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<alandd> derek: I have confirmed that the gnue ipaq is running bootldr 2.18.54 and familiar 0.6.
<alandd> I cannot update to familiar 0.7 without the serial cable because I have to update the bootldr.
<alandd> the gnue unit can read an ATA card with the sleeve from Austin.  I am still charging them together.
<alandd> the fonts in familiar 0.6 are UGLY!  I hope 0.7 is better.
<alandd> BTW, Austin's ipaq has the same version bootldr so I can't update that one either.
<alandd> I am updating my log of the whole affair.
<chillywilly> anyone know the POP command for retrieving an email?
<chillywilly> LIST shows the emails
<chillywilly> with an index no. and its size
<ajmitch> RETR
<chillywilly> thanks ajmitch 
<ajmitch> using the number that list gives you
<ajmitch> iirc
<chillywilly> yep, it works
<chillywilly> thanks
Action: ajmitch runs off to LUG meeting
<chillywilly> doing email confirmation crap
<derek> alandd: cool
<ajmitch> actually by the sound of the rain out there, I might skip the LUG meeting tonight
Action: ajmitch woudl have to walk 30min to the meeting place
<alandd> derek: does gnue have a wiki or like functionality somewhere?  I could update my progress online as I go.
<chillywilly> lol
<chillywilly> alandd: harass him to put one up ;)
<chillywilly> wiki! wiki!
<alandd> I setup TWiki in about 20 minutes on a server at work.  It has automatic version control of every page!  Pretty slick so far.
<chillywilly> yea, well so far derek has been anti-wiki and that's why I thought it was so funny that yet another person is requesting a gnue wiki ;)
<chillywilly> muwaahahaha
<alandd> hey, I can do a page on my personal web space.  Just thought it would be good on under the gnue umbrella.
<alandd> wiki, blog, whatever.  a gnue based page that I could update as I go.
<derek> alandd: no im kind of wantin gone
<derek> we have hated them for so long we avoided them
<ajmitch> kind of?
<derek> i.e. one more thing for us to maintain
<ajmitch> would this be a public access wiki or just for coders?
<derek> i would like a public access wiki with emacsbot :)
<derek> who understands wiki
<derek> anyone want to set one up
<derek> alandd: which one did you use?
<alandd> TWiki allows access control by group and pages.  read and write access.  you could have public areas and public read only, coder writable areas and coder only areas.
<alandd> TWiki  twiki.org
<LuftHans> use moin, moin :)
<alandd> looks more complicated than it is.  well documented.
<derek> pooh...
<derek> none worth a crap in woody
<derek> and that be what our server runs
<derek> wtf is wrong with my machine....
<derek> freaking cpu is getting chewed on
<alandd> I think it is perl based.  There is a page with the requirements all deliniated.  I would think woody has that stuff.  My RedHat 7.3 box that is running TWiki already had all the dependencies.
<LuftHans> well, if you have gnue on the machine you could run MoinMoin since it's in python
<alandd> yea, but it's all in german and who needs that!  ;^)
<alandd> LuftHans: did you fight your way through the banana bread and find the ipaq serial cable?  I need one.
<derek> LuftHans: its not that i could get it
<derek> its that i cant apt-get it :)
<derek> real admins use packages :)
Action: derek isnt a real admin, but will get thumped by some if i start installing crap from source :)
<derek> i'll be right back X needs a good kick in the marbles
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<derek> sadly it appears my music streaming is painfully slow under kde
<derek> so not an X thing
<LuftHans> alandd: found a different cable, but not the one you need
<LuftHans> derek: well, if you've got the python you need for gnue on th box you should be able to apt-get -t testing moin  :)
<derek> hmmm is moin moin dead?
