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<johannesV> reinhard: thanks for fixes in NamespaceCore.py .... it's workin !
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<reinhard> good morning all
<reinhard> johannesV: good to hear
<reinhard> kilo: do you know any news about our windows issues?
<reinhard> wrt strptime and wrt plugin handling?
<reinhard> seems like btami is hiding from me ;-)
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<kilo> reinhard: btami is working on them and they look good
<kilo> errrr....
<kilo> I mean btami is working on windows exe packages
<kilo> strptime I think is OK, he ran a test against it and it correctly displayed dates and times
<reinhard> cool
<kilo> but plugin handling... hmm...
<kilo> I'm gonna ask him in 5 minutes
<kilo> reinhard: btami says plugins will be ok on windows
<kilo> setup.exe will be ready on 1-2 days
<reinhard> cool
<kilo> McMillan can be forgot, py2exe is the way to go
<kilo> and he is not hiding from you just working... 8-))
<kilo> 'if frozen' can be forgot too
<reinhard> that's cool
<kilo> cool cool cool like Siberia
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<SachaS> hi everyone
<kilo> hi
<SachaS> hi kilo
<SachaS> hi reinhard:
<SachaS> i just respond to your email.
<SachaS> even when client 2 committs and client 1 runs a query after the committ, client 1 still cannot see the "just" created business object.
<SachaS> hi johannesV: good to see you comitting ;)
<kilo> @weather QVU
<bigbrother> kilo: Error: No such location could be found.
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<johannesV> svn: Commit failed (details follow):
<johannesV> svn: Berkeley DB error while opening environment for filesystem /var/svn/gnue/db:
<johannesV> DB_RUNRECOVERY: Fatal error, run database recovery
<johannesV> svn: Your commit message was left in a temporary file:
<johannesV> svn:    '/home/johannes/prj/gnue/gnue-forms/svn-commit.tmp'
<johannesV> SachaS: hrmm, not finished sending all commits and svn crashes ...
<johannesV> *!")(§/$)!""!
<SachaS> dah :|
<SachaS> whats the current url for the irc logs?
<SachaS> reinhard: for your info: in the client 1, client 2 example i run two forms, both with the same "hacker" user.
<kilo> http://www.gnuenterprise.org/irc-logs/
<SachaS> thanks kilo
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<johannesV> reinhard: i think you can svn up now ... :)
<johannesV> i'm going to add the self-test stuff to common.logic.language now
<kilo> SachaS: is there an airport in Vaduz?
<johannesV> reinhard: i think we should add a sample-proc to the appserver's sample.gsd using procedures with params and result
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<reinhard> SachaS: ok, will look at it
<reinhard> johannesV: agree on the sample.gsd procedure
<reinhard> johannesV: is it possible to pass parameters when you call the procedure in a form trigger?
<johannesV> reinhard: there is something like a call () ... 
<johannesV> so it's possible to pass params with that (as dict)
<johannesV> will give this a try afterwards
<reinhard> doh
<reinhard> svn up gives me
<reinhard> svn: subversion/libsvn_ra_svn/marshal.c:434: vwrite_tuple: Assertion `opt || cstr' failed.
<johannesV> f*
<reinhard> deleting the logic directory before svn up helped
<johannesV> wow ...
<johannesV> seems as if svn can't handle svn remove properly
<reinhard> DB000:   File "/home/reinhard/prj/gnue/gnue-common/.cvsdevelbase/gnue/common/logic/adapters/Base.py", line 148, in __init__
<reinhard> DB000:     self._prepare ()
<reinhard> DB000:   File "/home/reinhard/prj/gnue/gnue-common/.cvsdevelbase/gnue/common/logic/adapters/python.py", line 180, in _prepare
<reinhard> DB000:     raise language.CompileError, self._traceback (1)
<reinhard> DB000: NameError: global name 'language' is not defined
<johannesV> ups
<reinhard> when starting appserver sample form
<johannesV> lost an import statement
<johannesV> reinhard: svn up
<SachaS> you guys are amazing!
<SachaS> :)
<SachaS> svn up gnue gives me also
<SachaS> svn: subversion/libsvn_ra_svn/marshal.c:434: vwrite_tuple: Assertion `opt || cstr' failed.
<SachaS> Aborted
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<kilo> SachaS: delete common/src/logic directory, then svn cleanup gnue. then svn up gnue
<SachaS> thanks kilo
<reinhard> is somebody here running forms against a postgres database directly?
<reinhard> i mean without appserver?
<SachaS> not me. have not done so for a while.
<SachaS> are there any outstanding commits?
<SachaS> make postgresql fails in samples dir.
<reinhard> works for me
<SachaS> ok. will try again.
<SachaS> DB000:     AttributesNSImpl(newattrs, qnames))
<SachaS> DB000:   File "/usr/local/gnue/lib/python/gnue/common/definitions/GParser.py", l
<SachaS> ine 258, in startElementNS
<SachaS> DB000:     raise MarkupError, tmsg
<SachaS> DB000: gnue.common.definitions.GParser.MarkupError: Error processing <import-tab
<SachaS> ledata> tag [I do not know what a <import-tabledata> tag does]
<SachaS> make: *** [postgresql] Error 1
<SachaS> have a fresh checkout of gnue-common ... do i need to run setup-cvs again?
<reinhard> not sure
<reinhard> johannesV: you still here? do you know what this means?
<johannesV> there's a missing 'importable' in common.schema.GSParser
<SachaS> rerun setup again. removed gnue-common before svn up
<johannesV> SachaS: make postgresql fails ?
<SachaS> ok is working again.
<SachaS> i removed the gnue-common tool (rm -rf) and then did a svn up gnue-common ...
<SachaS> but now I rerun the setup-cvs.py and it (make postgresql in samples) works again.
<SachaS> sorry for confusion.
<johannesV> ?
<SachaS> johannesV: make postgresql works for me, too. again.
<johannesV> ok guys, i'm now leavin for lunch and the some outdoor-work ...
<johannesV> i'll be back in the evening (i hope so)
<SachaS> thanks johannesV!
<SachaS> i hope so too ;)
* johannesV is away: family
<SachaS> johannesV are procedures with parameters and return values working?
<SachaS> can i test them?
<reinhard> SachaS: if you want
<SachaS> ;) of course I will test them.
