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<derek> <derek> is there an easy way to validate bookmarks?
<derek> <derek> in mozilla 1.5 or firebird
<dcmwai> derek: what do you want to do?
<Vee> validate them?
<dcmwai> why validate them...
<Vee> against deadlinks?
<dcmwai> oh check if there are still useful or still active?
<dcmwai> hum
<dcmwai> there isn't such tools :(
<dtm> there's a link checker
<dtm> and a bookmark is just another web page
<Vee> yea
<Vee> that's what I was thinking.. 
<Vee> only thing I found, while doing a quick check was checkbot
<Vee> in the deb repository
<ajmitch> hi, gnuers
<Vee> I'm sure I'm overlooking something
Action: Vee hugs ajmitch
<ajmitch> there are firebird extensions for that stuff, derek
<ajmitch> nasty little things they are :)
<Vee> mozilla-checky - Online validation and analysis services for Mozilla
<dcmwai> ajmitch: :)
<dcmwai> ajmitch: someone really think that you are a bot ;)
<Vee> dcmwai: what are you talking about, he is a bot. 
<dcmwai> haha
<dcmwai> let try
<dcmwai> ajmitch: Op :)
<dcmwai> !op
<dcmwai> nan Not responding...
<dcmwai> ajmitch: reboot :)
<Vee> The best bots are the quiet ones
Action: ajmitch reboots
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<dtm> derek: a cursory check on freshmeat.net for the keyphrase "link check" reveals http://dlc.sourceforge.net/
<dtm> derek: which i chose coz it looks sophisticated enough, and sounds like "dcl"
<dcmwai> ajmitch: reallt ack like bot :)
<dcmwai> ajmitch: are you awake?
<ajmitch> no
<dcmwai> ajmitch: then what are you doing?
Action: ajmitch shrugs
<dcmwai> :)
<dcmwai> damn ldap... can edit but cannot remove :(
<dcmwai> can anyone tell me from report to html
<dcmwai> there is a xslt files it read right.
<dcmwai> can anyone tell me where it is?
<dcmwai> I've try /usr/local/gnue/share/gnue/filters/SimpleTabulation/ which is a link to gnue/gnue-reports/src/adapters/filters/SimpleTabulation/etc
<dcmwai> But after I change it... the output html didn't change (not even the style) part ...
<dcmwai> anyone... jcater ;)
<dcmwai> woo it is 2 am at jcater place...
<Vee> 3
<dcmwai> Vee: help...
<Vee> I'm helpless man
<dcmwai> I'm helpless... not you. You are helpful :)
<Vee> not atm.. :)
<SachaS> hi dcmwai vee
<Vee> morning SachaS
<dcmwai> Hello SachaS ...
<dcmwai> I'm helpless now..
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<thierry> morning gnuers
<btami> hi thierry
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<dimas> hi all
<dimas> could I easily overwrite behaviour of what done by hitting F6 button (commit)?
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<mdupont> hi all
<chillywilly> hello
<nenhum> Hello, I'm from the Fisterra ERP development team, are all of you gnue developers?
<SachaS> hi nenhum
<SachaS> most are guest, contributors
<nenhum> Is there an active core of developers?
<SachaS> a few developers
<SachaS> yeah i think so, an active core
<SachaS> of about 4-6
<SachaS> i would say
<adam5> hi
<adam5> is there a way to make a pgsql database case insensitive?
<nenhum> Well, we are very interested in finding ways of collaboration with the Gnue team. We were talking with Richard Stallman about our projects related to Fisterra and he told us to try to collaborate with Gnue. And we think it's a good idea.
<SachaS> wow
<SachaS> this log gets read by most
<SachaS> so just go ahead
<SachaS> and i am sure one of the core will get back to you
<adam5> right. thats what'll happen.
<SachaS> maybe an url would be a good start
<SachaS> and some background information
<SachaS> or an email to info@gnue.org
<nenhum> do you know about the Fisterra project? (www.fisterra.org)?
<SachaS> sorry I dont
<nenhum> It's a GPL project trying to develop an ERP with Gnome technologies
<SachaS> ok
<nenhum> It's used by some companies already, and I've seen some comments on our project in some of the Gnue reports in the webpage, i think
<dtm> nenhum: you should talk with siesel, jcater, jamest, reinhard, chillywilly, and derek
<dtm> in no particular order
<nenhum> dtm: nice, thanks, are they often in the channel?