<derek> no releases since 2002
<LuftHans> generally I don't like wikis, but for a project like this they can be quite useful
<derek> LuftHans: i like moinmoin best you dont have to sell me on it
Action: derek loathes perl anything
<derek> while twiki looks very nice... im not touching anything perl tonight
<LuftHans> got a good description of infobot the other day, looked interesting
<LuftHans> http://www.infobot.org/
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<LuftHans> derek: I just like the name :)
<derek> grrrr
<derek> dneighbo@ash:~/public_html/moin$ ./setup.py --help
<derek> Traceback (most recent call last):
<derek>   File "./setup.py", line 15, in ?
<derek>     import distutils
<derek> ImportError: No module named distutils
<derek> dneighbo@ash:~/public_html/moin$
<derek> appears don't have python-dev on here
<alandd> LuftHans: So, I'm on the hunt for a serial cable, huh?  Good to know.
<LuftHans> derek: does moinmoin do revisioning control?
<LuftHans> alandd: I still have a cabinet to dig through, was preparing for the teaching gig tonight
<LuftHans> maybe after dinner I'll get to it
<alandd> No big deal.  Just remember that I am currently stuck, bogged down and no longer progressing for lack of a serial cable.  No hurry, though.  ;^)
<LuftHans> speaking of words so good you have to say them twice...
Action: LuftHans makes couscous for dindin :)
<LuftHans> alandd: cool, you can work on the PLUG web site :)
<LuftHans> and the KJZZ project, and the ....  ;-)
<chillywilly> g'night freaks
Action: chillywilly beats derek with the camel book as he goes to meet the sand man
<LuftHans> hmmm, maybe I can use infobot for my addressbook...
<derek> hmm moin moin doesnt appear to want to install in a home directory properly 
Action: derek really hates cgi crap
<LuftHans> well, get one written in PHP :)
<LuftHans> infobot as a portal to /. and google :)
<LuftHans> blootbot does: Debian Contents and Packages, search and info., Wide range of statistics for Bot, Factoids, IRC, Debian. (status, factstats, ircstats, chanstats, cmdstats)
<LuftHans> gotta figure out how to get ircii to connect to two irc daemons at the same time...
<derek> hmm ok seems was some ExecCGI directive to add to apache
<derek> fixed that but now get internal errors
<derek> doh freaking quote on wrong side of bracket
<LuftHans> ah, found it again
<LuftHans> equivs - Circumventing Debian package dependencies
<derek> grrr i really hate cgi
<derek> moin.cgi runs fine from shell
Action: LuftHans shouts 'equivs' from a high mountaintop such that all shall know of it and be able to remind him when he's forgotten it again :)
<derek> but from broswer gets internal server error
<alandd> Until you have it up, I have placed my log at: http://www.mindspring.com/~alandd/gnue/ipaqlog.html
<alandd> now, I must get to bed!
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<derek> wtf is Premature end of script headers:
<derek> i   can run darn thing as www-data
<derek> just not in apache
<derek> er browser
<derek> giving up and going to bed.. i lose, it wins
<LuftHans> German engineering: 1, derek: 0
<LuftHans> :)
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<Arturas> Hello
<LuftHans> hallo Arturas
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<reinhard> hmmm
<reinhard> i get sobig.f mails from a dialup account from sympatico.ca
<reinhard> IIRC i have read this sympatico.ca somewhere here once
<reinhard> the most funny thing is the mail header contains a line
<reinhard> X-MailScanner: Found to be clean
<reinhard> did I already mention that I'm happy I use evolution? :-))
<LuftHans> :)
<LuftHans> sympatico.ca was guilty of something last year, but it might've been a dialup account doing something incorrect
<LuftHans> don't remember if that was something I noticed or was reported to me
Action: LuftHans gaehnt
<LuftHans> gute n8
<reinhard> schlaf gut
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<Bhuinga> I'm working on this project to where QA or customer support reports a bug, and sends the ticket to development, we need to prevent people from closing out the ticket before development is through with it
<Bhuinga>  how would I go about putting contraints on the database to allow such a thing?
