jcater: im torn i like modulename/schema/ somewhat better than schema/modulename/ but that is for non monolithic approach for monolithic approach probably easier to have all schemas in same tree Action: derek wants to change it i will leave it for tongith and make ti work for tomorrow so chew on it and let me know have bad headache need sleep so going ot bed for now ;) Action: derek is away: sleep Vee2d2: ok, now's our chance to really plan he's away Action: jcater ducks :) Action: derek dials ms. cater's cell number and asks "It's 1:00am do you know where your geek is?" wtf what kind of response is "At the donut shoppe and if he left TJ in bed and didnt bring him back one his ass is on the couch tonight" lol Action: derek swears it sounded like she was at drive through and i heard "woudl you like fries with your chicken strips" mmm, chicken strips that sounds good Action: chillywilly is hungry Action: derek goes to bed for real jcater (~jason@cpe-066-061-083-220.midsouth.rr.com) left irc: "Client Exiting" StevenCen (~hanlin@202.83.105.165) left irc: "Client Exiting" chillywilly (danielb@CPE-24-167-199-83.wi.rr.com) left irc: "leaving" chillywilly (danielb@CPE-24-167-199-83.wi.rr.com) joined #gnuenterprise. Vee (~vin@c66.169.136.41.ts46v-07.otn-c1.ftwrth.tx.charter.com) left irc: Read error: 113 (No route to host) reinhard (~reinhard@M1250P019.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. psu (psu@81.98.44.49) joined #gnuenterprise. heh e-mail gone to gnue & gnue-sb-discuss re the fascinating subject (to me, at any rate) of Purchase Orders Hey, if you get to play computer geek, I get to play accountancy geek, alright? I suspect I'm not subscribed to at least 1 of those lists so moderators beware! hey psu hi hmm, time for work tell everyone I said "hi" psu (psu@81.98.44.49) left #gnuenterprise. btami (~tamas@ip102-205.ktv.tiszanet.hu) joined #gnuenterprise. StevenCen (~hanlin@202.83.105.165) joined #gnuenterprise. StevenCen (~hanlin@202.83.105.165) left irc: Client Quit btami (~tamas@ip102-205.ktv.tiszanet.hu) left irc: Nick change: chillywilly -> cwzzzZZZ johannes_ (~johannes@M1250P007.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. Nick change: SachaS -> SachaS_away Arturas (~arturas@gsk.vtu.lt) joined #gnuenterprise. Hello johannes__ (~johannes@M1250P007.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) ToyMan (~stuq@smtp.dstoys.com) joined #gnuenterprise. morning all Arturas (~arturas@gsk.vtu.lt) left irc: "Bye :)" Arturas (~arturas@gsk.vtu.lt) joined #gnuenterprise. Stoke (~stoker@ppp371.tc-1.roc-pt.ny.localnet.com) joined #gnuenterprise. Stoke_ (~stoker@63.246.206.168) joined #gnuenterprise. Stoke (~stoker@ppp371.tc-1.roc-pt.ny.localnet.com) left irc: Read error: 113 (No route to host) Arturas (~arturas@gsk.vtu.lt) left irc: "Bye :)" Arturas (~arturas@gsk.vtu.lt) joined #gnuenterprise. sup ToyMan dsmith (~dsmith@borg.altus.cc) joined #gnuenterprise. Nick change: havoc_ -> havoc reinhard (~reinhard@M1250P019.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: "Don't contradict a woman -- wait until she does herself" Action: derek is away: work havoc (~havoc@CPE-65-31-171-97.wi.rr.com) left irc: Remote closed the connection Arturas (~arturas@gsk.vtu.lt) left irc: "Bye :)" Stoke (~stoker@ppp494.tc-1.roc-pt.ny.localnet.com) joined #gnuenterprise. jamest (~jamest@hilbert.math.ksu.edu) joined #gnuenterprise. havoc (~havoc@CPE-65-31-171-97.wi.rr.com) joined #gnuenterprise. dsmith (~dsmith@borg.altus.cc) left irc: "later.." Stoke_ (~stoker@63.246.206.168) left irc: Read error: 113 (No route to host) dsmith (~dsmith@borg.altus.cc) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) joined #gnuenterprise. reinhard (~reinhard@M1250P019.