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<LuftHans> cw: re backing out, no biggie for me, doesn't affect me as neither works, but if it's more borken than it was I figured he might want to back it out until he fixes it the way he wants it fixed
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<Vee2d2> hey der derek
<derek> hola senor vin
Action: derek has to get ready and go into work for a bit (sigh)
Action: Vee2d2 starts a full time position at the office monday
<derek> switched broadband providers and moved my offices to another room
<derek> might actually be around some, eventually
<Vee2d2> that would be neat.. ;)
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<chillywi1ly> hi
<Vee2d2> 'sup
<chillywi1ly> workin'
<Vee2d2> no you aint.. ;)
<Vee2d2> bah
<chillywi1ly> whatever
Action: Vee2d2 is fighting with exim this morning
<chillywi1ly> who's winning?
<Vee2d2> exim :(
<chillywi1ly> what are you trying to do?
<Vee2d2> at first I was simply trying to forward messages for a certain host to an alternate server
<Vee2d2> I've since upgraded to exim4 and am poking around
<chillywi1ly> ok
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<Vee2d2> weee?
<jcater> upgrading kde
<jcater> had to restart my kde session with a new memory
<jcater> as the old auto-startup memory
<jcater> accidentally had a link to one of my banking sessions
<jcater> they locked me out of my account last week because of several attempted accesses to old sessions
<jcater> (thought I was trying to break in :(
<jcater> Vee2d2: fulltime work on monday?
<jcater> is this happy news?
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<btami> hi
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<Vee2d2> jcater: hehe.. 
<Vee2d2> jcater: yea good news $$.. 
<dcmwai> hello Vee2d2
<chillywi1ly> yo
<dcmwai> hello chillywi1ly
<dcmwai> hello jcater any good news :)
<Vee2d2> heyas
<dcmwai> jcater, what is the status now on our cooperation merge?
<dcmwai> if you are waiting for josh, I'll be saying that it will be slow, cause I was the one doing most of the code change and debug (but not verifing/QA :)
<dcmwai> can josh didn't have must time as well 
<dcmwai> s/can/and
<chillywi1ly> a lot of gnu.org is down today
<chillywi1ly> mail and www
Action: dcmwai is not telling that josh isn't good but just slow abit.
<dcmwai> chillywi1ly, what happen hacked?
<chillywi1ly> dunno
<LuftHans> is gnaps.net the last hope before {gnu,fsf}.org?
<LuftHans> Looks like they have a routing loop or whatever's next isn't on the air
<LuftHans> 16  * qcy1-rs2-g8-1.gnaps.net (199.232.44.18)  144.242 ms  126.111 ms
<LuftHans> 17  * qcy1-rs2-g8-1.gnaps.net (199.232.44.18)  127.824 ms !H  133.300 ms !H
<jcater> dcmwai: I'm knee-deep in personal stuff
<jcater> end of months are rough
<LuftHans> jcater: it's no longer the end of the month, you survived :)
<dcmwai> jcater, I see. derak as well? hum look like that we are all busy :)
<jcater> LuftHans: yip
<LuftHans> derek just redid his home office and appears to mostly be not Net connected right now :(
<jcater> and now I can catch up on the sleep
<dcmwai> jcater, me too :)
<dcmwai> anyway... if it is about code on aria, you could always get me for it
<dcmwai> Josh mostly will disscuss with you guys about the structure and freamwork...
Action: dcmwai will have to learn python Ah... another new languages... :( after C, Perl, PHP now is python...
Action: dcmwai cna onlt start from scrach only on "C" other then that, he can only do some edit (small)
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<dcmwai> Ok time to sleepp :)
<dcmwai> tata
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<dneighbo> LuftHans: i have a connection in the office now (since yesterday)
<dneighbo> just swamped with work and real life :(
<dneighbo> thus why i havent responded to your email either :(
<chillywi1ly> excuses...
<chillywi1ly> ;P
<LuftHans> Derek: well, I'm making progrss on the PHP side :)
<LuftHans> bbiab
<LuftHans> probably pretty soon as I'm going outside to do some strenuous work
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<ajmitch> hi jamest
<jamest> hello
<chillywi1ly> yo
<ajmitch> jamest: you have example code for datasources & use of common outside of forms?
