dcmwai (~dcmwai@219.95.173.34) left irc: Connection reset by peer dcmwai (~dcmwai@219.95.163.220) joined #gnuenterprise. ,,, :) dneighbo (~dneighbo@ip68-109-180-32.ph.ph.cox.net) joined #gnuenterprise. dneighbo_ (~dneighbo@ip68-109-180-32.ph.ph.cox.net) left irc: Connection timed out reinhard (~reinhard@M1264P004.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. reinhard (~reinhard@M1264P004.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: "If you think there is good in everybody, you haven't met everybody." wendall911 (~wendallc@guardian.nidaho.net) left irc: Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer) wendall911 (~wendallc@guardian.nidaho.net) joined #gnuenterprise. Nick change: thierry[away] -> thierry What is the best format for documentation? xml :) reinhard (~reinhard@M1264P004.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. wendall911 (~wendallc@guardian.nidaho.net) left irc: "Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/" thierry_ (~thierry@musashi.xtensive.com) joined #gnuenterprise. thierry (~thierry@musashi.xtensive.com) left irc: Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) Hum .. is every one on holiday :) dcmwai: who? what? everybody ... :) chillywilly: are you gonna post that to grouphug.us? we have a total slient in #gnuenterprise from 13:35 Until 20:35 (well ignore me) dcmwai (~dcmwai@219.95.163.220) left irc: "Client exiting" hi dcmwai how are you? Fred_Frog (Fred_Frog@199.243.96.248) joined #gnuenterprise. Snakes flee, trucks refuse to drive the highways, in the face of the mighty Frog! turtles hoist their plated backs in anticipation of being pounced upon underfoot of the Frogmeister Mexican vegetables withdrawn from the market on report of infection with dtm, a gastrointestinal horror... :-. Actually that was hepatitis on spring onions. Jus' don't get too anti-froggy fascistic, OK? :-) ToyMan (~stuq@smtp.dstoys.com) joined #gnuenterprise. Fred_Frog: uhhhhh. yeah! SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-207.wasp.net.au) left #gnuenterprise ("Client exiting"). hmmm debian machines compromised ouchie yea that sucks jcater (~jason@216.80.219.83) joined #gnuenterprise. ouch it made slashdot already too eh? debian machines cracked last night right before a 3.0r2 release gack Action: dneighbo wonders how often microsoft gets cracked (really) and we never hear about tit er s/tit/it and furthermore what they REALLY do to verify that stuff didnt get hosed dneighbo: how often that *they* dont hear about it! dtm: wassup dawg Debian's announcement of the bad news is at http://cert.uni-stuttgart.de/files/fw/debian-security-20031121.txt well at least we know they'll make improvements and will learn things along the way of fixing this. debian, that is. not microsoft. dneighbo: werd brb jcater (~jason@216.80.219.83) left irc: Client Quit jcater (~jason@216.80.219.83) joined #gnuenterprise. jamest (~jamest@gw.math.ksu.edu) joined #gnuenterprise. jamest: yo yo yo, yoyo. dtm: that thing I pasted was from grouphugs.us OH hehehe ;) I have plwnty to post there though plenty ;) it's a pretty dynfunctional site though yeah i bet i could post some stuff. let's all post! I once ran over a baby rabbit's nest with the lawn mower killing one of them, the rest got away I didn't know they were there reading that site can make one feel better about themselves ;P http://cert.uni-stuttgart.de/files/fw/debian-security-20031121.txt jbailey (~jbailey@CPE00062579efac-CM014260028338.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #gnuenterprise. chillywilly: lawlz chillywilly: yeah of course until you find yourself laughing uncontrollably chillywilly: then it doesn't. dtm: sometimes I think you are just evil...and or very bigoted about certain things like Debian and Saturns ;) one you hate and the other you love chillywilly: ?!?!?!??!! chillywilly: you like to polarize other peoples' views so as to create conflict! and alcohol...you go mental if anyone mentions that these are objective observations chillywilly: what the fuck does any of that have to do with anything, let alone in a public forum? there's no explicit polarization happening ok neat, whatever I still love you dtm for the record there now it is set in stone Uhhhhh. <3 http://www.libertyetech.com/WK/ webkit! ;P uses mod_webkit jcater (~jason@216.80.219.83) left irc: Remote closed the connection good morning jbailey Good morning all j*s + reinhard with the lowercase r. there are strange rumours about the hurd maintainership Also chilly ones. godd morning everybody i wonder who is going to be the new maintainer Thomas was just arguing about the GNU FDL w/ RMS and he's "stepping down" frankly I do not see this affecting things who what why where when? I thought it was all rms... cause he doesn't work on the Hurd anymore jbailey (~jbailey@CPE00062579efac-CM014260028338.