<SachaS> amazing how you made it work!
<SachaS> i am amazed how well you can enhance the given code ...
<SachaS> :)
<SachaS> will test after lunch.
<SachaS> reinhard: jcater gave me an account on ash, last night. so that I can scp the gnue appserver manual.
<SachaS> a) i forgot where the place was, where I have to copy the file (was somewhere /var/www .../appserver/...)
<SachaS> b) when I tried last night I got a permission denied.
<SachaS> i will check a) on the irc-log
<SachaS> a) is not in the public log :(
<reinhard> SachaS: i'm not up to date with the website structure
<SachaS> reinhard: thats ok. will check with jcater.
<SachaS> reinhard: are you happy with what you have achieved the last couple of days?
<reinhard> well
<reinhard> strictly speaking
<reinhard> i am happy with what johannes has achieved the last couple of days ;-)
<reinhard> mainly
<SachaS> haha
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<reinhard> hi btami
<reinhard> was only joking about you hiding :)
<reinhard> good to hear things work again on windows
<btami> hi
<btami> yes, they will
<btami> i was only a lurker in last days, but
<btami> real work was very important
<reinhard> btami: yeah, i know, that weird thing called "real life"
<reinhard> :)
<Vee> @revision channellogger
<bigbrother> Vee: $Id: ChannelLogger.py,v 1.24 2004/02/17 19:04:24 jemfinch Exp $
<btami> Traceback (most recent call last):
<btami>   File "c:\python23\Lib\site-packages\gnue\forms\GFForm.py", line 520, in commit
<btami>     block.processCommit()
<btami>   File "c:\python23\Lib\site-packages\gnue\forms\GFObjects\GFBlock.py", line 416
<btami> , in processCommit
<btami>     self._resultSet.post()
<btami>   File "c:\python23\Lib\site-packages\gnue\common\datasources\drivers\Base\Resul
<btami> tSet.py", line 274, in post
<btami>     self._postingRecord.post()
<btami>   File "c:\python23\Lib\site-packages\gnue\common\datasources\drivers\Base\Recor
<btami> dSet.py", line 240, in post
<btami>     self._postChanges()
<btami>   File "c:\python23\Lib\site-packages\gnue\common\datasources\drivers\DBSIG2\Rec
<btami> ordSet.py", line 54, in _postChanges
<btami>     statement = self._buildUpdateStatement()
<btami>   File "c:\python23\Lib\site-packages\gnue\common\datasources\drivers\DBSIG2\Rec
<btami> ordSet.py", line 118, in _buildUpdateStatement
<btami>     updates.append ("%s=%s" % (field,
<btami> UnicodeDecodeError: 'ascii' codec can't decode byte 0xf5 in position 4: ordinal
<btami> not in range(128)
<btami> trying to save 'Bajusz Tamás' in my test gfd
<btami> s/'Bajusz'/'Petőfi'
<reinhard> figured that
<reinhard> position 4 :)
<reinhard> if you look at DBSIG2/RecordSet.py
<reinhard> line 118
<reinhard> there are 2 parameters to the %s=%s string
<reinhard> it seems that one of them is a string and the other is a unicode
<reinhard> can you find out which one is which?
<btami> the first is string
<btami> the second comes from 'Petőfi'
<reinhard> and is uniocde or string type?
<btami> i use only ascii filed/table names in my db
<SachaS> reinhard: how do I check for an empty string of a property?
<reinhard> if <propertyname> is None
<reinhard> there is no difference between an empty string and None
<SachaS> ok.
<SachaS> when i check with repr ( propertyname )
<SachaS> i get u'somethingsomtehing'
<reinhard> but then it's not empty?
<SachaS> hold on.
<btami> reinhard: i will try later, real work comes to me... 
<reinhard> btami: ok
<reinhard> thanks
<SachaS> reinhard. it was working. was my mistake. checking for None is OK.
<SachaS> so far i have tested my old forms, old procedures with new code. had no problem.
<SachaS> going to test a procedure with parameters, and then the return value.
<reinhard> cool
<SachaS> test as in making one or two sample procedures...
<SachaS> now, because the procedure have parameters and return values I have to change my application again ;)
<kilo> reinhard: trying to help btami, both strings are unicode
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<SachaS> in python, is there a construct to comment over more than one line? ala /*   \n\n\n */
<reinhard> kilo: i'll have to try to reproduce it
<SachaS> ok. string and boolean parameter work.
<reinhard> SachaS: start every line with a #
<reinhard> SachaS: no other possibility
<SachaS> ok. thanks.
<SachaS> will check return value.
<SachaS> string return value works.
<SachaS> cool.
<SachaS> hehe
<SachaS> when returning a business object from the appserver procedure to the form (traceback of form):
<SachaS>     return self._adapter._runMethod (self._methodname, *args, **params)
<SachaS>   File "/home/sacha/gnuenterprise/gnue/gnue-common/.cvsdevelbase/gnue/common/rpc/drivers/xmlrpc/pw_xmlrpc/ClientAdapter.py", line 107, in _runMethod
<SachaS>     result = to_call (*__args, **params)
<SachaS>   File "/usr/lib/python2.3/xmlrpclib.py", line 1029, in __call__
<SachaS>     return self.__send(self.__name, args)
<SachaS>   File "/usr/lib/python2.3/xmlrpclib.py", line 1316, in __request
<SachaS>     verbose=self.__verbose
<SachaS>   File "/usr/lib/python2.3/xmlrpclib.py", line 1070, in request
<SachaS>     headers
<SachaS> ProtocolError: <ProtocolError for localhost:8765/: 500 Internal error>
<SachaS> did not expect it to work.
<kingpin2k> hmm...appserver doesn't want to start
<SachaS> kingpin2k did you svn up?
<kingpin2k> just did
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<SachaS> did you rebuild the gnue database?
<kingpin2k> ah no
<kingpin2k> thanks
<SachaS> try that
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<SachaS> mx.DateTime works also as return value.
<SachaS> trying a dict as return value next
<SachaS> dict as return value works also.
<SachaS> :)
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<jamest_work> /who jamest
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<jcater> SachaS: I fixed the permissions on that file
<jcater> if you want to try to scp again
<SachaS> jcater: can you give me the path again, please
<jcater> /var/www/tools/appserver/docs/appserver_howto.pdf
<SachaS> ok thanks
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<SachaS> @weather perth
<bigbrother> SachaS: Error: No such location could be found.
