http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php?content=8030&PHPSESSID=6e2331789431089f91bef83ca292966f chillywilly: yeah, I've got a useless karamba module or two on my desktop which i never see or use :) heh kde weenies :) http://www.kde-look.org/content/preview.php?file=9453-1.png though karamba does a better job of mimicking osX they have been copying for longer generally I find these things to be more or less useless :) well it's just eye candy if i had larger resolutiton they would be highly useful without one they are moderately useful i do prefer the osX panel type however hmm, do I need to patch to use that OSX bar? http://www.xiaprojects.com/www/prodotti/osxbar/main.php?action=skpatch why would you bother? :) I notice that's dated 16th of dec hmmm, it's not doing anything there we go... derek: what's LDC? well that works like crap :) chillywilly: tuxbar? yea, trying gdesklets but can't figure out hwo to start those either :( blah apt-get remove gdesklets bah S11001001 (~sirian@63-64-11-196.evv.dialup.sigecom.net) joined #gnuenterprise. btami (~btami@ip102-205.ktv.tiszanet.hu) joined #gnuenterprise. reinhard (~reinhard@M1264P004.adsl.highway.telekom.at) joined #gnuenterprise. S11001001 (~sirian@63-64-11-196.evv.dialup.sigecom.net) left irc: "using sirc version 2.211+KSIRC/1.2.4" morning all morning thierry hi btami dcmwai (~dcmwai@219.95.174.112) joined #gnuenterprise. dimas_ (~dimas@195.218.177.46) left irc: Read error: 60 (Operation timed out) dcmwai (~dcmwai@219.95.174.112) left irc: Remote closed the connection thierry (~thierry@musashi.xtensive.com) left irc: "Client exiting" thierry (~thierry@musashi.xtensive.com) joined #gnuenterprise. btami (~btami@ip102-205.ktv.tiszanet.hu) left irc: bah can crond be configured to not send mail? well yes, by adding >/dev/null 2>&1 to the command :) to the crontab entry? yes ok, gonna see how that works, thanx :) dimas (~dimas@195.218.177.46) joined #gnuenterprise. ToyMan (~stuq@smtp.dstoys.com) joined #gnuenterprise. jamest (~jamest@gw.math.ksu.edu) joined #gnuenterprise. siesel (jan@xdsl-213-196-210-100.netcologne.de) joined #gnuenterprise. dsmith (~user@mail.actron.com) joined #gnuenterprise. siesel (jan@xdsl-213-196-210-100.netcologne.de) left irc: "Client exiting" siesel (jan@xdsl-213-196-210-100.netcologne.de) joined #gnuenterprise. lxf2 (~agus_tea@202.73.120.151) joined #gnuenterprise. chillywilly (danielb@CPE-24-167-193-166.wi.rr.com) left irc: "leaving" chillywilly (danielb@CPE-24-167-193-166.wi.rr.com) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) joined #gnuenterprise. siesel: you have the checkout working? for svn? siesel: i tried to send you mail and it bounced derek: thats strange :( jamest: I'm in the progress of moving it to ash i'll upgrade the svn on ash to 0.34 now if people don't mind. ok can you install bzip2 ? As I uploaded the dump of the repository in bzip2 format :) do we want to trust the .debs of subversion? I loaded it last night into /var/svn/gnue fwiw took a few hours while I slept jcater found a backport of it I would trust them :) As we can take hotcopies of the repository daily to be on the safe side whoops siesel: did you do a svnadmin dump? yes ok but of my home repos, not jcaters /var/svn/gnue i don't think his is working won't check out or something wendall911 (~wendallc@torus.nidaho.net) joined #gnuenterprise. yes its strange: jan@ash:/var/svn/gnue$ svnlook info . svn: Berkeley DB error svn: Berkeley DB error while opening environment for filesystem db: DB_RUNRECOVERY: Fatal error, run database recovery ah i've seen that in 0.26 one reason i wasn't ready for svn for gnue, don't see it with newer svns I had to do that the other day ;( I haven't used special options to build the tree, so probably my dump and his repository are equal i'll fix his and back it up before i upgrade dcmwai (~dcmwai@219.95.34.179) joined #gnuenterprise. on the cvs->svn topic (reading the logs) yes of course i'm fine with it if my remarks from the mail are ok and i would probably be ok with loosing history as long as we don't loose the changelog erm that would be lose not loose i guess jamest@newton:~/svn$ svn co svn+ssh://www.gnuenterprise.org/var/svn/gnue jamest@www.gnuenterprise.org's password: Warning: Remote host denied X11 forwarding. jamest@www.gnuenterprise.org's password: Warning: Remote host denied X11 forwarding. A gnue/trunk A gnue/trunk/CVSROOT A gnue/trunk/CVSROOT/cvswrappers A gnue/trunk/CVSROOT/editinfo so it's working in 0.26.0 now :) fwiw: i don't know why svn