors site:
<jcater> (though it SUCKS royally)
Action: jcater deletes that from our irc logs so they don't benefit from the high-profile linking of gnue.org on google :)
<chillywilly> :)
<jcater> ahh.... censorship at its best
<dtm> jcater: well then you'll need an ecommerce engine
<jcater> dtm: yes
<dtm> dstoys just developed one for plone, and i use Interchange.
<jcater> toyman was telling me about his work w/cmfcommerce
<dtm> oh yeah i read that conversation
<jcater> which is the only rteason I was checking out plone
<chillywilly> what the heck is cmfcommerce?
<dtm> chillywilly: that's what i just said
<dtm> mentioend
<jcater> I currently use freetrade
<dtm> ecommerce engine for plone
<dtm> jcater: never heard of it
<jcater> http://www.readingathome.com/shop
<chillywilly> who wrote cmfcommerce?
<dtm> THERE IS NO FREETRADE
<jcater> dtm: old school
<dtm> ONLY INTERCHANGE
<dtm> chillywilly: dstoys contracted the plone honchos
<jcater> hasn't been developed in years
<dtm> and open src'd it
<dtm> jcater: what was attractive about it?
<jcater> dtm: easily hackable
<dtm> ooooookay.
<jcater> we sell magazine subscriptions
<jcater> which no existing ecommerce package I looked at could handle out of box
<dtm> what's special about a magazine sub?
<jcater> so we had to do a lot of hacking on whatever we used
<dtm> mhmm
<jcater> it just is :)
<dtm> oic
<dtm> well, real engines dont need to be hacked!
<jcater> plus a school and a student had to get credit for the sale
<jcater> dtm: I looked at interchange a lot
<dtm> yay
<jcater> barrier to entry looked too high to me
<dtm> i can herp choo
<dtm> oh.  as opposed to hacking the heck out of an obsolete one?
<jcater> isn't it the one that has a custom scripting language?
<dtm> well optionally, yeah.
<dtm> or perl/sql.
<jcater> dtm: it's obsolete now
<jcater> this was years ago
<dtm> you did the magazine sub years ago?
<jcater> initially in '99
<jcater> iirc
<dtm> oh.
<dtm> speakin of which, i want soda.
<jcater> I really want to get a zope based one now
<dtm> chillywilly: gimme
<dtm> why zope?
<jcater> as I'm migrating most of my other stuff to zope
<jcater> just for completeness
<jcater> this needs to tie into my customer service site, etc
<dtm> oh so you have a ton of cms type infrastructure then?
<jcater> which are already zope
<dtm> hey gimme url
<chillywilly> where's the gnue ecommerce package? ;)
<dtm> sounds interesting
<dtm> YEAH!
<dtm> chilly wanna gnue ecommerce!
<jcater> dtm: it's behind closed doors right now
<jcater> or I'd give you a link
<dtm> we wanna commerce-ize!
<dtm> o
<dtm> ok
<jcater> man, I have a headache
<jcater> dtm: the zope stuff is newer
<jcater> (not in '99 :)
<chillywilly> jcater: well staring at the monitor does not help
<jcater> stuff I'm getting ready to roll out
<chillywilly> a headache
<jcater> chillywilly: bite me
<jcater> you sound like my wife now
<chillywilly> jcater: I was being nice and concernful ;)
<jcater> and my doctor
<jcater> and my optometrist
<jcater> and my mistress
<dtm> jcater: i worked for beopen in about 99
<jcater> oh, wait
<jcater> scratch that
<chillywilly> mistriss?
Action: dtm scratches the mistress   *tee hee*
Action: jcater considers gnue to be his mistress :)
<jcater> as i spend more time w/it than work or wife or .... life
<dtm> omg
<dtm> guys
<dtm> we have to help jcater
<dtm> someone get +o and kickban him
<dtm> he is possessed!
#gnuenterprise: mode change '+o jcater' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
<jcater> mwahahaha
<chillywilly> ban yourslef
<chillywilly> ;P
Topic changed on #gnuenterprise by jcater!~jason@cpe-066-061-083-220.midsouth.rr.com: Welcome to #gnuenterprise.... beware the natives
<chillywilly> heheh
<chillywilly> topic nazis
<dtm> NAZIS?!?! WHERE?
Action: dtm fires his tommy gun into the trenches
Action: chillywilly points at jcater
<jcater> man
<jcater> the bayonne guys comment their code
<jcater> even less than we do
<jcater> I didn't know that was possible
<jcater> :)
<dtm> yes.
<chillywilly> heheh
<dtm> you mean The Bayonne Guy.
Action: dtm avoids naming names though
<chillywilly> commonc++ is well documented though :)
Action: dtm whistles and walks off, careful not to attract attention to WORLDWIDE CELEBRITY TELECOM CHAMPION KING INDUSTRY MAN
Action: dtm gets knocked over by the horde of Brazilian telecom tradeshow girls lunging after dyfet, screaming, "OOOOOO  DAVID!!  I WANT AUTOGRAPH RIGHT *HEEEERE*"
<chillywilly> lol
<jcater> man
<jcater> I need to quit this gnue nonsense then
<chillywilly> dtm: no soda for you, you're already wired
<dtm> oh crap   they were lined up in the front row for six hours before the show
<jcater> and hook up w/bayonne guys
<dtm> nono!!!  i'm always like this!
<dtm> jcater: No.  There is only dyfet!  Dyfet is more man than Mango!  You cannot have the dyfet!!
--- Thu Jan 16 2003