<jamest> no example of datasources outside of gnue
<jamest> but I did start a dev guide for common
<jamest> it's in cvs
<chillywi1ly> hmmm, if I am on the gnue lists why don't I ever get any mail?
<jamest> and I can provide more examples
<chillywi1ly> no one has sent anything?
<chillywi1ly> I find that hard to believe
<jamest> chillywi1ly: we filter you
<chillywi1ly> thanks
<chillywi1ly> less shit to read
<jamest> no need to thank us
<ajmitch> jamest: ok
Action: chillywi1ly hurls the trout of death at jamest 
<ajmitch> jamest: examples from devguide didn't really work for me :)
<jamest> ah
<jamest> what you want to use?
<ajmitch> I wasn't sure if it was up-to-date
<jamest> it's probably not
<ajmitch> I mainly want to have use of the datasource stuff from other apps
<jamest> i can probably update tonight if wife/kids watch trading spaces
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> .sxw file in cvs?
<jamest> yes
<chillywi1ly> I think ajmitch should update it ;)
Action: ajmitch has OOo 1.1rc if that's required to read it
<jamest> 1.0.3 workds
<ajmitch> but I'm just a lowly newbie
<ajmitch> ah ok
<chillywi1ly> you complain about it, you update it
<chillywi1ly> ;)
<chillywi1ly> isn't that the rule?
<ajmitch> is there a reason why chillywi1ly is harassing people here?
<chillywi1ly> cause I love you all vewy vewy much
<jamest> is had a rough life
<jamest> s/is/he's
<jamest> i don't have any examples of datasources outside gnue
<jamest> as i've not created a app that needs that level of complexity outside of gnue
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> that's fine :)
<jamest> what failed on the exmaples?
<chillywi1ly> "outside of gnue"?
<jamest> yes, outside of gnue
<ajmitch> cannot recall, it was a few weeks ago
<ajmitch> something to do with phaseInit (from example)
<chillywi1ly> what's a datasource that is outside gnue?
<jamest> hmmm
<jcater> chillywi1ly: a lonely datasource
<chillywi1ly> heheh
<ajmitch> a datasource not used by forms but by other software
<jamest> i don't do that
<ajmitch> ok
Action: ajmitch blames jcater for the misinformation
<jamest> as most my data aware apps don't need the power of datasources
<jamest> if I'm doing data processing I just use the standard python DB api
<ajmitch> yeah
<jamest> and use std sql statemetns
<chillywi1ly> you don't use forms?
<ajmitch> there is that option
<ajmitch> chillywi1ly: not everything needs to be forms-based
<chillywi1ly> well, duh
<chillywi1ly> ;P
<jamest> i have apps that transfer shipping info (like tracking numbers) up to a web database so customers can track status of order
<chillywi1ly> I see what your asking about now
<chillywi1ly> non-forms use of datasources?
<ajmitch> yes
<chillywi1ly> did you look in the appserver?
<ajmitch> nope
<chillywi1ly> geasBClass.py:from gnue.common.datasources import GDataSource,GConditions
<chillywi1ly> geasBClass.py:    self._datasource = GDataSource.DataSourceWrapper(
<chillywi1ly> geasList.py:from gnue.common.datasources import GDataSource,GConditions
<chillywi1ly> geasList.py:    self._datasource = GDataSource.GDataSource ()
<ajmitch> thanks
<chillywi1ly> from gnue-appserver/src
<chillywi1ly> your welcome
Action: ajmitch will take a look later - gotta do uni work now
<jcater> gnue-pos uses datasources
<jcater> fairly simplisticly
<jcater> I used them just last week in something new
<jcater> and I can't remember what....
<chillywi1ly> in geasList the "popoulate" method for popoulating a list looks to be straight forward
<chillywi1ly> populate
<jcater> yes, I do
<jcater> hang on....
<jcater> ajmitch: what's your email
<ajmitch> ajmitch@ihug.co.nz
<jcater> sent
<jcater> hope you can make sense of it
<ajmitch> thanks
<jcater> it's internal
<jcater> off to dinner.....