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. Nick change: cwzzzZZZ -> chillywilly jamest (~jamest@hilbert.math.ksu.edu) left irc: Remote closed the connection chillywilly: This *might* help: http://www.openoffice.org/files/documents/16/63/FontTroubleshooting-v2.pdf ok jamest (~jamest@gw.math.ksu.edu) joined #gnuenterprise. chillywilly: You can't do aa fonts in OOo if you are on an 8bit display, for example. I am running @ 16bpp chillywilly: Well, that's not it then. chillywilly (danielb@CPE-24-167-199-83.wi.rr.com) left irc: "Lost terminal" Vee (~vin@c66.169.136.41.ts46v-07.otn-c1.ftwrth.tx.charter.com) joined #gnuenterprise. chillywilly (danielb@CPE-24-167-199-83.wi.rr.com) joined #gnuenterprise. chillywilly: "For OpenOffice.org you need to install the fonts again manually. Go to your OO.o directory and execute the file, spadmin. Go to Fonts, Add, and choose the source directory, /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/fonts/truetype. When the fonts are visible in the window, click on 'Select All' and then 'OK'. You'll then be given a choice of copying the fonts to your OO.o directory or linking to them. Either will work." chillywilly: Here is the link (I found it!): http://theregus.com/content/4/26770.html cool interesting question on a german fs discussion list if i write a program that uses a proprietary library and distribute it under the GPL, do i violate the GPL? just make a linking exception then you don't otherwise yes I believe you do bayonne and gnu common c++ have linking exceptions to link with certain telephony drivers as i understand it the author can never violate the gpl but everyone that distributes the binary would violate the gpl as he can't distribute the complete source http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.html#TOCWritingFSWithNFLibs sure that's what would have to be done properly but the question now is what happens when somebody doesn't do this what effect would that have legally as soon as it is distributed it is in violation you wave all rights to GPL protection AFAICT it legally becomes whatever the default is in the US strict copyright is the default but IANAL :) psu (psu@81.98.44.49) joined #gnuenterprise. reinhard_ (~reinhard@M1250P019.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. revDeke (www-data@alt1.libertydistribution.com) joined #gnuenterprise. reinhard / chillywilly i think you are both close but not quite right on your analysis of the gpl problem question one must look at copyright for the root answer of this if i am not mistaken if i take a prop piece of code and link to it with code i have written and release under the GPL i own the copyright sure (to what i have written) the owner can do whatever so eventhough i might "violate" the GPL the gripe is with the copyright holder who is me it even says it in the faq so unless im into suing myself, its a moot point now if i put this up on my website for "distribution" now say i put on website for download and you download and put on your website (unchanged) for download you would be violating the GPL but again I am the copyright holder and he has to sue you Action: revDeke would suspect I wouldn't "come after you" for a violation when i am making the same violation right kinda lame ;) but mind you perhaps reinhard and his list are making a better point linking to prop. libs is bad? i GPL software so i can include other GPL software BUT link to my OWN prop software this way i can go after others using my code but still get the benefits of perhaps using theirs? Action: revDeke thinks that you wouldnt be able to use others if yours was in violation, but im not sure without some research but do you see the ill here someone like mozilla could make "pieces" that are critical prop btw: this is same problem with DUAL licensing my conclusion was like i think that companies found out that trying to short circuit leaves you on shakey ground because if you violate the rules and then prosecute others for same violations, judge will laugh at you the author doesn't violate GPL as he isn't bound to GPL (he doesn't need a license as he owns copyright) by doing dual license you achieve same effect but others who distribute binary do violate copyright em do violate GPL yes they do violate the GPL Action: revDeke thinks likely even the original author violates the license the point then was that the author who includes a prop library but unless the copyright holder chooses to do something its moot also includes other gpl'ed code and we all agreed that the author violates gpl for the "other" gpl code he uses reinhard (~reinhard@M1250P019.