requires this l8r all reinhard (~reinhard@M1264P004.adsl.highway.telekom.at) left irc: "No problem is so interesting that you can't just walk away from it." but here and on ash I've always had to do a chmod -R og+rw /path/to/repository after setting up the groupd groups otherwise the checkout fails Action: dcmwai is away: I'm busy jamest: checkout is extremly slow, so I interrupted it and try it later it's having issues i'm proceeding w/ upgrade to 0.33 after backing up the repository which will take a while i imagine ok. it took 20min on a fast machine :) but it seems that jason already removed some files (gnue.old) f.e. as its repository is just 699 MB big. what are you saying? ash isn't fast? yes, I removed gnue.old as that was screwing up the atomic commits Action: jamest pats ash, it's ok ash fine, so we will have a working repository in some hours. what are we doing? I have a post-commit script, which send mails to CIA and gnue-commits, which could be useful. jcater: jamest updates svn to 0.33 the script is at /home/jan/gnue-svn/hooks/post-commit lxf2 (~agus_tea@202.73.120.151) left irc: Connection timed out siesel (jan@xdsl-213-196-210-100.netcologne.de) left irc: "later" for clarity we are leaving lists and website at savannah correct? that hasn't been really discussed much but for at least the time being, I think so lists would be a bitch to move over imho and maintain history i agree dyfet (~dyfet@pool-141-153-196-174.mad.east.verizon.net) joined #gnuenterprise. hi dyfet sjc (~sjc@cpc2-seve3-4-0-cust112.popl.cable.ntl.com) joined #gnuenterprise. hi! mouns (mouns@kali.mouns.org) joined #gnuenterprise. btami (~btami@wrr.napnet.hu) joined #gnuenterprise. hi all marcello (~marcello@adsl-ull-15-102.42-151.net24.it) joined #gnuenterprise. dcmwai (~dcmwai@219.95.34.179) left irc: "Client exiting" jbailey (~jbailey@199.212.225.1) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) left irc: "later" dneighbo (~dneighbo@ip68-109-180-32.ph.ph.cox.net) joined #gnuenterprise. morning all dyfet (~dyfet@pool-141-153-196-174.mad.east.verizon.net) left #gnuenterprise ("Client exiting"). 9 hours, 10min before RotK heheh I am going to go on thursda y thursady evening can't type Better than me Wed night at midnight. yeah, I'm hoping to go & watch also Wed *morning* at midnight ajmitch: I thought it was already playing in the correct hemisphere. jbailey: not yet, afaik "correct hemisphere"? are all the otheres incorrect? ;) others derek (~dneighbo@ip68-109-180-32.ph.ph.cox.net) left irc: Connection timed out Nick change: dneighbo -> derek I have a question for you guys. What is your view on adding columns to tables on the fly within an application? I don't do this, but was curious if it would be a problem. Wanted to do this to add things when I need them. Once added, I don't need to drop them. I use serialized arrays alot, but they chew up alot of resources that could be much better handled with the db. wendall911: Generally, normalised data makes adding columns unnecessary. It's hard to imagine a case where you come up with a completely unrelated type of data that shouldn't be normalised out. The case where I have enountered this is with plugin modules that require schema extensions. jbailey: i'm not familiar with the term normalised data, i'll look into that. But yeah, that is what i'm dealing with, creating plugin items that have custom schemas, I'm having trouble if they get very large when using serialized arrays jbailey: under 50 or so extensions isn't bad, but more than that is just too much wendall911: http://databases.about.com/library/weekly/aa091601a.htm jbailey: thank you very much, I guess I use normalized data and just didn't know the term...very useful information :) Those pages also describe how to work your way up to what's known as 3nf jbailey: i'll read it all the way through, thanks alot wendall911: http://www.gslis.utexas.edu/~l384k11w/normover.html seems to be a little more detailed. jbailey: yeah, I usually do "normalized data"....I shot myself in the foot with a serialized array...going to change it back and make it work correctly so i have reference tables and use my db properly Action: wendall911 kicks himself "Or suppose the last puppy knowing a particular trick gets run over by a car. His records will be removed from the database, and the trick will not be stored anywhere! This is a delete anomaly. To avoid these problems, we need the second normal form." Nothing quite like a paper that uses dead puppies as it's examples. o/` too many