<ajmitch> see ya
<chillywi1ly> so no one made the big alias package to hold all the cvs modules ;)
<chillywi1ly> alias module
<jamest> ajmitch: if you figure it out and can make a simple sample for the dev guide i'd appreciate a copy
<jamest> fwiw: i'm de-typoing the guide now
<chillywi1ly> "use the datasource api by ajmitchie"
<chillywi1ly> ;)
<chillywi1ly> using
<jamest> ajmitch: dev guide samples all work for me now and it's updated in cvs
<ajmitch> alright
<ajmitch> I'll take a look
Action: ajmitch thinks he may have been looking at an old pdf version
<dneighbo> LuftHans: so you decided to forge forward on the unmaintainable mess called php?
Action: dneighbo suspects it could be worse you could use bash scripts or perl ;)
<chillywi1ly> how much perl have you written dneighbo ?
<ajmitch> http://linuxtoday.com/infrastructure/2003080100426OSHLSW
<ajmitch> fun
<jamest> LuftHans: i just committed a different way to get the count that should work with distinct
<LuftHans> jamest: cool, danke
<jamest> any chance you could test?
<LuftHans> derek: PHP isn't unmaintainable and at this point if I'd put the time into bash scripts I'd be further along than I am with GNUe
<LuftHans> I want to GNUe, I'm trying to use GNUe, but I haven't gotten to the point where I can create something simple to hand off to end users
<jamest> LuftHans: whatcha building?
<LuftHans> jamest: thus far some test stuff just to wrap my brain around how GNUe works
<LuftHans> in the end I'm replacing an inventory thingy for a customer
<jamest> in php?
<LuftHans> another customer needs some report generation and yank-it-out-of-storage stuff
<LuftHans> $cus2 is planning on using in house devel resources and either java or PHP, but if I'll bid to do it in GNUe if I can get it working well enough :)
<chillywi1ly> did they ever update the OOo package in debian or are people still installing from tarballs off the OpenOffice site?
<LuftHans> the test stuff are similar to what I already did in PHP last year when I was learning PHP
<jamest> 1.0.3 is newest in woody
<jamest> 1.2beta2 is in sid IIRC
<jamest> er 1.1
<chillywi1ly> cool
<LuftHans> cw: there's probably an unofficial site, www.apt-get.org
<jamest> LuftHans: did that work w/ your distinct?
<LuftHans> when I get stuck in GNUe and no one's around I start working on it in PHP
<LuftHans> jamest: hold on, I've got to cvs up and set it up again
<jamest> ok no pressure
<chillywi1ly> hmmm, I have 1.0.3
<chillywi1ly> hmmm, new packages
<jamest> http://www.linux-debian.de/openoffice/mirrors.html
<jamest> i think I foudn the 1.1 stuff somewhere there
<chillywi1ly> well do you have an apt line for it?
<LuftHans> should I use python 2.2 or 2.3?
<jamest> deb http://ftp.freenet.de/pub/ftp.vpn-junkies.de/openoffice/ unstable main contrib
<chillywi1ly> ok
<jamest> LuftHans: i haven't tried 2.3 yet
<jamest> 2.2 should work
<LuftHans> ok, I'll stick with 2.2
<LuftHans> BTW, I generally have to run them all with LANG=en_US because the apps bork with de_DE
<jamest> ?
<jamest> what do they do?
<LuftHans> jamest: that fix works, still get an extra record on the end, but at least it doesn't throw errors and lock up
<jamest> extra record on the end?
<jamest> in the dropdown?
<LuftHans> jamest: depends on the tool, some won't even start, some bork up once you're in them ( mostly just using gfdes and gfcvs, though )
<jamest> :(
<LuftHans> yeah, when there's only a single match it work correctly
<LuftHans> when there's 2 or more matches ->| goes to the last record, but -> can go one more, not quite to 11, but still one more :)
<LuftHans> once you've gone to 'one more' ->| will also go to one more
<jamest> in the main form?