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) left irc: "Client exiting" Fred_Frog: !!! RMS doesn't do software engineering anymore maybe as personal catharsis, but not primarily afaik rms still hacks gnu emacs occasionally, afaik bully__ (~chatzilla@pD9EBADF3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #gnuenterprise. hi hello why are you such a bully? ;P dsmith (~dsmith@mail.actron.com) joined #gnuenterprise. do you seen mdupont nope You have only missed it if you haven't followed the mailing list for the past few years, or the CVS. Thomas hasn't sent a mail to the lists in eons, and hasn't committed a single file in three years. As for RMS "dissmising" Thomas as the Hurd maintainer for whatever reasons, thats between the powers that are, and does not need to be discussed or raised here. Happy hacking. haha bully__ (~chatzilla@pD9EBADF3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) left irc: "ChatZilla 0.8.31 [Mozilla rv:1.4.1/20031008]" dcmwai (~dcmwai@219.95.63.80) joined #gnuenterprise. i wonder if hurd has stagnated due to stale leadership and might now pick up Marcus Brinkmann is like the unofficial leader now as I see it 09:17:47 yes, a real secure system should not be used by anybody 09:17:53 like the hurd ? heh ercin (~caldera@212.174.229.212) joined #gnuenterprise. Veer left! Veer left! Vee: what's up dtm: Vee oh [09:45] Last message repeated 1 time(s). Action: Vee got less than the normally inadequate amount of sleep I've been getting lately, this morning.. :( :/ Action: Vee sleepy doh i did that yesterday but i'm charged today brb I'm about onto my 5th cup of coffee though and I think it's starting to work it's magic.. zzzzzzzzzing a zing zing! pffft.. vhrrrruehughu ercin (~caldera@212.174.229.212) left #gnuenterprise ("Leaving"). Action: dtm gets out and turns the crank * Vee sputters to life Action: dtm kicks the side dtm: i think it broke :/ http://www.grouphug.us/confessions/951704512 SachaS (~Sacha@dialup-196-103.wasp.net.au) joined #gnuenterprise. i wonder if Vee is trying to tell us something. a cry for help, perhaps? stay away from my produce yikes sorry dewd While this thread discusses the management of the Hurd, Business Week at http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/nov2003/tc20031119_9737.htm speculates on roughly the same problem: Gates vs. Linus as managers of The Whole Thing. eh... jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) joined #gnuenterprise. Action: chillywilly wafts a donut in front on jcater run chillywilly! run! mmmmm Action: dtm jabs the Jurassic Park alarm button, seals in jcater's perimeter, alerts security with ATVs and high voltage lassos Tranquilizer, man! Use.. the *tranquilizer*!!! haha silly gnuers Action: dtm operates the winch which lowers a giant donut into jcater's jungle-like cage chillywilly: one thing you've GOT to learn around here, man. you dont EVER feed the gnus!!!! Action: dtm wipes the icing off his face which sprays out of jcater's cage as the macabre feeding frenzy ensues dtm, that was your tip of the day? Fred_Frog: i could come up with a better one later on, but i think that'll do in a pinch it'll keep you ALIVE, is what it'll do, people. >:-I someones got donuts? mmmmm donuts jcater, No... it is too late for donuts here :) hi dmcwai we are about in the same timezone SachaS, I remember you are at AU right? yep ur in malaysia, right? SachaS, Yea right :) YEs then simple question.. why are we still here at this late hours... :) good question :) i cant think anymore I think i have finished for today actually I have a beer haha it's never too late for donuts