<dtm> yes
<dtm> daily
<dtm> nenhum: you will idle here with us!  welcome.
<dtm> to this place.
<dtm> of free enterprisingness.
<adam5> dtm rambles
<adam5> i think he does acid.
<adam5> all day.
<dtm> :/
<adam5> will someone try and answer my question.
<adam5> :/
<SachaS> nenhum: from the webpage it says that it was (in the beginning) useful for garages
<dtm> oh, yeah!  sure!  hey!  let's all just stop what we're doing and do what ADAM5 WANTS TO DO.
<dtm> adam5: ;)
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<SachaS> nenhum: did you enhance fisterra to a broader audience?
<dtm> adam5: alternately, you might say hello to google
<SachaS> adam5 if there is a way to make pgsql case insensitive?
<SachaS> adam5: in the SQL queries?
<adam5> i want the relations to be insensitive
<nenhum> SachaS: yes, we have now a team of people working hard in order to release Fisterra2. This is going to be a completelly new approach, more flexible, and valid for developing ERP solutions for any kind of sector. Well start to release Fisterra2 versions before the end of the year.
<adam5> im trying to copy over a mssql database
<SachaS> adam5: frankly, I dont know
<adam5> it msut be able to
<adam5> and it should be pretty well documented :)
<adam5> i think mysql has a compile-time option
<nenhum> SachaS: together with the new release of Fisterra we are preparing a new webpage with completelly updated information
<dtm> adam5: so is that implying that you haven't rtfm?
<dtm> adam5: i'm just curious!
Action: SachaS is checking out fisterra homepage
<adam5> no, of course i greped tfm.
<dtm> oh good.
<dtm> nenhum: so is there any special reason why you didn't base it on gnue initially?
<dtm> nenhum: just curious.
<dtm> nenhum: to pose a blunt question.
<nenhum> dtm: well, we looked at gnue at that time, but we had de feeling that it was too difficult to evolve the state of the project to what our clients were demanding. We had a deadline for that garage software and that was an important priority. We also had some differences in the technologies to use, and in the way of focusing the solution, but it was always in our mind the idea of collaborating with gnue in the near future. And I think we 
<nenhum> n be now in the rigth moment, at least to see if we can collaborate.
<dtm> nenhum: oh.  deadlines!
<SachaS> nenhum: is fisterra backed by a company? or is that a development team based on volunteering?
<dtm> nenhum: well gnue is certainly cross platform in every way.  it's got display and UI abstractions for which GNOME could be a new target.
<nenhum> SachaS: it is backed by a small (~20 developers) "community company" without any big company behind
<nenhum> not all of the developers are currently working in Fisterra
<nenhum> dtm: deadlines + some differences in the technologies and approach, that's it, yes
<SachaS> nenhum: I am sure with more brain and horsepower, these projects (fisterra, gnue, one of each, both, other ERP initatives) can evolve.
<nenhum> Is gnue only based in volunteering? 
<SachaS> as dtm mentioned you might want to talk with the core developers
<dtm> nenhum: no, it is in commercial production
<dtm> nenhum: it's a money maker  :}
<dtm> DCL is entirely built by corporate support, afaik
<SachaS> nenhum: as far as I know yes. some developers get time for gnue by their employers
<dtm> so is bayonne
<dtm> SachaS: which in other words, means "no"
<dtm> :)
<jamest> there is no company backing gnue as a complete project
<nenhum> two different views :-?
<jamest> however some of us get paid to work on gnue when it applies to the company needs
<dtm> nenhum: gnue is a metaproject so it's pretty big.
<jamest> if that makes any sense
<dtm> jamest: can you rephrase that in the form of a question please
<SachaS> nenhum: you might also want to talk to dcmwai, who is developer of arias and collaborates with gnue
<dtm> jamest: *BZZT*
<dtm> nenhum: yeah, in other words, idle here
<dtm> nenhum: and talk all ya want.  they'll read the logs.
<jamest> logs?
<nenhum> Is the whole project developed using Python?
<jamest> yes, it's 100% pure python
<chillywilly> pure python pleasure
<nenhum> (obvious question) and why Python?
<chillywilly> say that 3 times fast!
<dtm> chillywilly: i just did mentally.  but i refuse to vocally.