<SachaS> @rhat
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<Vee> how do you disable ipv6 in debian?
<Vee> my laptop is insisting on setting it up and I've set every occurance I can find of net-10-pf to off, update-modules, and rebooted
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<reinhard> well
<reinhard> new plugin loader works
<reinhard> could be very interesting for you, jamest and jcater
<reinhard> should improve error handling and such
<reinhard> for now, i've changed rpc driver handling to use this plugin loader
<reinhard> i think it should very well be possible for datasources/drivers
<reinhard> not sure about forms uidrivers
<reinhard> or reports filters
<reinhard> or any other plugin systems we have now
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<wendall911> oops, that's what the X does
<chillywilly> heh
<jcater> reinhard: that's cool
<jcater> I want to look at it
<jcater> as I'm sure the other examples you gave can use it too
<reinhard> jcater: as soon as you regenerate epydoc
<jamest> new plugin loader?
<reinhard> there will be a quite complete documentation in the web
<jamest> we now have a standard one?
<reinhard> jamest: yes
<jcater> jamest: he generalized loading plugins
<jamest> w00t!
<reinhard> jamest: it can do like
<reinhard> $ gcvs plugin.py postgresql
<reinhard> find postgresql: gnue.common.datasources.drivers.postgresql.pypgsql
<reinhard> err well
<reinhard> if you have a structure like we have
<reinhard> with load ('postgresql') it will load the first available postgresql driver
<reinhard> with load ('popy') it will load popy
<reinhard> s/available/functional/
<jamest> i'll be interested in that
<reinhard> where functional == all dependencies fulfilled
<jamest> as I use plugins alot
<jamest> and was thinking it'd be nice to have a std handler
<reinhard> if none of the installed drivers works, it generates an exception like this:
<jamest> i assume this is in common?
<reinhard> gnue.common.apps.plugin.LoadError: Cannot load plugin xmlrpc
<reinhard> The following plugins failed:
<reinhard> * gnue.common.rpc.drivers.xmlrpc.py_xmlrpc: AdapterInitializationError: 
<reinhard> Unable to load xmlrpc.  To use the XML-RPC interface, 
<reinhard> please install xmlrpc from:
<reinhard>     http://sourceforge.net/projects/py-xmlrpc
<reinhard> the appropriate DEBIAN package is python-xmlrpc.deb
<reinhard> * gnue.common.rpc.drivers.xmlrpc.pw_xmlrpc: AdapterInitializationError: 
<reinhard> Unable to load xmlrpclib.  To use the XML-RPC interface, 
<reinhard> please install xmlrpc from:
<reinhard>     http://www.pythonware.com/products/xmlrpc/
<reinhard> yep
<reinhard> that is
<reinhard> if for example you wanted postgresql
<jamest> which means you added docs to the developers guide already right?
<reinhard> and none of our 4 postgresql drivers work
<jamest> =)
<reinhard> you get an exception that lists all 4 exceptions that happened when trying to import the drivers
<reinhard> also it has a list() method
<reinhard> that returns a dictionary for all installed drivers
<reinhard> where the key is the driver name
<reinhard> and the value is either the loaded module of the driver
<reinhard> or the exception that hapened when trying to load it
<reinhard> so you can generate lists like
<reinhard> available drivers:
<reinhard>   postgresql.popy: ok
<reinhard>   postgresql.psycopg: ImportError: module foobar not defined
<reinhard>   mysql.mysql: ok
<reinhard> etc.
<jcater> gack!
<jcater> feedback?
<jcater> robust code?
<jcater> that has no place in gnue!
<reinhard> even worse
<reinhard> comments!
<reinhard> ;-)
<jcater> sigh
<jcater> but!
<jcater> no docs yet
<jcater> so there's still hope
<reinhard> well
<reinhard> docstrings :)
<reinhard> i almost forgot to mention
<reinhard> of course it doesn't need the DRIVERS = [...] list any more
<reinhard> well
<reinhard> apart from that
<reinhard> johannes has done major changes in the trigger execution code
<reinhard> it would be nice if both of you (jamest, jcater) could test
<jamest> do the plugin files require a dict to make all that happen?
<reinhard> as i figure you use most of the trigger features
<reinhard> jamest: a dict?
<jamest> i have apps that load an entire dir of plugins w/ no prior knowledge
<reinhard> not sure what you mean
<jcater> jamest: that
<jcater> 's what his does
<jcater> scans a directory
<reinhard> ah yes
<jcater> which is what dbdrivers originally did, but our win32 install won't support that
<jcater> which is why we added the DRIVERS = [...] thing
<jcater> but I think we might have a way to work around mcmillan 
<reinhard> jcater: btami confirmed today that he can make it work under windows
<jcater> excellent
<reinhard> s/confirmed/pretended/ ;-)
<reinhard> j/k
<reinhard> if dbdrivers used the new plugin loader
<reinhard> we could also undo that delayed loading stuff
<reinhard> which would basically reduce some drivers to a 2-liner
<reinhard> class Connection (Base.Connection):
<reinhard>   pass
<reinhard> :)
<jcater> I'm not as sure about that
<jcater> how that would work
<jcater> but we can try
<reinhard> in fact
<reinhard> there *may* not be a delayed import
<reinhard> or the loader cannot find out whether the driver is usable or not
<reinhard> for a driver with missing dependencies
<reinhard> an exception *must* occur upon import
<reinhard> which sample for 2-tier gnue forms is fastest to setup?
<jcater> zipcode
<jcater> is what I use
<reinhard> thanks
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<jamest> that's probably the most well tested piece of code in the entire project
<jamest> zipcode.gfd
<jamest> if it runs we're good for release
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<jcater> zipcode and intro
<jcater> yip :)
<jcater> probably sad just how true that is
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<jamest> hi kreiszner
<kreiszner> hello
<kreiszner> jamest is gnu-sb actively being worked on and at what point is it
<jamest> i don't think it's currently being worked on
<kreiszner> sad
<jamest> Vee and derek were working on it but I don't know where they are at
<jamest> i also *think* jcater was adding in aria schema/support 
<jamest> but got sidetracked
<kreiszner> aria?