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<chillywilly> for dcl
<chillywilly> right? ;)
<chillywilly> gnue has several products Bhuinga ;)
<Bhuinga> err my bad
<Bhuinga> for DCL
<Bhuinga> :)
<chillywilly> can anyone just close tickets?
<chillywilly> I thought only the person they were assigned to could close them
<chillywilly> then again you want a group of people to be able to close them right?
<chillywilly> can you pick a department in the responsible drop down?
<Bhuinga> well the person in development it's assigned to, but then anyone in QA could close that ticket after it got reassigned back to them
<Bhuinga> i dont think so
<Bhuinga> nope
<chillywilly> they shouldn't reassign them until they're done?
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<chillywilly> hi dale
<Bhuinga> development shouldn't no
<Bhuinga> i guess whatever works is fine though
<dsmith> Hello chillywilly
<Bhuinga> i just cant think of anything
<chillywilly> just trying to figure out the "process"
<chillywilly> bah, well hopefully someone here will pipe up or you could try some mailing lists
<chillywilly> derek is probably the resident dcl master
<chillywilly> but he's alos hard to get a hold of
<chillywilly> also
<Bhuinga> ugh
<Bhuinga> I just dont want to start writing php scripts to make it work
<Bhuinga> lol
<chillywilly> I would think they're should be a way to do this
<chillywilly> without making any modifications
<chillywilly> sf.net is slow
<Bhuinga> I sure hope so, cuz we are a far cry from programmers
<chillywilly> Coming Features
<chillywilly> Although DCL is currently usable, it has greater aspirations. Among these are:
<chillywilly>     *
<chillywilly>       Enhanced security utilizing groups (roles) and permissions.
<chillywilly> heh
<Bhuinga> hehe
<chillywilly> how do you want the process to work again?
<chillywilly> could you break it down step by step
<Bhuinga> QA starts a ticket, assigns it to development pending, development manager will issue it to a developer, when that person finishes fixing the bug, they will return the ticket to QA for approval, then QA can close the ticket
<chillywilly> hmmm, I and right now it doesn't work this way?
<chillywilly> s/I//
<Bhuinga> well, anyone can start the ticket who finds the bug though
<chillywilly> right
<Bhuinga> not that I'm aware
<chillywilly> aren't there restrictions on who can close a ticket?
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<chillywilly> only the person it is currently assigned to can close it?
<chillywilly> I wss under the impression that is how it worked
<Bhuinga> lemme check that out
<eelke> can anybody help me i'm new ...
<chillywilly> hi eelke 
<eelke> ey
<eelke> i've got problems with downloading stuff
<chillywilly> gnue tools?
<eelke> sorry?
<eelke> i'm dutch and i'm only 14 so...
<nickr> like thats an excuse.
<eelke> t could be...
<chillywilly> Bhuinga: http://sourceforge.net/docman/display_doc.php?docid=940&group_id=1424 <-- you have read this right? ;)
<eelke> no
<chillywilly> Bhuinga: it's about the best docs dcl has
<eelke> k I will read it... thanx!
<chillywilly> eelke: not you
<eelke> ^^
<Bhuinga> yes, and it wasn't very helpful
<chillywilly> :(
<chillywilly> did you test to see if only the assignee can close the ticket?
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<Bhuinga> can still change it with another user
<Bhuinga> made a new user with lower permissions and they can close the ticket assigned to someone else
<chillywilly> bah
<chillywilly> that's lame
<Bhuinga> they were set for level 5
<Bhuinga> but if a person is level 4, then they cant create them, which kinda defeats the purpose
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<Bhuinga> it would be ok for development to be level 4, but not QA since they create the tickets
<Bhuinga> i know that it wouldnt show up in 'my tickets' if it's assigned to someone else, but who knows what kinda dumb mistakes someone might do...trying to idiot proof it a bit
<chillywilly> yea
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<chillywilly> well I know we use dcl internally for bug tracking which derek also setup ;P
<Bhuinga> well call his desk and wake him up :P
<chillywilly> hehe
<chillywilly> I don't have his number ;)
<chillywilly> well man I don't know what to tell ya
<Bhuinga> it's alright, maybe "they" will just forget about it
<Bhuinga> hehe
<chillywilly> gnue really needs soem kinda rbac server for everything else to talk to
<chillywilly> RBAC
<Bhuinga> what are the advantages of dcl over something like Clientele?