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: Read error: 111 (Connection refused) bye reinhard! Nick change: reinhard_ -> reinhard heh Action: revDeke needs a nap Action: revDeke runs back to the slave pit for a while vee2d2/jcater after soccer practice will try to make some of the changes to cvs structure (please decide if you want schema/module or module/schema) also will try to update roadmap adding some stuff from vin's html pages on modules with a lot of luck perhaps i can bundle a 0.1.x before the weekend er scratch that forgot will be gone all weekend maybe 0.1.x next week revDeke (www-data@alt1.libertydistribution.com) left #gnuenterprise. hmm British police to be allowed to keep DNA & fingerprints of everyone *arrested* (not convicted) http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/2890047.stm bundle 0.1.x this weekend? good god that's too early IIRC, gnue-sb depends on CVS version of GNUE tools sure the single form does :) Normally having a release depend on a CVS version of something would be ungood but this is a 0.1.0 release, so it's really only for the brave (=CVS-aware) anyway Action: jcater just doesn't understand what there is to release this weekend unless supply item maintenance is further than I realized Action: Vee2d2 just had a really good nap after doing a bunch of work in the yard all morning havoc (~havoc@CPE-65-31-171-97.wi.rr.com) left irc: Remote closed the connection as far as schema/module module/schema I'm impartial I just think either would be much better than the way it is now. I guess I can imagine that while working things out having it be module/schema would be handy, though.. maybe I'm partial to that way.. whatever though. =) ToyMan (~stuq@smtp.dstoys.com) left irc: "Client Exiting" BryanH (~bryan@12.229.128.47) joined #gnuenterprise. in the faq, it talks of an ERP salesman. We are starting a business and looking at using gnue. but are still unsure... er.. ;) I guess I don't understand why the faq keeps talking about an erp salesman. heh I wrote that that's our "alternative" FAQ ? I'm taking that as an erp (enterprise resource planner) would be a corprate figure in a larger business? not useful for a small business? hehehe main FAQ is at http://www.gnuenterprise.org/faq.html ok ERP = Enterprise Resource Planning system you would normally think of it as a computer system although I suppose it could be a person ;-) BryanH: what kind of business are you starting? Vee2d2: local tech support, still planning... BryanH: GNue is two things (a) a set of tools to build ERP software (b) the ERP software itself At the moment, (a) is well advanced, (b) less so but if you're doing tech support, definantly have a look at DCL which is a job tracking system we merged with http://dcl.sf.net yea, I saw that, I also got a woody off of the customer management and billing ;) that reminds me, I keep meaing to lurk in #dcl we are now looking to ramp up GNUe SB which is a first version of the ERP softwae itself but aimed at small business, using the tools we have at moment are you looking for more developers? version 0.1.0 is due this weekend I could probably help :) BryanH: definantly yes Vee (~vin@c66.169.136.41.ts46v-07.otn-c1.ftwrth.tx.charter.com) left irc: Read error: 113 (No route to host) what is your area of interest? The tools (Forms, Reports, AppServer)? The packages (Financials, etc) or GNUe SB? If the latter, then revDeke/derek would be keen to talk to you where ever I can help, I'm pretty indifferent. probably with sb where can I find more info on sb? as we are trying to really push dev on this BryanH: http://www.gnu.org/software/gnue-sb/ Action: psu notes he promised to put a link to this on our front page ah... php based :) cool bleh dcl is our php "rogue cousin" all the rest of GNUe is python hmm, guess it's time to learn another language :( I guess I could add to the developer faq by asking "Why not perl?" :) dsmith (~dsmith@borg.altus.cc) left irc: "later.." ToyMan (~stuq@170-215-196-63.bras01.glv.ny.frontiernet.net) joined #gnuenterprise. hehehe, jj BryanH: I think our FAQ has a "Why not foo?" for every valeu of foo from lisp to Visual Basic ;-) er... no ick so I should start by playing with dcl? theres not a whole lot in the gnue-sb cvs other than some xml files and a python script... BryanH: That's it, yes Thats pretty much what a GNUe application should look like ;-) psu: Ok, so I still