<jamest> http://arias.sourceforge.net/
<jamest> at least one of their developers hangs out in here
<jamest> dcmwai
<jamest> and i believe there is interest in interoperating with them
<jamest> they were/are looking at using pieces of gnue 
<kreiszner> I have been looking at gnue practically from its inception but didn't feel 
<kreiszner> earlier that I had the knowledge to actually get it up and running for my busness
<kreiszner> I have moved much of my data over to postgresql from MD access
<jamest> how do you access it now?
<kreiszner> but I am still using only psql as my primary interface and yet my desire
<kreiszner> is to develop or find a package to do all of my accounting and inventory management
<jamest> i think that is where the gnue-sb guys were working
<jamest> i really haven't looked at it yet
<jamest> though i have a client that has some interest in moving out of quickbooks
<jamest> for what they need aria is close which means I will have to look at gnue-sb soon
<jamest> sigh, i need a clone
* jamest had convieniantly forgot about needed to look at aria
<kreiszner> One of my purposes for working with psql was to familiarize myself w postgresql
<kreiszner> while you are ordering clone can you order one for me to
<jamest> you bet.  you want one of yourself or of someone else?
<kreiszner> It doesn't mater if they can help me
<jamest> my ride is here for lunch
<jamest> i'll be back in about  1 hr
<kreiszner> by
<jamest> if you do try gnue
<jamest> load common, forms, designer and you can rapidly make screens for your existing data
<jamest> as psql maintainenance has got to hurt :)
<jamest> i'll be happy to help you thru the process 
<jamest> if you like
<kreiszner> yes I don't do actuallly accounting iit yet
<jamest> since my lunch ride is also my wife i really have to leave now :)
<jamest> bbi1h
<kreiszner> by
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<SachaS> hi reinhard: what was the problem with client1 / client 2 ?
<SachaS> last patch (rollback) probably
<reinhard> yes
<reinhard> off for today
<reinhard> cu
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<chillywilly> heheh
<chillywilly> gotta love his quit messages
<Vee> @gvim++
<jamest> sigh
<jamest> i meant to tell him i'd test triggers out over the weekend
<jamest> s/him/reinhard
<jamest> ouch
<jamest> er, wrong window
<chillywilly> what's the path to anon svn?
<chillywilly> erm, for common
<jcater> anon common?
<jcater> svn://svn.gnuenterprise.org/var/svn/gnue/trunk is anon svn
<jcater> tack on /gnue-common
<jcater> to only get common
<chillywilly> k
<chillywilly> actually I just wanted contrib
<chillywilly> ;P
<chillywilly> I think I'll grab it all
<chillywilly> geez...website is rather large ;)
<jcater> contrib is separate repository
<jcater> svn://svn.gnuenterprise.org/var/svn/gnue-contrib
<chillywilly> bleh
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<SachaS> anyone tested forms trigger with new patches from reinhard/johannesV ?
<jamest> SachaS: not me
<wendall911> could anybody tell me how to give my user account permissions to print :)
<SachaS> ok. forms still working, was my fault :)
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<jamest> wendall911?
<wendall911> jamest: using cups, but getting a Media tray empty! message, figured it was a permissions problem
<wendall911> can cat a message to the printer device from root and it works fine
<wendall911> Linux printing information == crap
<SachaS> jamest: a = {'a': b, 'c': 5} is a dict, right?
<SachaS> and ['a','b'] is a list, right
<SachaS> ?
<chillywilly> yes
<SachaS> ok.
<SachaS> seems like, when i return a dict from a appserver procedure I receive a list in the form ....
<SachaS> a list which includes a dict.
<SachaS> yep.
<SachaS> a dict is packed into a list and sent back.
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<jcater> -------
<jcater> if anyone gets an error like ImportError: cannot import name getLanguageAdapter
<jcater> rm -rf gnue-common/src/logic/language
<jcater> then you should be fine
<jcater> -------
<revDeke> what is status of navigator 
<revDeke> good design sessions today
<revDeke> several things i am thinking gnue can not do well :(
<jcater> 0.0.6
<revDeke> BUT all most all of them are things required for a financial system
<revDeke> so at some point we need to address
<revDeke> most notably is ability to do "transaction detail"
<revDeke> i.e. ledger detail
<revDeke> so if you have 
<revDeke> an account and it has $45 in it
<revDeke> you want to to change the value to $50
<revDeke> you don't over write $45 w/ $50
<revDeke> but instead add $5
<revDeke> now $45 + $5 = $50
<jcater> ?
<jcater> why can't we do that now
<revDeke> in thinking about it from the forms perspective you could do it through complex entries
<revDeke> but it renders to a degree the power of the form useless
<jcater> I guess I don't get what you describe
<jcater> I do something similar on my sales ticket forms at the store
<jcater> or at least I guess
<revDeke> hmmm
<jcater> maybe I misunderstand
<revDeke> how to best explain
<jcater> wife enters a new line in detail block
<jcater> total is updated in master block
<revDeke> i have a transaction table that has ACCT 1
<revDeke> it has 8 records
<jcater> and taxes are recalced, etc
<revDeke> all for $1
<revDeke> so the total is $8
<revDeke> in the UI
<revDeke> i want to show $8 (and none of the detail)
<revDeke> i change $8 to $15 dollars
<revDeke> and when i do so
<revDeke> it writes a new record for $7 to that account
<revDeke> jcater: the problem is doing that w/o doing the detail block
<revDeke> so i was thinking in order to do it you would have to have "dummy" entry widgets
<revDeke> then hide the detail source
<revDeke> and the master source
<revDeke> load the contents of the master into the dummy
<jcater> I see what you're saying
<revDeke> and on save do a "diff" and write the diff as a new record in the detail
<jcater> same thing the spanish group hit
<revDeke> and refresh the dummy entry
<jcater> though I can't imagine something behaving that way
<jcater> most I've seen you have to post a correction
<revDeke> i.e. i think forms could do it via triggers and dummy entries
* jcater isn't questioning need, just saying I've not seen that in any accounting systems we've used
<jcater> you have to account for the detail record (i.e., the change)
<revDeke> but once we get into dummy entries
<revDeke> why bother using forms 
<revDeke> how do the systems you use work?