<LuftHans> yeah
<jamest> ah, it auto creates new records 
<jamest> unless
<LuftHans> two datasources, two blocks
<jamest> do
<LuftHans> first dts is the prequery=y and distinct=y to fill in the dropdown, the dropdown calls createResultSet({'name': self.get()}) on the second datasource
<jamest> gfcvs --configuration-options  | more
<jamest> does the 1st option (AutoCreate) describe what you're seeing?
<LuftHans> that would be a cool option to have in girlfriends
<jamest> lol
<LuftHans> being able to back out a revision after making a mistake would be outstanding as well :)
<LuftHans> branching would probably cause too many problems, though...
<LuftHans> bah, why have more when you can have less!  :)
<LuftHans> jamest: what're you looking for in that output?
<LuftHans> or what am I looking for? :)
<jamest> I'm wanting to know if AutoCreate option describes what you're seeing
<LuftHans> Create new records in blocks automagically when you hit 
<LuftHans> the bottom.
<jamest> yes
<LuftHans> it's set to 1, so I guess so
<LuftHans> how do I turn that off?
<LuftHans> why doesn't it work on singles?
<LuftHans> you have to have two to procreate?
<jamest> i just don't understand what you're describing
<jamest> it works on single datasource too
<jamest> to shut off
<jamest> vi ~/gnue/etc/gnue.conf
<LuftHans> if only one record is returned none of the next/prev arrows are available
<jamest> [forms]
<jamest> autocreate=0
<jamest> LuftHans: that sounds like a bug
<LuftHans> ok, set AutoCreate=0 in gneu.conf and restarted gfcvs
Action: chillywi1ly waits for OO 1.1beta2
<chillywi1ly> la la la
<LuftHans> now it won't go beyond the number of returned records, but -> still stays active at the end
Action: LuftHans dccs chillywilly the library of congress in parrallel by author.
<jamest> definately bugs 
<LuftHans> singles still have no available next/prev arrows
Action: chillywi1ly does not accept LuftHans's dccs
<jamest> lemme take a look
<LuftHans> bugs that don't get in the way, but you can't fix 'em if you don't know about them
<jamest> yip
<LuftHans> I filed a bug report against forms the other day for this bug
Action: jamest doesn't remember how to read the bug reports
<jamest> been playing hookie too much
<jamest> :)
<jcater> ajmitch: my file make any sense?
<jcater> sorry it didn't have comments... it wasn't really for anyone to see but me
<jcater> (not that I comment my public code either =)
<chillywi1ly> bah
<jamest> gack
<jamest> is there a way to bulk delete tickets in dcl?
<LuftHans> rm -rf $dcl_home
<jamest> unless forms now supports features that would involve
<jamest> 237284 Youngest girls videos! 248424481
<jamest> 237519 Gain 3+ Full Inches Guaranteed! 314315782
<jamest> etc
[21:37] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
<LuftHans> I could use the gain 3+ inches as my hair isn't long enough
<jamest> lol
<chillywi1ly> you hippie you
<chillywi1ly> I think reinhard is a long haired hippie too
<chillywi1ly> ;)
<LuftHans> took me 30 years, but I turned dad into a hippie :)
Action: LuftHans == langobart
<chillywi1ly> langobart?
<LuftHans> one of the original Germanic tribes, the name means 'longbeard' :)
<chillywi1ly> heheh
<chillywi1ly> so you got the ZZtop look going for ya?
<LuftHans> kinda, but my hair is curly
<chillywi1ly> pic? ;)
<LuftHans> nope
Action: LuftHans keeps pictures of himself off the Net.
