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<kilo> good morning
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<VickyD> hi
<VickyD> friends...
<VickyD> i'm looking for help on gnue
<VickyD> nyonw
<VickyD> nyone
<ajmitch> hi
<VickyD> hi ajmitch
<VickyD> 01:5)
<VickyD> hello u guys???????
<VickyD> sleeping
<ajmitch> yes most people are sleepingg
<VickyD> y so.. tired after writing tons of code??
<ajmitch> because most people are in the US, where it's about 3am
<VickyD> oops...
<VickyD> i'm sorry ... disturbin people here....
<VickyD> n u pal?
<ajmitch> no, you're not disturbing anyone
<VickyD> 6 01:5)
<VickyD> r u working on gnue?
<VickyD> ?
<ajmitch> not much, I only do debian packages
<VickyD> ok
<ajmitch> did you need some help with something/
<ajmitch> ?
<VickyD> actually i'm looking for something upon which i can build total applications for our small enterprise...
<VickyD> and gnue appeared to me as a promisiing sol..based on gpl
<VickyD> ...
<ajmitch> alright
<ajmitch> then I'm not the best person to talk to :)
<VickyD> who can suggest me something...?
<ajmitch> I'd talk to someone like reinhard if he's around, or preferably derek
<ajmitch> gnue would probably be a good choice
<VickyD> i've been going thru gnue and i feel probably it can take me whr i' headed for
<VickyD> ajmitch r u working? 
<ajmitch> not really working, it's 9pm here
<VickyD> ok..i'm from india... its 1442 hr here
<ajmitch> ok
<VickyD> i've downloaded the gnue tools but that ERP packag eis not available..
<ajmitch> what erp package is that?
<VickyD> i don't know 
<ajmitch> there's a demo one which illustrates some concepts for building applications
<VickyD> thats the package which i myself need to build...
<VickyD> whrs the demo?
<ajmitch> as far as I know, that's available in subversion
<VickyD> ok let me see...
<ajmitch> under the gnue-contrib module - it's not a download on the website at the moment
<VickyD> i can't locate that subversion link..could u please help
<ajmitch> subversion is the source control system
<ajmitch> if you have it, svn co svn://www.gnuenterprise.org/var/svn/gnue-contrib
<VickyD> ok
<VickyD> 01:5)
<VickyD> its not thr,,
<ajmitch> yes it is :)
<ajmitch> it's not a web url
<VickyD> then?
<ajmitch> you need to use the subversion tools to check it out
<VickyD> ok...
<VickyD> http://www.gnuenterprise.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/gnue/trunk/
<ajmitch> I suggest if you want, you stay around until reinhard or sachas are here to talk to you
<VickyD> i'll ..
<ajmitch> http://www.gnuenterprise.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/gnue-contrib/babyerp/
<ajmitch> it's here
<ajmitch> you might be able to get the tarball there
<VickyD> tarball of which project?
<ajmitch> the babyerp demo stuff, if that's what you want to look at
<VickyD> ok..
<VickyD> in samples?
<VickyD> whrs this babyerp pal?
<ajmitch> no, the url I last pasted was for babyerp..
<VickyD> ok ..got it.. 
<VickyD> i skipped that msg...sorry
<VickyD> got it...
<VickyD> r u thr
<ajmitch> yes I am here
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<VickyD> reinhard
<VickyD> ?
<reinhard> hello
<reinhard> sorry i was away
<reinhard> just came back
<reinhard> still reading the logs
<VickyD> no probs ajimitch was here...
<VickyD> ajmitch
<VickyD> i have just came across gnue
<reinhard> ok finished with the logs
<VickyD> was looking for some total solution for our small enterprise...
<reinhard> we have no "turnkey" solution for an erp currently
<reinhard> we have a powerful set of tools that makes it easy to write database applications
<reinhard> so if you want to create an individual app you're right here
<VickyD> well - i don;t need a turnkey sol.. i just need to get started with the tools and develop our own apps.
<reinhard> ok
<reinhard> that's good then :)
<VickyD> i need u to guide me on how to effectively use these tools..