<jcater> you have to post a $7 adjustment
<jcater> w/explanation
<revDeke> i can see it only happening one of two ways (and this is more a budgeting than an accounting function)
<revDeke> accounting i would post the $7 adjustment
<revDeke> but with budgeting you arent thinking in terms of single transactions per say and more a global perspective
<revDeke> ie. you want to enter what you want to spend
<jcater> but what you describe shouldn't be hard to w/our datasources and a little TLC
<revDeke> not what you wanted to spend before +/- an amount to get to where you want to spend
<jcater> i.e., I'm sure you could mark a datasource as "transactional"
<revDeke> jcater: i think gnue-common would handle it just fine
<jcater> (bad word, though, as transactions+databases usually imply something else
<revDeke> im just not sure if i lose too much in forms that it starts to become more hassle than benefit
<jcater> ?
<revDeke> audit trail is what you could call it
<revDeke> or ledger detail
<revDeke> the other option though less "accounting like"
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<revDeke> would be to do an "audit log"
<revDeke> so that you have no really ledger
<revDeke> you have $20 and want to make it $40
<revDeke> you overwrite teh $20 w/ $40
<revDeke> but then in an audit table
<revDeke> you note who changed that record at what time and what old value was and what new value was
<jcater> yeah, I've done both approaches here
<revDeke> it achieves to a degree the same problem we want to solve and that is "audit trail" accountablility within the budget system
<revDeke> however it does not look like a normal "accounting ledger" so confuses accountants
<revDeke> the other way looks like an accounting general ledger detail which they like
<revDeke> but unlike an accounting system you are not posting Journal Vouchers or Debits/Credits to come to a number
<revDeke> but instead posting a number and relying on the system to auto create the transaction detail
<revDeke> if you think it is doable that gives me great hope :)
<jcater> I don't see it as a big deal
<SachaS> good night
<SachaS> bye
<jcater> of course, we can't do it at the moment
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* revDeke was thinking it was possibly but possibly more cumbersome than just using gnue-common and pyGTK natively
<jcater> but I don't think it'd be a big deal to add
<revDeke> timewise what do you think it would take to add?
<revDeke> i REALLY want to use gnue (all pieces of gnue) for this project
<jcater> um
<jcater> well
<jcater> first
<jcater> I
<jcater> I'd check out papo
<revDeke> but i am on tight time line of having to deliver by early july
<jcater> and see what they did and if we wnant to use their approach
<revDeke> so amount of time putting into infrastructure enhancements will be limited on this side :(
<jcater> lemme think thru the datasources for a sec
<revDeke> good news is if we did this in all gnue
<revDeke> there would be major precendent that the framework is DEFINITIVELY ready for production financial applications
<revDeke> the other thing that is going to kick my ass is security
<revDeke> we HAVE to have a lot of field level permissions
<revDeke> and im just not sure the best way to handle that right now
<revDeke> i know that we will have tables w/in the application that store permission data
<revDeke> but not sure best way to make forms implement that
* revDeke is suspecting for now it will have to be all trigger based
<revDeke> navigator i think will solve a lot of issues i was thinking forms fell short on previously
<revDeke> as its tree plus "parameterized" forms solves a big issue for me in needing tree component
<revDeke> the only big draw back is i would love a dynamic navigator :)
<revDeke> i.t. many of the contents coming out of table instead of an xml file
<jcater> any random table?
<jcater> or just a table in general
<revDeke> a table in general would work
<revDeke> basically i need security in it
<revDeke> and so if it was table driven and i could talk to my security table
<revDeke> i could build the access trees in navigator dyanmically
<revDeke> based on profile and security makeup
<revDeke> for exmaple say i wanted have a form that displayed a budget
<revDeke> so i make it a parameter that tells which department to load
<revDeke> now i have one form
<revDeke> and in the navigator tree
<revDeke> i have a list of all the departments
<revDeke> if i click on dept 10 it opens dept 10 budget
<revDeke> if i click on dept 50 it opens dept 50 budget
<jamest> revDeke: what database?
<jamest> backend
<revDeke> but you see if you are an OMB user you woudl see all departments
<revDeke> if you are a sheriff user you might see only 2 departments etc
<revDeke> jamest: mssql
<revDeke> psych!
<revDeke> postgresql of course
<jamest> as postgresql has rules that allow for a poor mans audit train
<jamest> train
<jamest> traiL
<jcater> choo choo!
<revDeke> i have our db looking at that
<revDeke> the problem is this needs to be something the end user can see readily
<revDeke> so are those "logs" or "tables"
<jamest> tables
<jamest> here
<revDeke> hmmmm
<jamest> CREATE RULE rule_note_insert AS
<jamest> ON INSERT TO note
<jamest> DO
<jamest>  INSERT INTO log_note
<jamest>              (claim_no,userid,date,note,mod_type)
<jamest>  VALUES
<jamest>              (new.claim_no,new.userid,new.date,new.note,'I');
<jamest> put in 3 of those
<jcater> I've done both approaches in oracle using triggers
<jamest> insert, update, delete
<jcater> (which postgres could do too)
<revDeke> sadly i want to avoid triggers in the sense i want this to be portable, but i have to do what i have to do
<jamest> modify that last field to be 'I','U','D' (i'll let you figure out what they stand for)
<jamest> you are done
<jamest> poor mans audit trail
<revDeke> jamest: that solves my initial problem of the audit trail, but isnt good in that it doesnt look like a ledger
<jamest> about as portable as I am good looking though
<revDeke> so is this a postgres feature?
<revDeke> i.e. do you have to create those tables
<revDeke> or are they created via some setting initially
* revDeke was thinking of doing this as explained above as an option if need be
<jamest> you create them
<jcater> in your ledger effect, are you wanting one table and a details table?
<jcater> or just a single table altogether?
<jamest> it's really brute force, non portable 
<revDeke> jcater: it coudl be done eitehr way
<jamest> but it works for tracking who did what when
<jamest> i use it cause I'm lazy and needed it yesterday
<revDeke> we discussed the proper db way is probably one table
<revDeke> BUT
<revDeke> two tables is probably better for performance over time
<revDeke> and the second table is merely a "Bucket" for consolidation
<revDeke> so as you write that $7 transaction to detail table
<revDeke> it automatically resums all the keys and updates the budget table
<revDeke> er bucket (not budget)
<revDeke> and at anypoint you could reabuild that bucket table entirely out of the detail
<revDeke> we are not sold on one way or another at this point
<revDeke> we have all done both approaches at one time or another
<revDeke> which brings up the other question i had... what is transiosolation like in postgres?