<jamest> it's a clean language, very powerfull, quick to develop in and easy to maintain
<chillywilly> pure pythonic pleasure
<dtm> chillywilly: i could type it three times fast.
<chillywilly> dtm: that doesn't count
<dtm> chillywilly: i'd prefer to use the keybd buffer though
<jamest> we started w/ C/C++ long ago, then started coding stuff in python, eventually everything went to python
<nenhum> I've experience with quite a lot of languages, but I've never used python for "real world" projects, is the language performance a problem?
<jamest> not really
<jamest> the plan was to recode performance bottlenecks in C 
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<jamest> however fixing bad designs have reduced any performance bottlenecks we've encountered
<chillywilly> jc is in da hizouse
<nenhum> that sounds very attractive, we are using C/Gnome with a component based approach for the development
<SachaS> off to bed
Nick change: SachaS -> SachaZzz
<nenhum> what is the rigth doc/article/tutorial/webpagesection to understand correctly the whole architecture of the gnue metaproject? (I want to read that to find easily possible collaboration points)
<SachaZzz> nenhum: i think its the python code ;)
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<SachaZzz> thats an old joke in this channel (but I guess it has more to it)
<nenhum> SachaZzz: no other nice doc available?
<jamest> wow
<jamest> you know I haven't looked at the doc section in ages
<SachaZzz> nenhum: if you cvs checkout the project you should find doc directories in various places
<nenhum> SachaZzz: and is that doc updated? :-)
<jamest> the overview docs are horribly out of date :(
<SachaZzz> nenhum: I think thats the best you can get
<mdupont> hi all
<SachaZzz> hi mdupont
<mdupont> hi SachaZzz
<jamest> sigh, we need clones
<dtm> jamest: but first we must learn to control them.
<dtm> lest they RISE UP
<SachaZzz> nenhum: or the alternative is to ask here as much as possible...
<SachaZzz> nenhum: here in this channel
<jamest> and no jcater, the clone would have to be of yourself, you can't pick anyone else as I don't want you distracted
<jcater> we rented T3 Monday night
Action: jcater knows who he wants a clone of
<dtm> :-o
<nenhum> SachaZzz: yes, but before asking, I wanted to read, just in order to avoid newbie stupid questions ;-)
<SachaZzz> nenhum: yep I understand.
Nick change: SachaZzz -> SachaZzzzz
<nenhum> are all the developers from the states? 
<jamest> jcater: Arnold?
<nenhum> because I wonder how difficult would be to have some kind of meeting :)
<dtm> nenhum: no
<dtm> nenhum: ha!  a physical meeting?  why?
<nenhum> dtm: no real need for that, but it could be that we are just neighbours :) and it's good to know. Sometimes a physical meeting is useful and nice
<dtm> nenhum: we call our meetings "irc"  :)
<dtm> nenhum: i've tried organizing summit meetings, a week in advance, and it's a buncha cat herding :)
<nenhum> we've been thinking in organizing a conference about Open Source ERPs to try to create more collaboration
<dtm> yay
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<nenhum> would you think that would be a good/useful idea?
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<siesel> hi :)
<dcmwai> siesel, ...
<jamest> nenhum: how would we do it?
<dcmwai> siesel, the xsl you told me...
<dcmwai> did it active at the time we change or we need some extra jobs to make it active?
<dcmwai> I'm try to make a few modification on the style so that some New style can be use and it beem that it is not getting in the output 
<nenhum> jamest: we could do a conference organized by some local university, for example, with the collaboration of some interested companies, and invite developers from all the ERP-like projects in the world (that are quite a lot, i think)
<jamest> local to where?  where are you located?
<jamest> we've got people from all over in here now
<nenhum> jamest: local to any of us (that would act as organizing comittee) :) in my case, i'm from the north-west of spain
Action: SachaZzzzz would like to go to Spain. ;)
<dcmwai> SachaZzzzz, you are dreaming :)
<SachaZzzzz> dcmwai ROFL
Nick change: SachaZzzzz -> SachaS
<SachaS> dcmwai: what are you still doing here, at this hour?