<reinhard> i'd say
<reinhard> best is to install the tools
<VickyD> ....yes..
<reinhard> try the basic samples to check if your install is working
<VickyD> i got the tools...
<VickyD> ok...
<reinhard> what db do you use?
<VickyD> i don't have any specific db choice.. could u suggest  pls
<reinhard> most of us use postgresql
<reinhard> what distro are you on?
<VickyD> right ...i don't have any exp with it .. but i'll start with pgsql too
<VickyD> Redhat7.1
<reinhard> ok
<reinhard> of course if you have any experience with another db you should prefer that one
<VickyD> i had exp on MS sql server..
<reinhard> errr
<reinhard> except ms sql server ;-)
<VickyD> and lil on mysql...
<VickyD> but i can learn PGsql
<reinhard> ok
<reinhard> i suggest you first install pgsql and get it running
<VickyD> that wont be tough with help from peple like u here...
<VickyD> i have it up and running...
<reinhard> oh cool
<VickyD> how to proceed next..
<reinhard> the easiest sample is the zipcode sample from forms
<reinhard> in gnue-forms/samples
<VickyD> whrs that...??
<VickyD> ok..
<reinhard> subdir zipcode
<reinhard> to set up a database for that sample, do
<VickyD> yes
<reinhard> $ createuser gnue
<VickyD> ok..
<reinhard> err stop
<reinhard> do
<VickyD> ??????
<reinhard> createuser --createdb --adduser gnue
<reinhard> createdb gnue
<VickyD> fine...
<reinhard> psql gnue < pg_zip_code.sql
<reinhard> that's all so far
<VickyD> ok..got it..
<reinhard> next would be to check
<VickyD> chk what
<VickyD> ?
<reinhard> if you can do "psql -U gnue -h localhost gnue"
<VickyD> oks..
<reinhard> sorry i'm a bit slow :)
<VickyD> heyy its perfect..
<VickyD> pls cont.
<reinhard> select * from state;
<reinhard> should give you a list of the US states
<VickyD> fine...that means my db is in place..
<reinhard> excellent
<reinhard> ok
<reinhard> did you install the tools
<reinhard> or did you use setup-cvs.py
<reinhard> ?
<VickyD> ok sir...
<VickyD> i haven't installed anytools yet...
<reinhard> how did you download?
<reinhard> did you use released tarballs
<VickyD> i downloaded the tars
<reinhard> or did you check out svn?
<VickyD> yes
<reinhard> ok
<VickyD> no... related tars..
<reinhard> then in gnue-common, do ./setup.py install
<reinhard> then in gnue-forms, do the same
<reinhard> you might have to be root to be able to do it properly
<VickyD> ok..
<VickyD> i got all tars fro forms, designer, report, common, appsserver
<VickyD> will i need apache ??
<reinhard> you can install all of them with the same command
<reinhard> no you won't need apache
<VickyD> ok..
<reinhard> the only thing that matters is that you install gnue-common first
<VickyD> for dependencies?
<VickyD> right
<VickyD> ..
<VickyD> now ????
<reinhard> did all installs run through?
<VickyD> i'm not running the installs right now..i'm just making notes...
<reinhard> ah oh sorry
<reinhard> as soon as you have installed
<reinhard> you would be able to do in the zipcode dir
<reinhard> gnue-forms states.gfd
<reinhard> and
<reinhard> gnue-forms zipcode.gfd
<reinhard> this would be a simple 2-tier example
<VickyD> whatsthat...command?
<reinhard> (forms directly against database)
<VickyD> ok....
<reinhard> yes gnue-forms is the command
<reinhard> if that works (and it should work)
<reinhard> you can look at the appserver samples
<VickyD> it will bring up the forms on my pc?
<VickyD> ok...
<reinhard> yes
<reinhard> the appserver samples directory contains a (i hope) quite good README file
<VickyD> but i need it to run in clien-server on diff m/cs
<reinhard> m/cs == ?
<VickyD> machines... sorry 01:5)
<reinhard> ah
<reinhard> ok
<VickyD> one server and multiple clients accessing diff forms at same time...