need to download and install GNUe to use SB? You need the relevant GNUe Tools problem is, I think you need the CVS version of the tools For tools, reaad Forms and poss Navigator as I don;t think there are any Reprots yet Hmm is "sh: /tmp/cvswebcommitlog: Permission denied" a bad thing? seems to have worked, anyway I hate my ISP's over-helpful cache Does http://www.gnu.org/software/gnue/project/what.html have the GNUe SB logo on for anyone else? yes I hate my ISP's over-helpful cache did I mention that? i don't remember it ;-) I hate my ISP's over-helpful cache it's getting to something where I have to ssh to ash & run lynx to check things ;-/ hmm.. I thought the GNUe SB logo would be a kid (baby goat) nursing from momma.. =) Vee2d2: You've been looking at too many jcater logos night all reinhard (~reinhard@M1250P019.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: "'Hardware' defines as the parts of a computer system that can be kicked" night Remosi erp http://www.gnuenterprise.org/~jcater/goats/designer-splash.png hehehe anyway time for bed it's 22:43 here psu (psu@81.98.44.49) left #gnuenterprise. BryanH (~bryan@12.229.128.47) left irc: "ircII EPIC4-1.1.10 -- Are we there yet?" fixe (~fixe@dsl093-081-253.chi2.dsl.speakeasy.net) left irc: "Client exiting" stuq_ (~stuq@65-73-50-35.bras01.glv.ny.frontiernet.net) joined #gnuenterprise. dyfet (~dyfet@pool-141-153-149-56.mad.east.verizon.net) joined #gnuenterprise. sup dawg what's the haps bro? dyfet (~dyfet@pool-141-153-149-56.mad.east.verizon.net) left #gnuenterprise ("Client exiting"). ToyMan (~stuq@170-215-196-63.bras01.glv.ny.frontiernet.net) left irc: Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) left irc: "Client Exiting" fixe (~fixe@dsl093-081-253.chi2.dsl.speakeasy.net) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater (~jason@cpe-066-061-083-220.midsouth.rr.com) joined #gnuenterprise. jbailey (~jbailey@CPE0060082df811-CM014260028338.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater: im very much into release early release often Action: derek said if i get the items on the roadmap done would release over the weekend and then stated i would have time to do that so likely early next week basically if the contact manager works under 0.5.0 and the few items hanging out on item managemetn work under 0.5.0 there are two useful pieces for gnue-sb which is sufficient release to bottle up and let escape also there are a large number of folks that are afraid of cvs but dont mind playing Action: derek figures currently a release consists of a few liner notes and tar ball so its not like a ton of effort would go into a release at this stage jcater: you never weighed in on module/schema or schema/module Action: derek thinks module/schema fits better with the structure in place but suspects it will be more annoying to deal with schema stuff for install purposes though i guess a base level schema.gsd should fix that :) Action: jcater would prefer module/schema ok will start looking into the change now this is when i HATE cvs as would be better to move on the server but far more a pain in the arse although jbailey is around ;) and you have permissions to do so :) I can dsmith (dsmith@oh-strongsvillecadent1-1d-224.clvhoh.adelphia.net) joined #gnuenterprise. well actually looking at it i guess its not a huge deal as schema/ is the only dir out there if you want to move it about go for it Action: derek thinks its worth keeping schema/ dir and have schema.gsd and the PgSQL/MySQL/Oracle dirs stay and that will be the :installation: place for people to go to install whole shooting match the module/schema dirs will be almost a developer only thing why separate directories? for PgSQL/MySQL/et al? jcater: no need for separate dirs i suppose Action: jcater is curious, not critical most cause whacking dirs in cvs is a bitch i.e. they never die :) if you can get them to die then oracle.sql, postgres.sql mysql.sql etc are fine by me actually let me rethink that directories "might" be better depending on how upgrades are done as we need 'upgrade' paths if those require additional schemas then PgSQL/ might have 0.1.0.sql 0.1.1.sql 0.2.0.sql gack 0.2.1.sql current.sql PgSQL.0.1.0.sql? if new install you use current.sql cartoon network