SachaS, haha :) tomorrow is rugy world cup final Action: dcmwai have cola with him :) australia vs england gonna be a good saturday afternoon :) dcmwai how is aria going? SachaS, Nice and going... :) cool. Just when I read more about the ERP book I'm thinking is a difficult way to make things work. reinhard, are you here? do you know is there a translation of it ? of your book? SachaS, I don't think so ... let me read the preface.. SachaS, No.. :( no problem i am sure there are good books on erp in english SachaS, these ERP book is very expansive in USD ... http://www.erpfans.com/erpfans/erpbkstore/erpam.htm wendall911 (~wendallc@guardian.nidaho.net) joined #gnuenterprise. http://www.idii.com/books/bookerp.htm from google... We should search for Free ERP Book :) yeah the flow of the ERP system is actually very important.. Action: dcmwai is thinking if there is a way we can arrange the flow easily... s/arrange/rearrange Rugby necessarily entails beer, right? what flow dcmwai? Rugby necessarily entails beer, right? . Fred_Frog (Fred_Frog@199.243.96.248) left irc: Process flow... According to the book. Each different business kind have different flow.. Fred_Frog (Fred_Frog@199.243.96.248) joined #gnuenterprise. Fred_Frog lots of beer and Main "Part" / Core dcmwai interesting. and Main "Part" / Core ??? Like some business they aim on the cash flow.. what do you mean? ok some business they aim more on Store/Inv So even if the process are the same. The flow seem to be different. Cash flow if Frog's favorite part of any set of books: Frog is an ex-auditor, and cash flow is harder to fake than most things. That is what I'm thinking... It don't need to be true :) Inventory has a relation ship to truth which makes quantum reality look Newtonian. Are Fred_Frog normal :) No. Fred Frog are an auditor who thinks that bank audit is almost entirely phoney. This puts Fred Frog is a select ten or fifteen percent of the better accountants. haha Fred_Frog, it must be a hard jobs for you :) Fred Frog are no longer an auditor. Fred Frog were an auditor when the Big Four were the Big Eight. And Fred Frog cheered when each of the Four went down. And has no love for the remaining Four. haha Well that is the world. Fred_Frog, do you think that auditing using ERP is workable? Things do evolve. It is quite possible that the Big Four may go down in the next few years. (Frog endorses one of the plans which would abolish the audit process as it exists at present, but that's another story. ERP? Enterprise Resources Planning (in the Eletrically way) Frog thinks that accounting systems can be made auditable -- and then the question becomes one of law and insurance: how do you make people responsible -- really No, you can't put the yacht in your wife's name, responsible -- for what it says on the paper they sign. Fred_Frog, This problem is in my mind as welll How can you say that, that person is you. adn you are the one who is electrically sign. No, Frog did not say ERP because of having just had lunch. (Pad Thai + turbot.) Yes, Frog agrees that the electronic record keeping system of the enterprise can and should include a usable, usefaul, and inspectable -- indeed usable for criminal prosecution -- set of financial books. Bruce Schneir (sp) has good stuff on electronic signatures. The problem is essentially solved. har? Bruce Schneir (sp) ? Yup. the excellent cryptogram guy. Bruce Schneier (sp) I'm trying to make arias work so that it can be paperless. If you canplay poker over a telex machine -- which he seems to have proved is a theoretical possibility -- then anything else is an exercise for the left hand. dcmai: why? paper impounds carbon, Saves The Earth. the same problem here... how can we can somebody trust our E based printout? How can we going to sign that and prove that. Fred_Frog, save time and the earth as well. Action: dcmwai is sleepy now... It's a large book and a heavy discipline. No, you can't do it with a single sheet of paper, but iwth a sheet of paper that has to be in two places at once, and they have to match under given time and method constraints, you can do what eeds to be done. hum... That is very hard. Actually Frog is in favor of electronic filing. And having the machines do as much