<reinhard> yep
<reinhard> you can of course also do that with gnue-forms
<VickyD> how?
<reinhard> (meaning you install forms on all clients)
<reinhard> but you might prefer to use appserver of course
<VickyD> can i access these thru web based clients
<reinhard> i'm not sure about our web frontends
<reinhard> err
<reinhard> i'm not sure about the status of our web frontends
<VickyD> like explorer or navigator..
<reinhard> there *are* some frontends for php or simple html
<reinhard> but i'm not sure how functional they are at the moment
<reinhard> because i don't use them :(
<VickyD> yes...
<VickyD> can i develop those using these tools..?
<reinhard> i would say yes
<reinhard> and my brain is not completely wack
<reinhard> then the webfrontend for appserver should work
<VickyD> actually i want that any user should be able to access his application from any pc ...using proper authentication
<reinhard> but as i said i've never even looked at it
<VickyD> in this case how can i make windows clients access these forms????
<reinhard> there are several ways
<VickyD> like?
<reinhard> the webfrontend we talked before
<reinhard> or of course
<VickyD> right..
<reinhard> there is also a windows version of forms
<VickyD> how do i develop my own forms????
<reinhard> we have a self-extracting exe that installs perfectly under all windows versions we ever tried
<reinhard> on our download page
<VickyD> ok..
<reinhard> you develop your forms with gnue-designer
<VickyD> but  now i'm to develop my own forms ...how does gnu designer works??
<reinhard> people have reported to have designed a form in 2 minutes
<VickyD> do i need to run X for it?
<reinhard> once you have a database defined, you start the wizard
<reinhard> and select the fields you want
<reinhard> X or windows
<VickyD> ok..
<VickyD> ok.
<VickyD> and how do i establish linkage between database nd forms fields?
<reinhard> this is close to trivial
<reinhard> in the form you define a "block" which basically stands for a database table
<VickyD> ok..
<reinhard> and for every field in this block you define which field name it links to
<VickyD> right
<VickyD> pls let me discuss a case..
<VickyD> suppose my db is PGsql on my RH linux box and my common and appserver tarballs installed on it tooo
<VickyD> ...i designed some form using designer..
<VickyD> and a report too..
<reinhard> ok
<VickyD> now i want to access this form from my window PC in my network... post data thru it and retrieve  that data in my designed rport...
<reinhard> ok
<VickyD> how do i do this last part...??
<reinhard> then you would install the windows version of forms and reports on the pc
<VickyD> and copy my form here?
<reinhard> and access the form and report definition via network (samba or something like that)
<reinhard> AFAIK that's how most (all) people do it currently
<reinhard> although of course i can't fully speak for others :)
<VickyD> ok..........u mean form has to be on the same machine on which db is??
<VickyD> right?
<reinhard> no not at all
<VickyD> then...how
<reinhard> of course you could also copy the form definition to every pc
<reinhard> but it's easier to maintain if you don't
<VickyD> then how will it know whr my db is ?
<reinhard> there is a file that's named "connections.conf"
<reinhard> this is an example entry
<VickyD> ok..
<reinhard> [gnue]
<reinhard> provider = psycopg
<reinhard> dbname = gnue
<reinhard> host = london
<reinhard> comment = GNUe Test Database
<reinhard> "london" is the hostname where my db lives
<VickyD> right... it goes with every form?
<reinhard> no
<reinhard> in forms you have
<VickyD> of course 01:5)
<reinhard>  <datasource name="dsstate" cache="15" connection="gnue" order_by="state"
<reinhard>               prequery="" table="state"/>
<VickyD> i can use ip  address instead of london
<VickyD> ?
<reinhard> forget the rest of it, but look at connection="gnue"
<reinhard> that references the [gnue] section in connections.conf
<reinhard> of course you can use ip
<VickyD> ok.. now i'll get own to some seriou development...01:5)
<reinhard> excellent :)
<reinhard> sorry i have to leave for customer
<reinhard> will be back later
<VickyD> that was a gr8 intro fro a beginer like me
<VickyD> thnx a lot pal
<rm-away> happy that i was able to help
<VickyD> bye too...