<revDeke> do tehy have repeatable rereads or something similar
<revDeke> so if you pull a record into memory and change it
<revDeke> then go to save it
<jamest> revdeke you guys use ERWin huh?
<revDeke> and someone has changed that record before you save
<revDeke> can you get it to reread the original to let the programmer know if the record is clean or dirty
<revDeke> ?
<revDeke> what is ER Win?
<jcater> um
<jamest> it is 
<revDeke> right now we are using a white board and openoffice... soon to use emacs/gnue :)
<jamest> and I quote
<jamest> the tool set of choice for Maricopa County
<jamest> http://www3.ca.com/SuccessStories/Success_Detail.asp?CID=38944
<revDeke> ?
<jcater> what I intended to do (and can't remember if it's still on my todo list or done)
<revDeke> it aint the toolset for my ass
<revDeke> i dont know of anyone here that uses it
<jamest> ah, nevermind
<revDeke> must be an elected official :)
<jamest> they had that link on the ERWin page
<jcater> sql-forms, when you first try to change a record
<jamest> and it's not erwin
<jcater> it tries to lock the record for updates
<jcater> (not for reading, just updates)
<jcater> until you save your changes
<revDeke> jcater: i would LOVE that
<revDeke> but i dont think postgres can do that
<revDeke> can it?
<jcater> I'm sure
<jcater> yes
<jcater> as that's always one of the arguments of pgsql over mysql
<jcater> is mysql didn't do row-level locking for a while
<jcater> (can now, I think)
<revDeke> larry bernosky eh.. i dont even know where the hell he works
<revDeke> can we make forms do that?
<revDeke> hold something for a lock?
<jamest> that would be done in the datasources wouldn't it
<jamest> not forms
<revDeke> as part of the issue is once you go in edit mode you have to have locks time out
<jcater> yes
<jcater> well
<jcater> yes
<jamest> then forms would call the lock
<revDeke> jamest: thats what i meant
<jamest> i think all we'd need is a select for update on the record in question
<jcater> that is a feature I need
<revDeke> btw: like i said if we can do thsi all in forms.. forms will be ready for primetime financial applications
<jcater> jamest: yes
<jamest> but how portable is select for update
<jamest> oracle yes pgsql yes
<jcater> jamest: I'd do it like we do the transaction support
<jamest> poorly?
* jamest runs
<jcater> the base drivers would call self._lockRecord
<jcater> if a database can't support it, then _lockRecord is nothing more than a return
<ajmitch> morning all
<jcater> I think most dbs support some form of record locking
<jcater> whether or not it's select for update, I dunno
<jcater> morning
<jamest> ajmitch: good morning
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<chillywilly> heh
<chillywilly> sup ajmitch ?
<chillywilly> aw shit I gotta bust some aussie heads don't I?
<ajmitch> gidday chillywilly
<chillywilly> battery?
<chillywilly> gidday mate
<revDeke> hmmm maybe we can talk more tonight
<chillywilly> no way
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<johnf> Hi, I'm a newbie to IRC and GNUe.
<johnf> I'm using X-chat and on the right of the window there is a list of names.  The Names are people logged in?
<jcater> hi john
<jcater> yes, that's correct
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<johnf> Great - I hoping someone can help me get the GNUe working.  I have been following the "SUSEQuickStart" doc's and have an error when I attempt a database connection.
<jcater> are you using a released version?
<jcater> or one of our nightlies?
<jcater> is that your email on the mailing list?
<johnf> I believe I have the released version.  My common is 0.5.3
<jcater> one thing I noticed is your connection.conf is slightly different than the one listed on the howto
<jcater>       [gnue]
<jcater>       comment = Production DB(G)
<jcater>       provider = pygresql
<jcater>       host = gnue
<jcater>       dbname = gnue
<jcater> is what's on that quickstart
<jcater> notice the provider= line
<johnf> Right - I tried that first then the one I listed in my email (thanks for reading it).  Also note that I chnaged the host, and dbname.  
<jcater> well, given what you posted in your email
<jcater> I don't think it's something you did
<jcater> looks like that release had a bug in the pygresql drivers :(
<jcater> try installing a nightly, as I'm sure that's been fixed
<jcater> I think there's a link in that Quick Start guide
<jcater> ah, no there's not
<jcater> http://www.gnuenterprise.org/downloads/snapshots.php
<johnf> I'm not sure how to use SVN/cvs and I don't see a link on the 3 pages of the howto
<johnf> You typed it to fast- how do I use it?
<jcater> no, the links on that page are installable just like the released version you downloaded
<jcater> you don't need svn/cvs
<jcater> they just aren't official releases
<johnf> Duh!!! I get it - it's a link - I'll do it immediately.
<jcater> I have to run
<jcater> maybe someone else can help if you have any more questions
<johnf> BTW should I download all the links?
<jcater> no
<jcater> just the first GNUe-Common and the first GNUe-Forms listed
<jcater> (to test forms)
<johnf> Then I download only common first and test.  Thanks for you help.
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<johnf> I have donwload the nightly and I changed the provider = pygresql and get the following error "No module named Driver"
<johnf> Changing the provider to "postgresql" gets "cannot import name Connection"
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<johnf> Hi Jcater
<johnf> I have downloaded the new common and forms and still get errors?
<jcater> the same error
<jcater> or different errors?
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<johnf> The same two errors  - "provider=pygresql" - "No module named Driver"
<johnf> Using Postgres as the provider gets "Cannot import name Connection"
<jcater> hmm
<jcater> what does gfcvs --version return?
<jcater> that's a very odd error to still be getting
<johnf> where do I run gfcvs?
<jcater> well
<jcater> ag
<jcater> ah
<jcater> sorry
<jcater> wrong command
<jcater> gnue-forms --version
<jamest> hi johnf
<johnf> Hi
* jcater is doing a lot of things at once
<jcater> and am getting confused :)
<johnf> I don't know where gnue-forms lives  what folder/directory
<jamest> still having troubles w/ suse?