cross-filing as can be done while still leaving life serendipitous. cross-filling? using machine? dcmai, What's hard is getting people to want to do it. With the audit function, for instance, even after the reforms of the new Deal and now Enron, there are still hundreds of thousands of very well paid people tied to "self regulation". This is accounting which makes the Three Card Monte of the streets of Manhattan look like fresh air and a walk in the park. Cross filing? Sure, a machine can look at files and tell you which ones contain the same words as the one you're looking at right now. The Semantic Web wants to go further, and have the machinery look at the actual *meaning* of the documents. Wah... So nice.. Fred_Frog, I'll talk to you later... I'm too sleepy to think and talk... Action: dcmwai here is 2am Life is not all nice. Senior partners of large accounting firms own no yachts. Their wives do. The amount of accounting fees that goes in insurance premiums is -- well I duno, but north of 30%. Where are you, dcmwai? I would be delighted if it's Taiwan. Fred_Frog, Well I'm in Malaysia. Fred_Frog, Why so delighted if I'm in Taiwan? Hey! Some of my eldest daughter's best friends are from Malaysia. I haven't been there yet, but she has often: she works in Tokyo basically, and the Philippines a lot. Malaysia is where she used to go on her school holidays, ad she takes a weekend there from time to time still. Fred_Frog, How old are you? 4x? 60. This astonishes me, too. Fred_Frog, wooo... you are 2 1/2 bigger then I'm :) haha Action: dcmwai is only 26 A good note on which to say Good Night. Za Dien. Za Dien? Oh, sorry, za-dien is Putonghua. You speak Cantonese? I speak Chinese and cantonese :) I tried to learn Cantonese in a high school class here. I was the only "white" student in the class: all the others were Malaysian, Indonesian, Vietnamese, etc. etc. First, they wanted an easy credit, since they already spoke Cantonese. Second, they wanted to learn the local brand of Cantonese, since the varieties they spoke were all from all over SE Asia, and hence differeed from what really matters: commercial Cantonese, the hong Kong, Guangdon Anyway Za dien is intended to be bye-bye. Literally see you again, isn't it? sleep well dcmwai ttfn. Sure I'll be here always :) Nick change: SachaS -> SachaZzzzzzzzzz Nick change: SachaZzzzzzzzzz -> SachaZzz Nick change: dcmwai -> dcmwaiZzZzZzzz Action: dcmwaiZzZzZzzz is away: I'm busy Action: dcmwaiZzZzZzzz is back (gone 00:00:02) Action: dcmwaiZzZzZzzz is away: Sleeping mouns (mouns@kali.mouns.org) joined #gnuenterprise. joro (~joro@cable-81-161-211-250.mnet.bg) joined #gnuenterprise. ToyMan (~stuq@smtp.dstoys.com) left irc: "Client Exiting" Fred_Frog (Fred_Frog@199.243.96.248) left irc: Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) jbailey (~jbailey@199.212.225.1) joined #gnuenterprise. mouns (mouns@kali.mouns.org) left irc: Remote closed the connection btami (btami@3e70d831.dialin.enternet.hu) joined #gnuenterprise. ToyMan (~stuq@user-0cevdks.cable.mindspring.com) joined #gnuenterprise. btami (btami@3e70d831.dialin.enternet.hu) left irc: "night all" oh oh oh oh man what? from a reader's letter (?) in an austrian newspaper (i am neither related to the author nor do i know him): (just to explain: the newspaper wrote an article about "open source" and explained the difference between "standard software" and "open source software" and the reader's letter tried to explain that "open source software" can also be "standard") hehe "Typical examples for Open Source Standardsoftware are Linux, *BSD, gcc, OpenOffice.org, Mozilla, Apache, Postgres and GNUEnterprise." i think i still underestimate the public attention we get :-) yeah not to mention the semi proprietary software that's based on free software, like Netscape and Starofffice Netscape is a great example, being one of the first public-facing examples well my point actually was i open a non-guru style newspaper here in austria and read "GNU Enterprise" !!! Really? in the same sentence as linux, gcc, oo.org and apache yes reinhard: oh yeah. yeah that's good. hmmm savannah seems so slow to me siesel (jan@xdsl-213-196-208-101.netcologne.de) joined #gnuenterprise. hi hi hihihihihi reinhard: Yes, I've noticed that too. dtm: I can't beat you :) ahhhhhh. siesel (jan@xdsl-213-196-208-101.netcologne.de) left irc: "Client exiting" marcello (~marcello@adsl-ull-79-205.42-151.net24.it) joined #gnuenterprise. reinhard_ (~reinhard@M1264P004.