<VickyD> 01:5)
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<Konijn> 'lo all
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<reinhard> sigh
<reinhard> there are mails i just *have* to answer
<reinhard> "we are seeking sponsors and partners for a project to force the use of open source software in education. for further information, please see the attached .doc file"
<reinhard> (roughly translated)
<lekma> "use of open source software" and later in the sentence "see the attached .doc file"
<reinhard> yeah
* lekma wonders...
<reinhard> i answered them it's a nice joke sending a word file as attachment ;-)
<lekma> :-)
<jcater> wow
<jcater> that is either a funny joke
<jcater> or really poor taste :)
<reinhard> i think i can be sure it was not meant as a joke
<reinhard> there are lots of people talking about "open source" and not even knowing what it's all about
<reinhard> that seems to be a general problem of the "open source" talks though ...
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<SachaS> hi everyone
<SachaS> havent played with appserver for about 3 weeks
<SachaS> i feel like ... a total oldie
<SachaS> :)
<jcater> well, if you submit a patch by the end of the day
<jcater> I'm sure we can all forgive you
<jcater> :)
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<SachaS> latest appserver feature broke my app. which means appserver is heading forward :)
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<SachaS> means i have to start as all beginners, in the appserver sample directory
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<johannesV_> hi SachaS
<johannesV_> what is broken since the last update ?
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<reinhard> what?
<reinhard> appserver is broken?
<reinhard> time for me to get out of here
<reinhard> j/k
<reinhard> bbl
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<_florin_> hello
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<_florin_> (offtopic) does anybody know what the 2nd column of 'ls -l' means?
<_florin_> (offtopic) never mind... got it.
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<SachaS> appserver is not broken, there are just some elements missing in my .gsd file ...
<SachaS> nothing to worry.
<SachaS> night
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<ajmitch> morning all
<jamest> evening you krazy kiwi
<jamest> calling it morning......the man's insane
<ajmitch> well it is morning
<ajmitch> how could you say otherwise?
<jamest> look out the window, it's evening
<jamest> don't tell me you guys don't honor US time!
<ajmitch> nah, the sun is still shining
* jamest best report NZ to lord bush
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<jamest> evening jcater
<jcater> word
<jamest> sigh
<ajmitch> jcater!
<chillywilly> sentence
<jamest> word made me it's bitch today
<jamest> see, the reason not to use OpenOffice is it's not 100% perfect at reading word files
<jamest> of course neither is word itself
<jamest> but it's a lot better at it!
<chillywilly> just get everybody to use OpenOffice ;)
<jamest> actually i was quite shocked
<jamest> the sr. unix admin for main campus network informed me KSU has a site license for StarOffice
<jamest> but not one for MS Office
<jcater> openoffice is great for general use
<jcater> but it's no Word
* jcater hides
<jamest> but for real publishing you gotz to use da Gimp!
<chillywilly> damn skippy ;)
<jcater> as far as "publishing" features, kword is a better choice than word, openoffice, etc
<jcater> it is largely frame based
<jcater> of course, I didn't see the issue w/latex =)
<jamest> does it still laugh maniacally while it mad goat rapes its previously saved file and then replaces it's contents with the output of /dev/random?
* jcater never had that problem
<jcater> but I haven't used it in a while
<jcater> we use openoffice at work
<jamest> that was one feature of kword that turned me away from it
<jcater> one fscking thing I hate about OpenOffice
<jamest> openoffice is great for general use 
<jcater> why the fsck does it create OpenOffice1.x.x folders and menu options?
<jamest> but it's too generic
<jcater> I have OpenOffice, OpenOffice 1.0, OpenOffice 1.1.0, and OpenOffice 1.1.1 menu entries in KDE
<jamest> star office did the same
<jcater> for heaven's sake, OpenOffice/ will suffix
<jamest> moronic thing
<chillywilly> how about uninstalling one of them?