<dcmwai> SachaS, well... same quesiton to you :)
<nenhum> jamest: we could try to organize such a meeting, if it's interesting for the people 
Action: dcmwai and SachaS is trying to catch siesel :)
<SachaS> haha
<jamest> nenhum: it's always nice to meet but i'm not sure how many people in here can afford to travel great distances
Action: jamest has only seen a few gnue developers in person
Action: jamest only wished they would have been nicer looking ones
<jamest> of course they had to put up with looking at me to, so I guess it's even
<nenhum> jamest: where are you from?
Action: SachaS is currently in Australia
Action: dcmwai is Currently in Malaysia
Action: SachaS knows reinhard is in Austria
Action: SachaS thinks siesel is in germany
<dcmwai> yaya..
<dcmwai> chillywilly, where is chillywilly?
Action: SachaS thinks chillywilly is in USA
<dcmwai> Vee, should be in USA as well
Action: SachaS think jbailey is from Canada
Action: SachaS thinks dneighbo is from USA
Action: SachaS knows ajmitch is from New Zealand
<dcmwai> mdupont is from Germany?
<mdupont> yes
<mdupont> from NJ
<mdupont> live in frankfurt
<dcmwai> New Jessy?
<nickr> New Jesse Ventura
<SachaS> where is nickr from?
<nickr> Uganda
<dcmwai> oh there are many beautiful girl there :)
<dcmwai> Uganda?
<SachaS> dcmwai: haha
<nickr> ummm
<nickr> Zaire
<dcmwai> SachaS, Really :)
<SachaS> dcmwai: where is that?
<dcmwai> you don't believes ask mdupont
<mdupont> ni germany?
<mdupont> lots of prety blondes
<dcmwai> ah.. Uganda..
<SachaS> where is jcater from?
<mdupont> i belive it
<dcmwai> SachaS, See :)
<chillywilly> hello?
<SachaS> dcmwai you havent been to Australia!
<nenhum> ok, then instead of starting with a conference (I still see that as a nice option), let's start with a multi-erp-project mailing list... what do you think about it?
<dcmwai> chillywilly, YEs :)
<dcmwai> SachaS, No :)
<nenhum> we could host the list in our company without any problem
Action: SachaS goes back into dreamland
Nick change: SachaS -> SachaZzzz
<jamest> jamest and jcater are USA
<dcmwai> people are all around the world :)
<nenhum> so what about a multi-project mailing list? 
Action: SachaZzzz supports multi-project mailinglist
<dcmwai> siesel, ...
<jamest> that might be nice
<dcmwai> jcater, you there?
<siesel> dcmwai: sorry, was reading news
Action: SachaZzzz supports multi-free-erp-project mailinglist
<dcmwai> siesel, what news/
<siesel> nenhum: spain is good.
<jcater> dcmwai: yes
<jcater> but quite busy
<siesel> dcmwai: lwn weekly kernel news
<dcmwai> ah.. :)
<nenhum> siesel: goot for what? ;-)
<dcmwai> jcater, nvm I'll ask siesel to help me Thank.
<dcmwai> siesel, the xsl location you give me /gnue/gnue-report/src/blah blah/Simpletabalance/
<siesel> yes, and it will be installed at gnue/shared bla bla/...
<dcmwai> after I edit the html.xls it will work or I need to do something else?
<siesel> so you have to change the installed version I think
<dcmwai> har?
<siesel> no, just change the xsl
<jcater> are you sure you're using the xslt (sablot) engine and not the "tabulator"
<jcater> what does your report-filters.conf entry look like for that?
<nickr> SABOT ROCKET
<jcater> the tabulator engine doesn't use the xslt files iirc
<dcmwai> jcater, I'm sure I'm using the tabulator engine :(
<siesel> dcmwai: ok then:  engine=sablotron
<dcmwai> so I've to change the report-filters.conf to use sablotron (how come this name is so hard to spell(
<dcmwai> em..I'm using sablotron...
<dcmwai> wait..
<dcmwai> let see there is 10 line long..
<dcmwai> [simple:html]
<dcmwai> description = HTML 3.0-compatable markup.
<dcmwai> mimetype = text/html
<dcmwai>                                                                                                     
<dcmwai> # using XSLT
<dcmwai> engine = sablotron
<dcmwai> template = html.xsl
<dcmwai>                                                                                                     
<dcmwai> # using tabulator engine
<dcmwai> engine = tabulator
<dcmwai> formatter = html
<dcmwai> encoding = utf-8
<dcmwai> anyone see something wrong? I'm using 2 engine together...
<siesel> dcmwai: please comment out the second engine.