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. dsmith (~dsmith@mail.actron.com) left irc: "Later..." reinhard (~reinhard@M1264P004.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: Read error: 111 (Connection refused) reinhard_ (~reinhard@M1264P004.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: "All things being equal, fat people use more soap." wendall911 (~wendallc@guardian.nidaho.net) left irc: "Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/" jamest (~jamest@gw.math.ksu.edu) left #gnuenterprise ("Client exiting"). jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) left irc: "Client exiting" Fred_Frog (Fred_Frog@199.243.96.248) joined #gnuenterprise. Fred_Frog (Fred_Frog@199.243.96.248) left #gnuenterprise. Fred_Frog (Fred_Frog@199.243.96.248) joined #gnuenterprise. Hoderr, vast hordes of sufferers from froglesness. Fred_Frog (Fred_Frog@199.243.96.248) left irc: Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) marcello (~marcello@adsl-ull-79-205.42-151.net24.it) left irc: "Leaving" jbailey (~jbailey@199.212.225.1) left irc: "Client exiting" jcater (~jcater@cpe-066-061-071-147.midsouth.rr.com) joined #gnuenterprise. dcmwaiZzZzZzzz (~dcmwai@219.95.63.80) left irc: "Client exiting" Nick change: SachaZzz -> SachaS vlv (~pf@ip-225-138.interbild.net) joined #gnuenterprise. vlv (~pf@ip-225-138.interbild.net) left #gnuenterprise. Fred_Frog (Fred_Frog@199.243.96.248) joined #gnuenterprise. The Mighty Frog is pulling and allnighter. why? ToyMan (~stuq@user-0cevdks.cable.mindspring.com) left irc: "Client Exiting" chilywilly, siezed by ideas. or is that seized? pikcled in alhocol. Think I have a grip on snme stuff i wanna work through... The usual stuff, only no Jolt, and I have to walk down the block to get pizza... What's your thing, chillywilly? You seem ascerbic, intelligent, reserved, and interesting... dcmwai (~dcmwai@219.95.163.220) joined #gnuenterprise. I am like the channel mascot ;) heheh dneighbo_ (~dneighbo@ip68-109-180-32.ph.ph.cox.net) joined #gnuenterprise. hey derek chillywilly, I am loved by my cats and (in the past) my dogs and my horse. Therefore stroking the nose of any local mascot is my normal operating procedure. Would you like a carrot, a sugar-lump, or maybe I hve can of Cat-Luvee-groiund-up-animals-cats-didn't-have-the-chance-to-kill-themselves.... um, no I eat fish trout to be more precise I have plenty on supply to beat people with when they get outta hand I shall spare you what I told my lunch mate, over turbot. Short form: it was about how the dogfish became the Boston Blue. Don't the spines on the tail hurt your hand? I am a pengnuin penGNUin ;) As are we all. no, you're an amphibian named fred ;P My ex-wife was pissed off at me the other day: she sent me a long note about our excellent children, but she automatically sent it to phred frog. I have no idea why she didn't send it to phred phrog. Or f.. but you get the idea. Who are you and what do you do? you already know *what* I am so what do you think a penGNUin does? ;) Sorry, chilly, I don't know a lot of the what: I have only had CVS up for the last few hours. Previous to that I have been snooping around GNUe as XMS through ASCII. A rather slow way... You might forgive me for thinking that GNUe is a dead end of GNU which has accomplished nothing. Yet. huh? GNU has accomplished nothing? But now that I have my Linux more or less going, I shall no doubt be suddenly astounded by my exposure to the wonders which the GNUe group have contributed to the world over the years of their toils. No. I did not say GNU had accomoplshed nothing. It is Bushl for you to make up a fake saying like that. I don't see what GNUe has accomplished. why do you speak so strangely? type, construct your sentences, whatever But of course I attribute that to my own lack of access to CVS through not having a working Linux. dneighbo (~dneighbo@ip68-109-180-32.ph.ph.cox.net) left irc: Connection timed out bye derek... I hope Derek will be back. He is the