<jcater> suffice, even
<chillywilly> goof
<jcater> chillywilly: um, they are
<jcater> 4 of them aren't functional
<jamest> chillywilly: doesn't help
<chillywilly> well I don't have this problem ;)
<jamest> those get moved into the user profiles
<jamest> or seem to
<jcater> yeah
<jamest> i manually have to purge them 
<jcater> that's what I see
<chillywilly> but I don't have KDE 
<jamest> chillywilly: i'm sorry
<jcater> I'm sorry
<jcater> =)
<chillywilly> why?
<jamest>  [06:26:20 pm] <chillywilly>but I don't have KDE 
<chillywilly> I am satrting to like Gnome's simpler and more MacOS X -like design
<jamest> i could burn you a CD with the latest debs on it if you like
<chillywilly> no thanks
<jamest> thats more funny than you know
<chillywilly> I have Gnoem 2.6
<chillywilly> Gnome*
<jamest> as years ago people bitched about KDE not allowing the customization of gnome
<chillywilly> yes they have reversed roles
<jamest> now KDE is bad because it offers more options
<jcater> well, I won't switch
<jamest> what blows my mind about KDE is when I go to the GTA offices
<jcater> I have too much time invested in training w/KDE
<jamest> (grad students)
<jcater> well, not training, per se
<jcater> but user experience
<jamest> without any real training several of them have radically altered their KDE experience
<jamest> some use it like MACs w/ a single menu at the top
<chillywilly> we have no linux desktop desployments yet...in fact I am the only one that uses it as a desktop
<jcater> I like the site-wide control I have with KDE
<jcater> I didn't have that with gnome's registry-like setup
<jcater> or as easily, at least
<jamest> others have windows style menus but a more osx like task bar
<chillywilly> I like the gdesklets
<jamest> the karamba inspired desktop things?
<jcater> my people are really liking kontact now
<chillywilly> I tried KDE's version of this but it wasn't working
<jcater> I moved them from kmail to kontact a few weeks ago
<jamest> i like kontact alot
<jcater> they have the TODOs, Contact lists, calendaring, etc, all going
<jamest> a lot
<jcater> w/o training =)
<ajmitch> I still use mutt for my mail
<ajmitch> kontact never even starts here
<jcater> :(
<jamest> as do I, and linked to my Clie
<ajmitch> it just sits locked at 99% cpu usage
<chillywilly> jamest: how can you say it is karamba inspired? they were both stolen from OS X
<chillywilly> dinner time
<chillywilly> bye
<jamest> i swore the developer said he saw karamba and wanted it in gnome
<jamest> maybe i'm wrong
<jamest> ajmitch: :(
<jcater> sounds like a library version mismatch
<jcater> which sadly, is way to easy to do in debian
<jcater> :(
<jamest> beyond easy
<ajmitch> I'm just using debian packages at the moment
<ajmitch> and it's never worked yet for me :)
<jamest> ajmitch: exactly
<jamest> you manually have to verify the damn thing replaced all the old libs
<jcater> no
<jcater> jamest: that's improper english
<jamest> sids KDE up until at least the 3.2.1 release was flaky wrt dependencies
<jcater> you have to manually fix all the old libs it neglected to upgrade
<jcater> no "verify" to it
<jamest> :)
<ajmitch> wonderful
<jamest> ajmitch: IIRC do a 
<ajmitch> well I'm using the latest sid packages of pretty much everything :)
<jamest> dpkg --list | grep -i kde
<jamest> and look for 3.0.x crap
<jamest> or 3.1.x crap
<ajmitch> dist-upgrade *ought* to get everything 
<jamest> nope
<jamest> i think the 3.2.1 and 3.2.2 releases are better
<jamest> but the 3.1.x and 3.2.0 didn't work
<jamest> i can promise you that
<ajmitch> I'm using 3.2.2 packages
<jamest> as my system was flaky as hell until I caught that
<jamest> i'd still look
<ajmitch> looking
<jamest> as the old libs make kde apps unstable
<jcater> yeah
<ajmitch> only packages that are 3.1.x are kde-* stuff which are metapackages only
<jcater> unfortunately, it's not that kde won't work
<jcater> it will work fine
<jcater> then start to degrade fast
<jcater> wrt resource usage, etc
<jamest> and I'd get random app failures
<chillywilly> is this #kde-whores? ;)
<ajmitch> strace is showing it thrashing away, so I'll take a look at what it's doing
<jamest> chillywilly: yes
<jcater>      |     |   |
<jcater>      /          \
<jcater>     /     `,     \
<jcater>    |       )      )
<jcater>    |      _/_   _ /
<jcater>     \      |      |
<jcater>      |     |      ,
<jcater> bite my on my shiny butt
<jcater> s/my/me/
<jamest> jcater: have you lost weight?