<johnf> Yes
<jamest> ok, i'm new to suse but I'll try and help
<jamest> and we can let jcater go back to sleeping or surfing for warez or whatever he's doing
<jamest> did you try that python import I asked about?
<johnf> Not sure what you making a reference too?
<jamest> you sent the mail to the ML right?
<jamest> i send a responce asking you to open python and try to manually import a dbdriver
<johnf> Yes - but I have not seen any replies as of yet
<jamest> wow, i sent that at 4:14pm cst 
<johnf> Ok I have python open
<jamest> import psycopg
<johnf> No modue named psycopg
<jamest> ok, that explains the traceback
<jamest> the line you had
<jamest> provider=postgresql
<jamest> is kinda random
<jamest> in the quickstart i have
<jamest> provider = pygresql
<jamest> i imagine the sample file has the postgresql as that was the proper way back when the sample files were first created
<johnf> Yes I know but I thought I'd try different providers
<jamest> so
<jamest> it does, but I know nothing about how it tries them :)
<jamest> if you give me a moment i'll reboot into suse and help you figure this out
<jamest> brb
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<jamest> whoops
<jamest> sorry about that
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<jcater> @ping
<bigbrother> pong
* jamest forgot he fragged his suse install 
<johnf> OK
<jamest> but it's back up now :)
<jamest> i'm suse'n
<johnf> I have just noticed that I check the site-packages that there no folder for PG (what is the correct name)
<jamest> i'm checking that now
<jamest> >>> import pg
<jamest> >>>
<johnf> There is a pgmodule.so and two *.py 
<johnf> import pg worked just fine
<jamest> ho about
<jamest> import pgdb
<johnf> import pgdb worked
<jamest> hmm
<jamest> could you try changing your provider to pygresql
<johnf> OK I'll try that again
<jamest> i'm sorry did i ask you to try pygresql or psycopg
* icltlfatppl is back (gone 40:09:22)
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<johnf> Where is the import pg and pgdb files ?
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<jamest> i have them in 
<jamest> /usr/lib/python2.3/site-packages/
<jamest> and in
<jamest> /usr/lib/python/site-packages/
<jamest> both contain the following files
<johnf> I can't see them /usr/lib/python2.3/site-packages
<johnf> Could this be something with permissions?
<johnf> Oh I see they are *.py FILES sorry they are there
<jamest> jamest@linux:/usr/lib/python2.3/site-packages> ls -ald /usr/lib/python*
<jamest> lrwxrwxrwx    1 root     root            9 2004-03-22 20:30 /usr/lib/python -> python2.3
<jamest> drwxr-xr-x   17 root     root        17704 2004-03-22 20:44 /usr/lib/python2.3
<johnf> I didn't realize they were file - I was looking for folders
<johnf> The fact that I can import the files - does it mean I can connect to the PG database?
<jamest> i would think so
<jamest> what is the command line you are using to start gnue-forms?
<johnf> I first CD to GNUe-Forms0.5.3
<jamest> sigh, i have to leave in about 10 minutes btw, i'll be gone about 1 hour
<jamest> !@#!@# customers :)
<johnf> then /usr/local/gnue/bin/gnue-forms states.gfd
<jcater> what did /usr/local/gnue/bin/gnue-forms --version return?
* jcater missed that earlier
<johnf> states.gfd does attempt to connect to the state table
<jamest> so you are in the samples/zipcode directory
<johnf> Version 0.5.3
<johnf> yes that's where I start from
<jamest> have we made any patches to datasources lately jcater?
<jamest> as I did the quickstart from the 20040322 snapshot
<johnf> If I had the wrong table name or wrong user name etc - would I a different error message (like I can't login)
<jamest> yes
<jamest> this is something else entirely
<jamest> it screams import error
<dneighbo_> can you do me a favor
<johnf> yes
<dneighbo_> psql -h dbhostname -U username nameofdatabase
<derek> johnf: any luck?
<johnf> I can't do that from the box I'm on because I did not install any postgres client stuff
<johnf> I could from the postgres server
<derek> hmm
<derek> can you try that on the postgres server
<derek> psql -h localhost -U user dbname
<johnf> sure just wait a minute
* derek suspects you really have a driver problem not a postgres problem
<jamest> johnf, he's trying to make sure you have inet listeners
<jamest> open
<derek> but the one error seemed like a dorked connection
<jcater> sigh
<jamest> the traceback he mailed shows no db driver loaded
<jcater> I don't understand how he's getting that version
<jcater> it should return
<derek> jamest: there were two different errors
<jcater> GNUe Forms
<jcater> Version 0.5.3.99
<jcater> GNUe Common Version 0.5.3.99
<jamest> if the connection was dead he'd get a connection error in red
<derek> johnf: the stupid question
<jcater> not 0.5.3
<derek> you grabbed the new files from url jcater gave you
<derek> what did you do with them?
<derek> did you setup.py install them?
<derek> like you did the originals?
<johnf> OK that worked just fine - I'm connected to the database
<jcater> jamest: the traceback I saw looked like a code error
<jcater> not a "no datadriver installed" error
<jamest> i thought that error happend when it ran out of DBs
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<jcater> I can't check my mail
<jcater> as for some reason
<derek> johnf: after downloading snapshot of common and snapshot of forms
<derek> did you reinstall?
<jcater> irc is the only internet-related thing I can do
<derek> jcater: good my trojan worked
<johnf> Yes but I did not remove any old fioles
<jamest> bingo!
<johnf> files
<derek> hmm
<jamest> 0.5.3 is broken on suse
<jcater> I thought the exception was something like "no module named Driver"
<jamest> i just installed and can confirm it
<jamest> you'll need to rm -rf /usr/local/gnue/lib at a minimum and install a snapshot
<johnf> OK
<jcater> yes
<jcater> I thought it was
<jcater> but the bigger question is why didn't the nightly snapshot install work?
<jamest> i really need to go as I have client expecting me to break their system at 7
<jcater> jamest: need a hammer?
<jamest> i imagine w/ the trigger changes today a new release is out of the question :(
* jcater has a 22oz estwing framing hammer next to my desk
<jcater> (good for debugging sessions)
<jamest> johnf, the 20040322 snapshot was what I used
<jamest> can someone update the wiki to point this out to people 
<jamest> argh, i really must run
<jamest> l8r
<jcater> derek: unfortunately, ssh to ash no workie either
<jcater> so I can't get svn updated
<jcater> to work :(
<jcater> jamest: yes
<jcater> err, well
<jcater> I will later
<derek> hmmm
<derek> time to dcc jcater an svn tree ;)
<derek> jamest: so current snapshots ok
<derek> 0.5.3 broked?