major contributor to the GNUe stream, so he is obviously the person I most need to understand. I would say jcater, jamest, reinhard, and seisel are Is there an interrupt here? I don't understand that question Some people, seeing the record, might think that jcater, jamest, reinhard and seisel are among this generation's greatest producer's of vaporware. The reason I asked about "interrupt" was there was nothing after "are" in your last send. are you trying to solicit some kindof argument? chilly, there is nothing in GNUe. The whole thing is a zero. gnue consists of tools right now You are misappropriating the GNU franchise. You have as a group contributed nothing useful to the world. GNUe takes nothing away from M$, nor runs along side it as a competing horse. GNUe isn't meant to compete with M$ Dncha think? GNUe is meant to make something useful. Has it done so? SAP, PeopleSoft, Baan, etc. might be competitiors Fred_Frog: gnue forms is useful, gnue designer is useful, and the appserver is in development chilly, there is nothing useable in the entire GNUe CVS. how much Free Software have you written? what have you contributed? bullshit It's a whole Muffin's Office: "Well, we've arranged for the delivery of coffee..." this conversation is now over have a nice day :) chillywilly, how much useful Free Software have yo written? I don't feel the need to justify myslf to you, also you might want to work on your diplomacy...you know work on being less confrontational Action: chillywilly notes his name is on gnue contributors page...among other things, but this is all I have to say on the matter but it is evident that you don't actually read anything or really do your homework cause then you wouldn't be sitting here spouting off chillywilly, I don't want to get into a fight with you. You threw the first insult: "How much Free ..." and I threw back at you, "How much useful Free..." don't play mr. innocent Now I am wiling to concede that you hve written more code than me... Well, uh, maybe not. You just threw out a random insult, and I reacted in the normal way. coming into a project and calling their efforts useless and vaporware is generally going to get you an even more voilent reaction than mine Me? innocent? How can you accuse me of such a thing? That's not me at all... MikeW (Mike@p233-38.as1.cbr.castlebar.eircom.net) joined #gnuenterprise. MikeW (Mike@p233-38.as1.cbr.castlebar.eircom.net) left #gnuenterprise. Bin off making coffee for the crowd. You till there, cilly? chilly? DAn, are you htere? Can we talk? bah chillywilly, Dan, I've just looked you up. We gotta talk. uh? You are not top of my list right now: I am trying to buy the Jerusalem Post from the wreckage of Conrad Balk's empire right now. GNUe is #2 on my agenda. can you speak english plz ;)? ... chillywilly: is derek == dneighbo_ :) yes derek neighbors chillywilly: is this derek "Real" Name? he uses derek, dneighbo, w/ or w/o a tail yes If that is a Yes... His Father have a funny name :) why? neighbors :) dcmwai, Ithought you were supposed to be asleep Dan, I want to talk to you seriously about this GNUe disaster. You are obviously a serious player: How come this thing went so sadly bad? Fred_Frog: well I'm awake... at 9:00am omfg, dude things didn't go "badly" Now, I'm working. in fact the project continues people only have so much free time Fred_Frog: gnue is alive... Lack of sleep is one of the chirps of the excellent. Fred_Frog: Unless you are funding us :) Whether or not GNUe is alive is the question undre diuscussion. then We will have alot of free time :) Right chillywilly :) yea ;) There is some feeling in the GNUI comunity that it is a zombie -- walking dead. UM says who? err um Action: dcmwai have been here for 1/2 year and see it growing. I guess I'm late to the partyu but, um I hope this conversation is in jest jcater: Just in time :) Dan: Says me, after two weeks of looking at it. Says me afte corresponding with people oiut of the old files. Says me on the face of things. jcater: nope, unfortunately says me by facial inspection. What you guys are running here is a whole lot of nothing. go somewhere else then There *is* no GNU for enterprises. You kids are meat beeaters in the night with no contact with