<dcmwai> Unable to load PySablot
<dcmwai> what is this again :(
<siesel> you have to install pysablot.
<dcmwai> like blizzard said.. bad news? I've alot :)
<siesel> but its probably easier to install the python bindings for libxslt
<dcmwai> ...
<dcmwai> what
<dcmwai> siesel, what is recommended?
<siesel> I would recommend libxslt
<siesel> engine=libxslt
<dcmwai> Just that ?
<siesel> Yes and install libxslt from http://rpmfind.net/linux/rpm2html/search.php?query=libxslt-python&submit=Search+...&system=&arch=
<dcmwai> siesel ftp://xmlsoft.org/ there are new version why shouldn't we get them?
<dcmwai> /usr/local/gnue/share/gnue/filters/SimpleTabulation/html.xsl:81: error: Opening and ending tag mismatch: body and xsl:for-each
<dcmwai>       </xsl:for-each>
<dcmwai> This is a very bad news :(
<dcmwai> DB000:     styledoc = libxml2.parseFile(xslfile)
<dcmwai> DB000:   File "/usr/lib/python2.2/site-packages/libxml2.py", line 970, in parseFile
<dcmwai> DB000:     if ret is None:raise parserError('xmlParseFile() failed')
<dcmwai> DB000: libxml2.parserError: xmlParseFile() failed
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<dcmwai> siesel, ...
<siesel> sorry, have presentation now, 
<siesel> but, some tips:
<siesel> if you get the parser error means: that your xslt file is broken
<siesel> check it with "xmllint"
<dcmwai> ah.. :(
Action: dcmwai will goto sleep and fix that tomorrow.
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<siesel> if its working then try to build the html version by hand, i.e. xsltproc ....
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<dimas> ources/drivers/postgresql/psycopg/__init__.py", line 51, in Connection
<dimas> DB000:     from Driver import Connection as C
<dimas> DB000: ImportError: cannot import name Connection
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<dimas> wait
Nick change: mdupont -> md-afk
<dimas>   File "/home/ds/cvs/gnue_new/gnue-common/.cvsdevelbase/gnue/forms/GFClient.py", line 39, in ?
<dimas>     from gnue.common.logic.GTrigger import TriggerRuntimeError
<dimas> ImportError: cannot import name TriggerRuntimeError
<dimas> anyone having troubles after last commits?
<jcater> I'm sure
<dimas> TriggerRuntimeError is not exist in the common code
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<btami> hi dimas and all
<btami> i'm just reading log
<btami> in current cvs there is 
<btami> from gnue.common.logic.language.Base import LangIfCompileError
<btami> GFClient.py", line 39
<btami> have you updated all gnue-* ?
<btami> plus the dbdrivers are half-way converted, so you have to wait a little, or fix them yourself :)
<btami> l8r
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<dimas> btami: thanks.. and bye
<dtm> 'Industry wags are saying that God invented SCO to give people a company to hate more than Microsoft.'
<chillywilly> hmmm
<chillywilly> but I hate them equally
<chillywilly> ;P
<dtm> oic
<dtm> the campaign has failed in the eyes of the public
<chillywilly> yuuuup
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<reinhard> night all
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<dtm> chillywilly: i think that "hate" is a pretty strong word.  how about "loathe through your every moral fiber with the intensity of a thousand suns?"
<dtm> chillywilly: i mean, all things in moderation, etc
<jcater> TypeError: exceptions must be classes, instances, or strings (deprecated), not unicode
<jcater> Uggh!!!!
Action: jcater really dislikes unicode
<jcater> why can't everyone just deal w/English!!
Action: jcater ducks
<dtm> i had a colleague who said, "*I* don't have any need for globalization!!!"
<mdupont> peace dtm, jcater, chillywilly
<mdupont> today i have decided that the fastest way to the market is to resell free software.
<mdupont> the first thing i can do is take the applications as they are and install and test them
<mdupont> then i can also do customizations
<mdupont> and then when i have figured out how to use them, start with the reverse engineering again
<mdupont> anyway, just want to let you know that i am aware that i might have stepped on your toes
<mdupont> and want to try and buildup first a stable relationship of me being a good client of yours
<mdupont> instead of trying to first reverse engineer your systems from the getgo
<jcater> argh!