<jcater> I intended to pretty much finish the website tonight
<derek> if so i will update wiki now
<jcater> the pygresql driver is broken in 0.5.3
<jcater> which is what is prepackaged for SuSE
<johnf> OK I should use 20030322 - right
<derek> that should work
<johnf> Should all the modules match - forms,report etc?
<jcater> probably would be best
<jcater> given the issues we've hit :)
<johnf> OK I'll try it out - be back in a few
<johnf> BTW every time I use "./setup.py install --prefix" I have be root - is this right
<jcater> yes
<johnf> OK
<johnf> I get "no previously-included directories found mathcing 'etc/.svn' and 'doc/.svn'
<johnf> I all OK?
<jcater> hmm
<jcater> did it continue?
<jcater> look like it installed?
<jcater> I think those can be ignored
<johnf> ok
<johnf> I get "importerror: cannot import name Connection"
<johnf> The current provider = psycopg
<derek> gnue-forms --version
<derek> if it is 0.5.3.99
<derek> change your provider to provider = pygresql and try again
<johnf> It's still just 0.5.3 no 99
<johnf> ImportError: No module named Driver
<derek> i think there still exists an issue
<derek> the lastest snapshot should be returning 0.5.3.99
<johnf> Not using the latest but 20040322
<jcater> well, any of the snapshots
<jcater> what directory are you running ./setup.py from
<johnf> BTW the error message line is either 41 or 42 from pygresql
<johnf> From what ever module I just installed
<johnf> When installing common from GNUe-Common.0.5.3
<jcater> I wonder if that's your original tar -xvzf directory
<jcater> I'd expect it to create a directory called GNUe-Common-0.5.3.99...
<johnf> That's right - GNUe-Common-0.5.3.99+svn.20030322
<johnf> I can attempt to rm the all the gnue folders and start over
<johnf> I have to take my wife to dinner (I promised) I'll be back around 7:30 PST
<johnf> I leave the connection open so I might be able to read any info that might help me.
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<jamest> sigh
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<jamest> for the record
<jamest> 0.5.3 pygresql is completely broken for all distros
<jamest> anyone care to test my hotfix?
<kingpin2k> ugh
<kingpin2k> why can I not get the db setup again?
<jamest> ?
<kingpin2k> keep getting python errors
<jamest> what's wrong?
<jamest> from our stuff?
<kingpin2k> gnue-schema
<kingpin2k> I'm wondering if I've f'd something
<jamest> sigh
<jamest> brb
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<kingpin2k> wb
<jamest> thanks
<kingpin2k> Traceback (most recent call last):
<kingpin2k>   File "gnue-schema", line 24, in ?
<kingpin2k>     from gnue.common.schema.scripter.Scripter import Scripter
<kingpin2k>   File "C:\Python23\Lib\site-packages\gnue\common\schema\scripter\Scripter.py",
<kingpin2k> line 25, in ?
<kingpin2k>     from gnue.common.schema import GSParser
<kingpin2k>   File "C:\Python23\Lib\site-packages\gnue\common\schema\GSParser.py", line 33,
<kingpin2k> in ?
<kingpin2k>     from gnue.common.definitions import GParser
<kingpin2k>   File "C:\Python23\Lib\site-packages\gnue\common\definitions\GParser.py", line
<kingpin2k> 33, in ?
<kingpin2k>     from gnue.common.logic.GTrigger import GTrigger
<kingpin2k>   File "C:\Python23\Lib\site-packages\gnue\common\logic\GTrigger.py", line 40, i
<kingpin2k> n ?
<kingpin2k>     from gnue.common.logic.language import getLanguageAdapter, RuntimeError
<kingpin2k> ImportError: cannot import name getLanguageAdapter
<kingpin2k> any ideas?
<jcater> yes
<kingpin2k> whew
<jcater> you running from svn, right?
<kingpin2k> right
<jcater> I hit this today too.. nothing you've done
<jcater> ok, cd into gnue/
<kingpin2k> updated this mornign and then again tonight
<kingpin2k> ok
<jcater> then rm -rf gnue-common/src/logic/language/
<jcater> then you should be fine
<jcater> sorry about that
<jcater> one of the disadvantages of using svn instead of a prepackaged release :)
<jcater> (but there are advantages to using svn too)
<kingpin2k> run setup.py again?
<kingpin2k> or no?
<jcater> um
<jcater> hmm
<jcater> you may also need to rm -rf /usr/local/gnue/lib/gnue/gnue-common/logic/language
<jcater> (that path might be slightly off... it's from memory)
<kingpin2k> I'm on windoze  :-)
<jcater> ah
<jcater> then that path is definitely off
<kingpin2k> hehe
<jcater> then I think it's c:\python23\<something>\gnue\gnue-common\logic\language
<jcater> or, something liek that
<jcater> sorry, I don't have a windows machine handy to refer to
<kingpin2k> no prob...I'll give it a try
<kingpin2k> thanks for confirming that I'm not crazy tho
<jcater> lol
<jcater> I can't confirm that
<jcater> but in this instance, it wasn't anything you did
<kingpin2k> true
<kingpin2k> truth is, I'm the only sane one...everyone else is crazy
<jcater> well
<jcater> the evidence is pointing against you
<kingpin2k> that's because you're insane ;-)
<kingpin2k> you're insane, but your fix worked perfectly...thaks
<kingpin2k> thanks
<jcater> you've tried gnue out and actually came back
* jcater ducks
<kingpin2k> I've got an erp package to build
<kingpin2k> that makes me crazy by definittion
<kingpin2k> cd ..
<kingpin2k> oops
<kingpin2k> hehe
<dneighbo> not crazy just dumb
<kingpin2k> hmmm...I think I'd prefer crazy
<jamest> the hoxfix can be found on the current releases page
<jamest> sent mail to the list but not sure it'll go thru
<jamest> nite
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* chillywilly is crazy too
<chillywilly> not that this fact is anything new
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<holycow> anyone around?