puuuuuuppies o/` t t t t tooo many puppies -- primus <3 roflmao only in #gnuenterprise can you find research documents about data storage that include dead puppy references ToyMan (~stuq@smtp.dstoys.com) left irc: "Client Exiting" derek: in my experience, i must concur ajmitch_ (~ajmitch@ex-vodca.otago.ac.nz) joined #gnuenterprise. siesel (jan@xdsl-213-196-210-100.netcologne.de) joined #gnuenterprise. are there any objections against moving trunk/obsolete to branch/obsolete or somewhere else? marcello (~marcello@adsl-ull-15-102.42-151.net24.it) left irc: "Leaving" marcello (~marcello@adsl-ull-15-102.42-151.net24.it) joined #gnuenterprise. amayer (~amayer___@switchtolinux.org) joined #gnuenterprise. hello, I'm looking for a general web toolkit that will automatically render database edit forms based on some kinda meta data. I've got a lot of tables, and relationships, and writing the backend code for creating and editing entities in the database is a real drag. Any suggestions? hmm, webware & FormKit? or webware & FFK gnue has a php gnue forms client, but I don't know if it's what you want or not I want a web application platform that can do this. ie. primarily for web apps. ok, webware is primarily for webapps :) Point 1 of the GNUe overview sounds very close with "data aware forms" ok, I never heard of webware.... I'll go googling.... webware.sf.net thanks... this is exactly what I need... pointers... Sounds like I need to learn Phython then ;) how does webware line up with J2EE ? umm I'm no expert on j2ee, so I can't really say :) I like the sounds of PSP.... is this mature technology? fairly mature it's been around for awhile, not at 1.0 yet though chillywilly has also been looking at it, as well as the twisted framework Well, it looks promising. I'm looking for data aware forms, and an application server platform with an established CMS module, in whcih I can build some heavy OO web apps. Zope was on my shortlist to review, and I've got a bit of J2EE expertise. trouble is the J2EE community scares me ;) hehe trouble? oh, nm read taht wrong that :) Are there many existing apps written in webware? eg. CMS, ecommerce, groupware etc? dunno about that not sure about apps.. I was thiking of doign an eCommerce platform using webware and REST arhcitecture what REST? chillywilly: and gnue? :) possibly for the db backend might as well use it siesel_ (jan@xdsl-213-168-109-133.netcologne.de) joined #gnuenterprise. amayer: REST is REpresentation State Transfer...ie.. HTTP ;) oh i see... http://www.xml.com/pub/a/2002/02/06/rest.html http://www.xml.com/pub/a/2002/02/20/rest.html amayer: the php client isn't working anymore, but there is a seperate client writen in javascript which provides the functionalty you probably need. the only drawback is, that it is constraint to mozilla based browsers or IE > 5.0 I'm just reading the GNUe docs for the first time.... very impressive.... it's just what I have been dreaming of! http://www.pbase.com/images/24017078.original.jpg dsmith: heh geez... I got some catching up to do. ToyMan (~stuq@user-0cevdks.cable.mindspring.com) joined #gnuenterprise. siesel (jan@xdsl-213-196-210-100.netcologne.de) left irc: Read error: 110 (Connection timed out) thanks for the info guys. siesel: oh, I didn't realise the php client was obsolete :) dsmith (~user@mail.actron.com) left irc: "Good Night" ajmitch: not obsolent, but it hasn't been updated for the new gfd file format (post 0.4.2) ok aka obsolete :) 4D made nifty javascript forms out of its own format forms, i never checked for compatibility though but i think it had a 256 tables limit... marcello (~marcello@adsl-ull-15-102.42-151.net24.it) left irc: "Leaving" btami (~btami@wrr.napnet.hu) left irc: "good night" jamest are you around? amayer (~amayer___@switchtolinux.org) left irc: "gotta sleep. l8rs" sorta do you know , if there is a backported subversion-tools package or not? it's installed on ash from www.backports.org the repository is reloaded and ready for checkout I checked it out, and did some commits, but there is no commit-email.pl script i forgot to install for now I just copied one from some other place, but I thought it should be included in the "subversion-tools" package no problem. i will install in a bit i removed the one from 0.26 and forgot to update and as the commit messages looks rather ugly we probably have to change some settings, but IMHO we are up again So what about an half-official posting to gnue-dev@gnue.org jamest (~jamest@gw.math.ksu.edu) left irc: "Client exiting" jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) left irc: Client Quit sjc (~sjc@cpc2-seve3-4-0-cust112.popl.cable.ntl.com) left irc: "Client exiting" jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) joined #gnuenterprise. !