<jcater> I really dislike that our strings are not longer StringType
<jcater> s/not/no
<mdupont> what are they now, system strings?
<jcater> UnicodeType
<dtm> mdupont: are you addressing someone in particular?
Action: jcater is just bitching outloud
<dtm> jcater: noted
<jcater> you can safely ignore me
<mdupont> dtm: yes, you mostly
<mdupont> but directed at all the people
<dtm> oic
<adam5> hmm.
<dtm> noted
<adam5> how much do you get paid dtm?
<mdupont> dtm:  has been explaining the finer parts of building relationships
<dtm> adam5: what?!
<mdupont> i am learning from him
<adam5> you know
<adam5> US Dollars
<mdupont> the thing about trying to setup a crm system 
<mdupont> is that you have to concentrate on relationships
<mdupont> and relationships also are built functionally
<mdupont> for example, the shipping function requires a network of people around an area
<mdupont> but also a sales network has a diffrent relationship
<mdupont> in fact, you have service providers broadcasting offers for products
<mdupont> and customers listening
<jcater> I get paid in donuts
<jcater> that's standard, right?
<mdupont> and trading
<mdupont> yes
<adam5> jcater
<adam5> how many?
<mdupont> i sell software to the donut company
<jcater> a dozen a day
<mdupont> and they use shipping from somone who gets his hari cut 
<adam5> do you roll any of them into your 401K?
<mdupont> i guess you could set up a commune
<jcater> I have a hard time saving them
<mdupont> an internet commune that just trades in good
<jcater> plus wife seems to confiscate 50% of my earnings
<mdupont> and distributes farm goods to computer workers
<mdupont> basically a barter system
<mdupont> with a HUGE network
<mdupont> that allows trades over 10 routes
<adam5> mdupont: go work on that.
<mdupont> just the idea
<mdupont> think about it
<adam5> you could write a front end in gnue
<adam5> to manage the whole thing.
<mdupont> it could a network of gnue server
<adam5> please hole up in the basement until you are done.
<mdupont> a huge hard of them
<mdupont> are repair shops 
<mdupont> who work for barter
<mdupont> i think that would be a revolution
<adam5> all you need is a fusion generator
<adam5> and then you wont have to worry about power.
<mdupont> in the way people work
<mdupont> sure it is far fethced
Action: mdupont googles
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<mdupont> http://directory.google.com/Top/Business/International_Business_and_Trade/Barter/?tc=1
<dtm> it's called things like "gift economy", "barter", and probably revolves around such buzzwords as "communism" and "anarchy"
<dtm> there are international barter and gift economies, completely off the grid or partially meshed with the grid
<dtm> with their own currencies
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<dtm> in technology, this is implemented as p2p networks with advanced algorithms revolving around reputation
<dtm> such as http://infoanarchy.org and http://peerfear.org
Action: dtm takes off his hat in honor of the late mojonation
<jcater> but what about pearfeer?
<jcater> Fear the Pears!
<dtm> in the SF Bay Area there is BREAD Hours
<dtm> jcater: yeah i hear that
<dtm> imho, there are two main levels of effective and sustainable voluntary communism...  barter (which already exists in mass business infrastructure, via hub-like web sites, and is IRS regulated) and the aforementioned off-the-grid reputation-based non-barter gift economy
<dtm> which is at least as effective but slightly less prolific, and not IRS regulated
<adam5> dtm
<dtm> and feels a whole lot better because it's its own meritocratic network
<adam5> how much do youy get paid
<mdupont> dtm: that would allow people to keep from starving
<mdupont> people with houses could rent rooms to people who clean
<mdupont> and cook
<mdupont> what is peerfeer?
<dtm> mdupont: if yo'ure talking about public welfare, you're talking about forms of society and govt which have been attempted since forever and which are unsustainable so far, due to a lack of surrounding meritocratic structure such as capitalism
<dtm> capitalism provides an excellent meritocratic and success-based primary superstructure, with an underlying secondary socialized superstructure 
<dtm> which is a lot of the original theory behind the US
<mdupont> well i am thinking about what it takes to build a trading network
<mdupont> that optimizes the trades so that you dont need cash
<mdupont> if each person would do thier optimal work
<dtm> and then you have pockets and networks of voluntary socialism and gift economies within that
<dtm> mdupont: you're in entirely the wrong community for that, here in this channel.  now you're talking about infoanarchy and p2p
<mdupont> and that would automatically be traded at the optimial rate
<dtm> mdupont: the main structures that underlie what you're talking about, are sophisticated p2p-networked algorithms of reputation and privacy
<mdupont> yes
<dtm> and the main expert on that is the Burtonator, over at peerfear.org
<dtm> author of Newsmonster
<mdupont> and of economic trading, there must be a key size of the network
<dtm> he's the reputation and RSS guy
<mdupont> where the trading is done automatically
<dtm> as far as overall management of it as a whole network, you're talking about the late mojonation
<dtm> whose culture has redispersed into infoanarchy.rog
<dtm> org
<mdupont> i am just thinking
<dtm> they had a working implementation.