<chillywilly> dunno never used Clientele
<chillywilly> is it Free Software?
<Bhuinga> nope
<Bhuinga> but we already have it and have been using it for like 4 years
<Bhuinga> seems like the same kind of thing, however, this is also the first time ive worked with bug tracking/work ticket stuff 
<chillywilly> hmm, I need ton upgrade debian
<chillywilly> to
<chillywilly> I hope they fixed my galeon toobar icons
<Vee> the new firebird's built with svg s'port.. 
<chillywilly> cool
<Bhuinga> well, until a fix is found, I'm moving onto a more interesting semi-project, install and test this fancy new DVD +/- RW drive
<chillywilly> but still uses XUL right? ;)
<chillywilly> Bhuinga: try the mailing lists
<chillywilly> at least then you can get some kinda response even if delayed
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<Bhuinga> what mailing list?
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<chillywilly> Bhuinga: ummm
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<SachaS> hi guys :)
<SachaS> greetings from Sydney
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<alandd> dneighbo: are you live here?
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<alandd> dneighbo: Now, are you here?
Action: alandd probably commuting...
<alandd> I'll be back.
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<dneighbo> let aland know that i am at home, but going to church
<dneighbo> so wont be home until after 9pm
<SachaS> hi again with greetings from Sydney
<SachaS> gneighbo congratulations to your gnue workshop
<dneighbo> thanks
<SachaS> dneighbo: i am at the australian unix, open systems, open source conference at sydney
<SachaS> tomorrow over lunch I will organise a Birds of Feather (bloody idea of my supervisor ;) I never attended one but he suggested I should run one)
<SachaS> topic: Free and Open Source Business Applications.
<SachaS> so I will bring up gnuenterprise, gnue-sb, arias, gnucash etc.
<SachaS> will post back information of that bof back here (or mailinglist)
<SachaS> if you, dneoghbo, or anyone else wants to add a comment, i am happy to bring that up.
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<SachaS> back later
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<alandd> dneighbo: Are you in yet?
Action: alandd whistle, whistle, whistle...
Action: Vee2d2 pats and runs up to alandd with a stick
<Vee2d2> pants
<Vee2d2> stupid paws
Action: Vee2d2 spits stick out and runs back to his googling
Action: alandd Good boy!
Action: alandd is away: I'll be back
Nick change: alandd -> alandd_away
<dneighbo> alandd_away: here
<dneighbo> but you are away
<dneighbo> brb
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Action: alandd_away is back (gone 00:10:57)
<alandd_away> nick alandd
<alandd_away> AAAAHHH!  I missed him!
Nick change: alandd_away -> alandd
<alandd> fine.  I have an errand to do anyway.
Action: alandd is away: I'm busy
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<alandd> Ah, derek!
<alandd> The ipaq serial cable issue:  I have had an offer from a PLUG member to trade the USB cradle for his serial one.  I don't think we should do that:
<alandd> We will probably want the USB connection at some point in the future, when/if it gets to working.
<alandd> I was planning on going the ebay route.  With shipping it looks about $10-12.
<derek> hold up
<derek> er thought i had extra one here (usb cradle) but i dont
<derek> i could swear hans did?
<derek> maybe he would donate a usb cradle
<derek> that you could then trade for a serial cable
<alandd> LuftHans: wake up!
<derek> would the plugger be willing to let you use the serial cable for a few days?
<alandd> I doubt it.
<alandd> It is currently his only connection to his PC.  We might could trade "temporarily"
<alandd> I'll ask him.
--- Thu Sep  4 2003