* jamest runs
<ajmitch> wonderful... it seems to be trying to index my 2.5GB mail folder
<jcater> jamest: you must not be using courier extra wide?
* chillywilly thought it was "bite my shiny metal ass" :)
* chillywilly is now blind
<jamest> jcater isn't metal
<jcater> so, you wanna kill all humans?
<ajmitch> it could at least give some feedback...
<chillywilly> yes
<chillywilly> all humans in #gnuenterprise whos nicks start with 'j'
<chillywilly> they are evil
<chillywilly> and must be eliminated
<chillywilly> anyway, I am a desktop harlott...I swap partners all the time...I might give KDE another try when I get bored w/ Gnome...but don't feel like doing that right now :P
<chillywilly> no time to install it right now
<jcater> I make my living on KDE these days
<jcater> so, it would take a helluva lot to get me to switch
<jcater> and they are too close imho for that to happen
<ajmitch> chillywilly: shameless hussy
<chillywilly> :P
<chillywilly> even if I use KDE there's still some gtk2/gnome apps that I'd have to use....whereas the only kde app I have to use (because I haven't exported contacts) is kaddressbook...but I onyl fire it up when I need an address
<ajmitch> I like konqueror
<ajmitch> especially when firefox breaks on some sites
<ajmitch> plus firefox seems to have appalling printing with cups
<ajmitch> anyway I have to go, bbl ;)
<chillywilly> been using epiphany ;P
<jcater> I have truly a love-hate relationship with cups
* jcater won't get into that rant though
<jcater> I think jamest is trying to work 
<jcater> =)
<jamest> yes, don't get me started w/ cups
<jamest> Can't Usually Print Stuff
<jamest> cups
<jcater> :(
<jcater> I have to run my cups daemon in a script that monitors for crashes
<jcater> so it can restart cups
<jamest> ooooo
<jcater> does a ps|grep every 2 minutes or so
<jamest> can you send me a copy?
<jcater> ya
<jamest> as mine cups as of the last month has started doing that on sid
<jamest> now that debian stable is rapidly approaching 3 years out of date I'm forced to run more and more users on sid
<jcater> um
<jcater> sadly, I moved my ltsp servers to sid
<jcater> as my woody+backports was becoming unmanageable
<jamest> my ltsp server is sid too
<jcater> maybe we should run gentoo =)
<jamest> i'm thinking about it
<jamest> seriously thinking about it
<jcater> after all, what's a 3-day compile amongst friends
<jamest> gentoo stage 3 makes that go away
<jcater> but then what's the benefit?
<jamest> and they are now offering binaries
<jcater> the only advantage to gentoo I see
<jcater> is locally optimized packages
<jcater> otherwise, why bother?
<jamest> is that the fscking packages are not 3 years out of date
<chillywilly> :(
<jamest> i love debian
<jamest> now that I've got this multiboot box I find I spend all my time running SID
<jcater> well, should I leave debian, it's back to freebsd I think
<jamest> as it's the most up to date distro out there by far
<jamest> but their stable release cycle is driving me fucking insane
<jcater> I wish testing was really more a cross betweeen stable and unstable
<jamest> good job on the 13 CD distro guys
<jcater> in reality, it's not :(
<jamest> i'd settle for 1 CD of up to date stuff though
<chillywilly> stop yer whining and suck it up ppl ;)
<chillywilly> you really are a sad depressing bunch
<jamest> chillywilly: you don't have users bitching at you constaintly do you ? :)
<chillywilly> yea, I do :)
<jamest> really?
<chillywilly> they call all the time
<jamest> then why aren't you like us?
<jamest> you on happy pills?