has revised Scooby Doo cartoons that's blasphemy if upgrading from 0.1.0 to 0.2.0 you would apply the 0.1.1 then the 0.2.0 j/k sigh where the fsck is my W2? hold on did one of you take it? we have an appointment with the BuyOwner.com dude tomorrow to hear his suggestions about marketing this house s/the/a/ ? oh my xchat wrapped at "about marketing this" Action: jcater was trying to figure out how buyowner.com was going to market gnue-sb anyhow reschema stuff let me know i dont think what i stated is the 'best' way to do upgrades but until gsd spec has upgrades and we can do everything 'programatically' we need something also even if programmatically i expect it will read gsd (or some format) files to know what to upgrade jcater: i have time and am willing to do work so tell me if you are moving on server or if i should move here if you are moving i will go eat dinner and watch my basketball games and check back every so often to see when done so i can knock off other items on the roadmap I can do um it'll take like 60 seconds well assuming savannah isn't down :) rofl ok contact* and item* moved but I'm not sure where others go mikey i like it this is pretty much what i was asking for in the "requirements" docs for those module pages for the website i can then take those bullet points and add into the feature plan(road map) and start workign on them what are the account* tables? ok account_* are probably equivalent of company_ or client_ Action: jcater wonders if we need a sys/ "module" Action: derek ripped straight from dcl (which calls them account) i dont like 'account' cause when you have an accounting system it gets confusing ;) so while it works for dcl it dont work for ERP very Action: jcater would like to see us use table prefixes, personally if you can change them to client er company and make a company directory and put them there it would work company directory? jcater: im ok with prefixes (im verbose i cant help it) well we will need company management if you have different name for it that is fine by me this seems like a part of contact manager almost i explained to mike in irc my view on this Action: derek knows people will disagree but tough beans :") contact management is "people " companies have contacts but so do vendors and manufacturers etc clients have contacts as well sometimes its a one 2 one i.e. company has one contact sometimes a company has two hundred contacts the contact manager is a "larger" application that lets you view the contacts of every type in a single location yip.. Action: derek hopes that makes sense gack a rolodex as you dont want your contact manager doing vendor management and you dont want to have to go into vendor management to find someone's phone number Action: derek gets feeling jcater doesnt like gnue-sb and will eventually roll his own Action: jcater doesn't disagree with the central rolodex idea but doesn't see how companies are a separate module/entity/etc vendors, sure what is personnel? and store? jcater: a lot of that stuff came over from dcl the rest is from unlimited engineering stuq_ (~stuq@65-73-50-35.bras01.glv.ny.frontiernet.net) left irc: "Client Exiting" if you move the item and contact i will clean up the rest and if i need you to 'move' it i will tell you bbiab.. kid's bath time and whatnot.. is there any difference between an accounts payable vendor and a supplier in the items system? Action: jcater would assume not I use supplier and vendor are interchangably s/are// memmett (~user@sputnik.emmett.ca) joined #gnuenterprise. jbailey (~jbailey@CPE0060082df811-CM014260028338.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) left irc: Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) jbailey (~jbailey@CPE0060082df811-CM014260028338.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #gnuenterprise. Vee (~vin@c66.169.136.41.ts46v-07.otn-c1.ftwrth.tx.charter.com) joined #gnuenterprise. jbailey (~jbailey@CPE0060082df811-CM014260028338.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) left irc: "Client Exiting" chillywi1ly (danielb@CPE-24-167-199-83.wi.rr.com) joined #gnuenterprise. chillywilly (danielb@CPE-24-167-199-83.wi.rr.com) left irc: Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) --- Fri Mar 28 2003