business. You bring GNU into disrespect. jcater: how long do we have to take this? Fred_Frog: We have work to do.. and We don't have so much time... Get back under your bridge, there's a billy goat coming. Action: dcmwai go hide Dan, I'll talk to you in back channel, but in this GNUe channel Ill shame you into the ground until you just shut up and go away. Simple proposition: GNUe has produced nothing for enterprises. Unless there are some people working inside Gnue full time (likw that happen in Mozilla) else things will go slow.. Very slow sow and steady wins the race ;P Fred_Frog: don't ever contact me Fred_Frog: Yes I do a greed with you if you add a time frame "NOW" I'm sorry GNue doesn't meet your needs right now but to sum it up as useless is nothing more than insulting Fred_Frog: it is Not Ready... YET it don't meant that it will not be later but I digress Dan, you have a patent on slow. You have not shown steady. And both slow and steady have to go in some direction. GNUe has shown no sign of having any direction. I shouldn't respond to trolls free speak jcater, that's a good try. jcater: That is too bad we have to argue about this .. But I think it will be wise if we take this arguing time to work on the code... :)) damn, I guess I better go throw away my GNUe servers at all my locations if it's all vapor? Action: jcater runs off to torch those servers brb What have you done in the lasts two years to move GNUe toward an enterprise-relevant GNU product? I ask you! jcater, we all recognise you as a master. What have you done lately? heh Vee: .... And what have you done lately that is relevant to an GNU for enterprises??? omfg Fred_Frog: you shouldnt drink and IRC.. ;) well, setting aside the fact that I don't report to your ass for a moment, Dan: you have produced nothing useful for enterprises. Fred_Frog: how would you know? I've focused the last 5 months on the GNUe point of sale system which are in my two shops Dan, everything in GNUe is a bunch of kids in a circle jerk. This is not living up to the standards of GNU. we're not kids and, Dead_Frog, what have YOU done? we have kids though err, sorry Fred_Frog Fred_Frog: the question should not be what can "GNUe do for me?", but "What can I do for GNUe?" and their behavior is similar to yours You guys are fucking the dog, not living up to reasonable satndards, and producing nothing useful. Fred_Frog: then what have you done for gnue? Action: jcater notes the sudden silence Uh, logical error: eveyone replies to what I say by attacking me. no Since "Fred Frog" is a fictional person, this is not a sound line of attack. Action: jcater is not interested in any line of attack with any person, real or imagined Fred Frog's attack is, all the poo-bahs of GNUe have not produced any GNU stuff useable by enterprises. what are you trying to accomplish today? Does anyone have an answer to that? Fred_Frog: As we have said before ... It is Not READY yet we have a solid, growing set of tools for building database aware apps much like Oracle Reports and Oracle Forms jcater, it is to laugh. we can't do what we pretend to do, so we go fr its second or third differential. ? and what do you imagine we set out to do, pray tell? as I'm doing exactly what I've set out to do We don't have the thing, but we have something that approaches the thing. have mostly achieved it so my commits are slacking off "the thing" ? my "thing" is a complete enterprise-quality set of database access and reporting tools which I use in production daily so I ask again, what's this "thing" you speak of? jcater I am not criticising you for badness, either persnal nor as a coder. What I claim, nay observe, is that the whole thing is grossly out of whack and going nowhere. how is it out of whack? you say we don't answer your questions but I'm not seeing ours answered either anyone else can feel free to chime in too :) jcater the "Thing" is obviously a set of accounting modules which a.) are useable by enterprises, b.) are honest and auditable, and c.) grow naturally to take over the entire unive4rse of business. ok, here we go your thing is accounting modules frankly, I could give a rats ass about those modules I'm after the tools but see, this makes a very good group