<chillywilly> "how do I use this website thingy to order my metal"
<jcater> <chillywilly> we have no linux desktop desployments yet...in fact I am the only one that uses it as a desktop
<jamest> lol
<chillywilly> yet
<jamest> he did say that
<chillywilly> there's windows to support :(
<jamest> sad thing w/ linux users is their bugs get fixed
<jamest> and features added they request
<chillywilly> and this shitty VPN program that the parent company makes them use
<jamest> but stable just sits there
<jamest> and so you're in a bad spot as windows (buggy too I admit) is the standard
<chillywilly> no, I'm not ;)
<chillywilly> long term is 100% linux
<jamest> so if they have to fight w/ bugs they might as well use windows if they can't have up to date stuff
<chillywilly> jsut need to get all the access apps converted to mod_python goodness and postgres
<jcater> what?!?
<jcater> gah
<jamest> i mean woody shipped w/ kde 2.2.2 iirc
<chillywilly> maybe some gnue forms if they need a fatter client
<chillywilly> ;)
<jamest> and 3.2.x is lightyears ahead of that and users love it
<jamest> in fact this week i'm sending out email to my 12 remaining windows users
<jamest> 2 choices: 
<jamest> a) upgrade to linux/kde 3.2.2
<jamest> b) windows XP
<jamest> which is a huge deal considering that mine was the first linux box in the dept back in 97
<jamest> but most of them get on KDE and are quite happy
<jamest> in fact kio slaves are pure joy to most users once I show it to them
<chillywilly> well everyone uses mozilla mail, web browser, chatzilla and openoffice
<jamest> i've got quite a few using mozilla
<chillywilly> the transition to a gnu/linux desktop should be less painful then ;)
<jamest> chillywilly: seriously, if you want users to switch
<jamest> load up konqueror in file mgr mode
<chillywilly> they can't switch right now cause they are using the legacy access systems
<jamest> and show them how they can treat ftp, webdav, ssh file sources all as local filesystems
<jamest> that's a killer app for my users
<chillywilly> both file managers on either desktop do this
<jamest> they might, i dunno, wan't pushing kde only
<jamest> more the functionality
<jamest> windows doesn't do this as well
<jamest> as konq can take dozens of args
<jamest> ipp, smb, etc, etc
<chillywilly> nautilus works more like an older Mac file browser now with the new window per folder thing...I dunno if I like it though but it is simple
<chillywilly> you can turn it off
<jcater> this isn't just file browser
<chillywilly> they call it "spatial" view
<jcater> this is any referencable file field in a KDE app
* jcater hasn't tried gnome's version
<chillywilly> I know how kinq ans io slaves works ;)
<chillywilly> konq
<chillywilly> bleh
<chillywilly> I was just commenting on how they changed nautilus in 2.6
<chillywilly> some people like it most hate it
<chillywilly> I really think it is more intuitive...I've seen people try to copy files to disk/floppy by dragging them which only works with the spatial metaphor...people are just used to the browser mode
<chillywilly> when they tried on windows it just make a link...well I don't think I am describing it properly but what they tried would've worked if they kept the metaphor consistent
<jamest> i teach users to right click drag
<jamest> as then it pops up a menu on windows asking what to do
<jamest> otherwise they get confused about when it's a move vs a copy
<chillywilly> heh, I did that on accident with nautilus browsing an smb share and didn't notice until the person complained that their file was missing
<chillywilly> with the older 2.4 nautilus
<chillywilly> hmm, seems nautilus required a middle-click drag for that
<jamest> "hey penguin boy, where'd my porn go?"
<chillywilly> :P
<jamest> it's more time effective chilly to just do
<chillywilly> mv ;)
<chillywilly> cp ;)
<jamest> find /home -name "*.mpeg" -size +2000k -exec cp {} /home/chillywilly/possibleXXXaction \;
<jamest> oooo
<jamest> of course you'd have to exclude your dir
<chillywilly> w00t
<jamest> then if you were a konq user i think it'll even play the movies in thumbnails when browsing the dir
<jamest> so you can weed out the usless stuff quickly
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<VickyD> hi!!!
<VickyD> hi ajmitch
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