<chillywi1ly> hah
<dneighbo> yeah run a report on tickets or whatever you want to bulk delete
<dneighbo> click the check boxes
<dneighbo> and click delete
<dneighbo> LuftHans: i forget cvs is still pretty buggy
Action: dneighbo was happy with the 0.5.0 release
<dneighbo> despite its shortcomings it was fairly solid
<dneighbo> still buggy GNU Enterprise is less painful than php
<dneighbo> btw: i like php, just not for non website type of stuff
<dneighbo> i.e. real applications deserve more than a weblication :)
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<chillywi1ly> http://www.kak.ru/images/news/030717/index.html
<jcater> I think cvs forms is no less stable than 0.5.0
<jcater> designer on the other hand has probably doubled it's featureset
<jcater> I don't think it's any less stable than 0.5.0
<jcater> but there's more opportunity to hit a bug now
<jcater> =)
<chillywi1ly> HEH
<LuftHans> derek: the debs didn't want to install due to lack of something2.3
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<Vee2d2> cvs designer's a lot stabler than 0.5.0 was, IMO
<jcater> Vee2d2: thanks
<jcater> still has a ways to go though
<LuftHans> DB000:   File "/home/lufthans/lokal/sandbox/projekte/gnue/.cvsdevelbase/gnue/forms/uidrivers/wx/common.py", line 111, in _processEvent
<LuftHans> DB000:     self._eventProcessor('requestFOCUS',gfObject,_form=gfObject._form)
<LuftHans> DB000:   File "/home/lufthans/lokal/sandbox/projekte/gnue/.cvsdevelbase/gnue/common/events/EventController.py", line 88, in dispatchEvent
<LuftHans> DB000:     handler(event)
<LuftHans> DB000:   File "/home/lufthans/lokal/sandbox/projekte/gnue/.cvsdevelbase/gnue/forms/GFInstance.py", line 859, in changeFocus
<LuftHans> DB000:     message = event._form.changeFocus(newEntry)
<LuftHans> DB000:   File "/home/lufthans/lokal/sandbox/projekte/gnue/.cvsdevelbase/gnue/forms/GFForm.py", line 294, in changeFocus
<LuftHans> DB000:     if len(self._currentEntry.getValue()) < self._currentEntry._field.min_length:
<LuftHans> DB000: TypeError: len() of unsized object
<LuftHans> this is using the dropdowns in gfcvs, once a query is made I can go through the records that were returned, but I can't use the dropdowns again
<LuftHans> well, actually, clicking on any field causes that error
<chillywi1ly> *joy*
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<fui> hi
<LuftHans> hallo
<fui> i want to develop gnuenterprise
<LuftHans> cool!
<LuftHans> are you wanting to help improve gnue or wanting to use it?
<fui> both, i think
<LuftHans> I'm just someone new trying to learn how to use it
<LuftHans> those working on developing it were here a while ago, but all have fallen silent
<fui> why do you want to use gnue?
<LuftHans> well, I want an easy interface for building basic apps and I want a good Free Software business suite
<LuftHans> also, I know Derek
<LuftHans> apparently everything's Derek's fault :)
<fui> i want a common framework for developing apps, that also work thru browsers
<LuftHans> GNUe's forms are based on XML, so they can also be used for web-based stuff
<LuftHans> there's a PHP engine for parsing the GNUe DTD, but I'm told it's out of date
<fui> browsers are a GNUE forms client?
<LuftHans> once I get proficient with creating the apps and get an initial deployment with my customer I intend to work on updating the PHP parser
<LuftHans> once the PHP parser's been updated to work with the new DTD, from what I understand
<LuftHans> I really don't understand it well enough to be helpful, so don't trust what I say :)
<fui> ok
<LuftHans> the default forms engine is a python app that run on *NIX and m$ platforms. It might work on OS X, I'm not sure
<fui> which version of python works with the most recent rel?
<LuftHans> it can connect back to the database via ssh or other vpn tunnel (I'm told), so you have a secure connection
<LuftHans> 2.2
<LuftHans> I'm pretty certain that's the minimum requirement right now
<LuftHans> GNUe will work with lots of databases, but I've only used it with PostgreSQL at this point
<fui> and the orb?
<LuftHans> as in corba?
<fui> how does a web app connect to gnue?
<LuftHans> the XML form includes datasources, but I'm not sure what the mechanism is for a browser to connect
<LuftHans> it might all be tunneled over http
<fui> ok
<fui> do u know if python2.3 will be ok?
<LuftHans> one of the main developers today told me he hasn't tested with 2.3, so I don't know
<LuftHans> I'm not certain how much python changes between releases
--- Sun Aug  3 2003