<mdupont> i will talk to someone else
<mdupont> sorry to be OT
<dtm> but of course.
<mdupont> but maybe i should look at that
<mdupont> burtonator
<mdupont> yeah
<mdupont> he is a guy i know 
<dtm> burtonator's pretty much as crazy as you are and I know you'll find him compatible
<mdupont> from the emacs scripting
<dtm> he's an emacs fiend
<mdupont> he is hiring programming
<dtm> yes he is
<dtm> not telecommuting
<dtm> only local to SF
<mdupont> i know
<dtm> bizarrely enough
<dtm> almost as bizarre as the concept that someone gave him angel money
<mdupont> well maybe they will publish a spec eventually
<mouns> bonne nuit
<dtm> which seems to violate all principles of nature
<mdupont> i need to look at peerfeer again
<dtm> but i wish him all the luck
<dtm> mdupont: he's basically you, in about 2 or 3 years
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<dtm> mdupont: except he's primarily interested in the aforementioned p2p stuff, not primarily in the TUNES-like stuff.  he's quite pragmatic.
<dtm> he's applied it, finally
<dtm> although its resource requirements are absurd
<dtm> nobody can tame him.  he is a pure force of nature.  except for his hair.
<mdupont> ok
<mdupont> i need to do some heavy research
<mdupont> talk to you later
<dtm> he's actually skimming the realm of marketability
Nick change: mdupont -> md-research
<dtm> yeah sure you go ahead and do that.  you just take on communism now.
<dtm> last week it was a code generating, self reflective computing system.  the week before, it was an enterprise app server architecture.  now global economic unification theory, p2p theory, and communism.  great.
<dtm> i'll toss some urls out if i cna
<dtm> can
<dtm> i dont know much about communism myself, but gosh darn it, it's about TIME that SOMEBODY took that project up!
<adam5> hmm.
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<dsmith> Sup dudes
<nickr> sky
<nickr> also http://nick.industrialmeats.com/proj/art/tp-trefoil.png
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<dsmith> nickr: What's that?
<nickr> pure evil
<nickr> or pure good
<nickr> depending
<jcater> is it up for a vote?
<nickr> No
<dsmith> Woe to those who call evil good and good evil.
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<dtm> dsmith: uh.  yeah.  okay.  we'll do that.
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<dtm> jamest: hi.
<jamest> hi
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<ZzZz-snore-Zz-md> dtm: nite
<ZzZz-snore-Zz-md> and yeah communism, that is not the goal
<ZzZz-snore-Zz-md> cutting out of goverment tax
<ZzZz-snore-Zz-md> that is the issue
<ZzZz-snore-Zz-md> there is no tax on a barter system
<ZzZz-snore-Zz-md> and you dont have to give IRS any of it
<ZzZz-snore-Zz-md> that is the great thing
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<dtm> ZzZz-snore-Zz-md: barter is completely taxable and regulated by the IRS
<dtm> ZzZz-snore-Zz-md: that's why people have created entirely off-the-grid non-barter systems based on gift economy and alternate non-monetary currency.
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<ajmitch> dtm: sir, are you present?
<dtm> ajmitch: yeah what's up dawg
<ajmitch> you are m4d interchange h4x0r, no?
<dtm> that is the theory and goal behind the madness.
<dtm> spill it!
<jdv79> is there any kind of projection as to when this project is guessed to be up and running with all components at least beta?
<dtm> i can handle it.
<ajmitch> all components?
<dtm> jdv79: as a metaproject, it's neverending.  the components work now though.
<dtm> jdv79: so, go ahead and use it.
<dtm> you have permission now
--- Thu Nov 27 2003