$* svn is down again. bash-2.05b$ svn up svn: Berkeley DB error svn: Berkeley DB error while opening 'nodes' table for filesystem /var/svn/gnue/db: DB_RUNRECOVERY: Fatal error, run database recovery stop breaking it ;) what version are you guys using? 0.33 I think siesel_ (jan@xdsl-213-168-109-133.netcologne.de) left irc: "night all" I blame derek or Fred_Frog yeah damn him thierry (~thierry@musashi.xtensive.com) left irc: Connection timed out thierry (~thierry@musashi.xtensive.com) joined #gnuenterprise. jamest (~jamest@adsl-65-64-191-177.dsl.tpkaks.swbell.net) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) left irc: Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) jbailey (~jbailey@199.212.225.1) left irc: "Client exiting" jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) joined #gnuenterprise. phenix (adam@open.phenixamd.com) left irc: "changing servers" mouns (mouns@kali.mouns.org) left irc: Remote closed the connection man.. I just had the living bajeeevus scared outta me.. whiter than I've ever been with goosebumps up and and down.. picture of George W? went outside, took the cover off my grill and lifted the lid and out flew a rat as big as a small cat both of us took off running wendall911: lol Vee: lol :) jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) left irc: Remote closed the connection gsoti_away (~gsoti@adsl-68-23-166-4.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) joined #gnuenterprise. :/ ? looking for jan's post-commit hook that issued commit info to CIA it's not where it was said to be i'll set it up w/ normal commit mails only for now ajmitch_ (~ajmitch@ex-vodca.otago.ac.nz) got netsplit. derek (~dneighbo@ip68-109-180-32.ph.ph.cox.net) got netsplit. derek (~dneighbo@ip68-109-180-32.ph.ph.cox.net) got lost in the net-split. ajmitch_ (~ajmitch@ex-vodca.otago.ac.nz) got lost in the net-split. derek (~dneighbo@ip68-109-180-32.ph.ph.cox.net) joined #gnuenterprise. #gnuenterprise: mode change '+b *!*@199.243.96.2*' by asimov.freenode.net ajmitch_ (~ajmitch@ex-vodca.otago.ac.nz) joined #gnuenterprise. #gnuenterprise: mode change '+b *!*@199.243.96.2*' by brin.freenode.net wendall911 (~wendallc@torus.nidaho.net) left irc: "Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/" jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) left irc: Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer) SachaS (~sacha@online.havanawave.com) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) joined #gnuenterprise. Ogart (~chatzilla@dialup-67.73.149.59.Dial1.Chicago1.Level3.net) joined #gnuenterprise. ToyMan (~stuq@user-0cevdks.cable.mindspring.com) left irc: "Client Exiting" Ogart (~chatzilla@dialup-67.73.149.59.Dial1.Chicago1.Level3.net) left irc: "ChatZilla 0.8.31 [Mozilla rv:1.4/20030624]" Ogart (~Chris@dialup-67.73.149.59.Dial1.Chicago1.Level3.net) joined #gnuenterprise. Ogart (~Chris@dialup-67.73.149.59.Dial1.Chicago1.Level3.net) left irc: Client Quit Ogart (~Chris@dialup-67.73.149.59.Dial1.Chicago1.Level3.net) joined #gnuenterprise. jbailey (~jbailey@CPE00062579efac-CM014260028338.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #gnuenterprise. jbailey (~jbailey@CPE00062579efac-CM014260028338.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) left irc: Client Quit phenix (phenix@open.phenixamd.com) joined #gnuenterprise. jcater (~jason@w202.z065105010.mem-tn.dsl.cnc.net) left irc: "Client exiting" jamest (~jamest@adsl-65-64-191-177.dsl.tpkaks.swbell.net) left #gnuenterprise ("Client exiting"). ajmitch_ (~ajmitch@ex-vodca.otago.ac.nz) left irc: "Leaving" Ogart (~Chris@dialup-67.73.149.59.Dial1.Chicago1.Level3.net) left irc: "ChatZilla 0.8.31 [Mozilla rv:1.4/20030624]" Mr_You (~car@cpe-024-088-142-023.triad.rr.com) joined #gnuenterprise. hi yo hi looks like I found another bad thing about Gnome 2.4 it fux0rz my resolution when trying to use zsnes soon as a I exit zsnes the resolution is left at what zsnes set it to i.e., this here window takes up my entire desktop :-/ maybe zsnes doesn't revert to the previous resolution it works fine under KDE the sound is bitched under Gnome though as I am not using esd right now...cause when I start it under kde I do: artsdsp zsnes ;P that might have something to do with it but esd sucks so bad :((( I don't want to use it --- Wed Dec 17 2003