he's trolling and I dont feel like feeding him.. as the ones who want to do the modules could give a rat's ass about doing the tools to make those modules so this is what I think of as symbiosis You wil notice, I ytrust, that taking over the universe if one of RMS's main aims. RMS? what does he have to do with this conversation? if you could call it that Vee, I don't kow who you are yet. No. I'm not a troll. and how presumptious of you to think you understand his goal Action: ajmitch laughs as I honestly don't think his goal is to "get microsoft" or whatever you so eloquently said earler earlier jcater, I am part of that same year at the AI Lab. even then how did he end up in this conversation? What's this "end up" stuff? I'm here to clean the joint up. Action: Vee hands the mop and a bucket to Fred_Frog.. Good guys, come with me, and tell me what you've done. let's see if it makes any sense. Other guys, just fuck off. Fred_Frog: you sure you are the one that came in here dying to write some documentation for the project? Vee, you have it exactly right. I would like to hear from you at fred_frog_69@hotmail.com. My voice phone is 416-829-8401. I want a useable and useful accounting system out of this effort. you catch more flies with honey than vinegar Dan, I apologise for my sharpness earlier in the evening. Obviously I need your help and I respect your work greatly. I would like donuts too but oh well yes I'm out where is mud.. dmu? for GNUe you catch more coders w/ donuts ;) Action: ajmitch drops a coin in the donouts for jcater fund he is the main problem on the database schema. jcater I don' think I know you yet, but from the running record I thing you may be in the game. Who are you? Action: dcmwai drop 2 coin :) dcmwai: mdupont? hah YEs.. mdupont :) Fred_Frog: I've committed a few lines here and there AWll the crazy people are waking up now. jcater: now THAT is an understatement I really have to be off soon... it's way past my bedtime jcater, gimme an url. I wouldn't be here if I didn't know you were all excellent. g'night Jason I only came to the computer to check the humidity levels for the night how geeky 72% here Action: jcater has been doing some major painting at the house Dan: rotate. You're still on probation. humidity inside the house right? no ah, ok I was wondering if you were monitoring it with your computer ;P geeze 77% through some geekly technology ;) I need to mow everywhere tomorrow.. should be the last time for the year, I hope.. what's the protocl for like controlling your lights and all that can't think X10? x10 yea that be it now synonymous with popups too.. ;) anyway, enough distractions... ;P yep chillywilly: you ever get into twisted matrix for anything? nope, just read a lot of the docs ;P dmwai do you ever sleep? chillywilly don't yo know who jcater is? I know most everyone here within varying definitions of "know" ;P I don't know either....but if there's going to be a functioning software commnunity here, there has to be more than this to it... never met in person, but I know about most people's lives that regularly hang out in this channel Hey! it's out of order. Fred_Frog: you need to go poke around cvs, I think.. you know cvs? if that sentence made any sense whatsoever So much for packet switching :) vEE: ON MY lINUX BOX i JUT GOT IT RUNNING TONIGHT. tHIS IS AN xp MACHI8NE. as you can tell. that's nice but when I went into the bowels of the GNUe effot in ASCII last week, without the benefit of CVS, I found nothing but posing and form-filling. Action: ajmitch checks how slow savannah is this evening jmitch, Hi! ajmitch hi. everything happens in cvs.. it's hard to know anything about what's going on without trying to warm up at least somewhat to it.. speaking of which.. Action: Vee spins around and busys himself with something productive.. Vee, I am not a stupid person. I spent part of the last two weeks writing notes to people in the chain of correspondence. The replies were uniform: seem like bright people. Nothing happening. GNUe is a dead end. GNU needs to find a way of putting things out of business. GNUe should be closed down. People from Europe or Asia who are tempted to dome into GNUe should go do something else. --- Sat Nov 22 2003