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<kilo> hi johannesV
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<johannesV> hi kilo
<johannesV> ups, too late ..
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<SachaS> gone for weekend bye
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<dsmith> Greetings, gnue'ers
<dsmith> ANyone know how to convert a realaudio file to something reasonable?
<jamest> um
<jamest> no but wonder if something like mplayer could do it
<chillywi1ly> it's proprietary so I am thinking that is a big NEGATORY
<jamest> huh
<dsmith> I'm looking into mplayer.
<chillywi1ly> mplayer can play it with the right plugin
<jamest> i thought helix player did real and was gpl
<dsmith> jamest: What's helix player?
<dsmith> (It's not found with apt-cache search helix)
<chillywi1ly> GOOGLE
<chillywi1ly> :)
<chillywi1ly> https://player.helixcommunity.org/
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<derek_> grrr
<derek_> did freaking openprojects lose my nick
<derek_> er freenode
<jamest> i blame derek
<chillywi1ly> me too
<derek> okay so bitchx just lies as a client... freenode didnt eat my name
<chillywi1ly> use irssi
<chillywi1ly> :)
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<jcater> http://www.gnuenterprise.org/~jcater/screenshots/forms-kde-icons.png
<jcater> forms supports icon sets now
<jcater> fwiw
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<derek> jcater?
<derek> did it not support icon sets?
<derek> i.e. at one you could define any images you wanted for the toolbar
<jcater> it supported icon overrides
<jamest> not like he did it
<jcater> now it has actual iconsets
<jamest> 1 setting changes them all
<derek> cool
<jcater> i.e., set iconset=kde3 in your gnue.conf file
<jcater> and you have kde3 icons
<derek> jamest: i think actually i may have done the toolbar and icon stuff originally (probably why needs fixing now) :)
<jcater> actually, I think your code was ripped out around 0.4 or so
<derek> prolly
<derek> so how does it know what kde3 is?
<derek> i.e. where do you define your icon sets?
<jcater> forms/images/default --> default icon set
<jcater> forms/images/kde3
<derek> cool
<jcater> forms/images/gnome
<jcater> etc
<derek> so you could make your own "theme"
<derek> then set iconset=yourtheme
<jcater> ya
<derek> sweet
* jcater is being vain today
<jcater> and working on non-important stuff
<derek> oooo ooo oooo
<derek> i think i have a list of vain not important stuff that needs fixing :)
<jcater> also, forms highlights the currently focused field in a creamy yellow
<derek> one important one that was on that email list
<derek> is highlighting all text on focus
<derek> creamy yellow fun
<jcater> I want to do what chafar was describing
<jcater> i.e., unless you have an autoEdit="Y" on a block
<jcater> then after querying, the block is in "nav" mode
<derek> that is fine by me
<jcater> and you have to click edit button, or F? key
<derek> i.e. i agree with it
<jcater> to enter edit mode
<derek> but since i dont have users destroying data (yet)
<derek> the highlight field while cosmetic is getting complaints from my testers
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<someon> How long ago was the conversation that's in the logs?
* someon lurks logs often
<jcater> which conversation?
<someon> about  Nav mode vs. Edit mode
<jamest> it was on the mailing list IIRC
<someon> It would be interesting to have the ability to say XYZ user MAY enter Edit mode for this form, but ABC user may not
<someon> It was touched on in the logs...
* someon doesn't read the maillist often
<someon> <jcater> I want to do what chafar was describing
<someon> <jcater> i.e., unless you have an autoEdit="Y" on a block
<someon> <jcater> then after querying, the block is in "nav" mode
<jcater> someon: yes
<jcater> but that's a separate problem set
* someon is really interested in permissions issues
<jcater> though adding this mode support would make it easier to implement that security level
<someon> I wuold really like to help work on that, as that is one of the limiting factors for trying to implement at my company, however I don't code :(
<johannesV_> btw. i've worked on gtk2-uidriver and it seems as if i can commit a working gkt2-driver until monday
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<Alan_> hello folks, newbie with a couple of questions here
<Alan_> is there some overall rough schedule of works for GNUE?
<jamest> not really
<jamest> it's all based upon developers free time
<Alan_> I am a consultant programmer (Lotus Domino stuff mostly) and my client is using BPCS at the moment.
<Alan_> they know that in their 5 year plan they will need to spend loads on replacing hardware or BPCS
<Alan_> would it be reasonable to spend the dosh on getting programmer time for GNUE?
<jamest> what is BPCS?
<Alan_> BPCS is an ERP system which runs on the iSeries (AS/400)
<Alan_> it is a nasty greenscreen thing
<Alan_> it is inefficient expensive and buggy
<Alan_> support is dire.
<Alan_> usually pronounced Bee picks
<Alan_> http://www.ssaglobal.com/
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<Alan_> about the only page I can find mentioning GNUE and BPCS in the same breath is this one
<Alan_> http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/gnue/2004-01/msg00011.html
<jamest> hey, i was just thinking about fred frog(?)
<jcater> lol
<jcater> good ol fredfrog
<jamest> kinda wild that post was a responce to one of his
<jamest> gnue is tools at the moment
<jamest> been saying that for years :(
<jamest> i would say at this time you could implement a good system using those tools
<jamest> but we've had several false starts
<jamest> kilo is now trying to get something moving and I really hope it works out
<jamest> so I'd say the tools today can implement a fair bit of the a erp
<jamest> in five years it'd only be better
<jamest> but we don't have anything wrapped up and ready to roll or customize at this time
<Alan_> I like the look of the architecture so far.
<wendall911> Anybody know where the debian menu is set for the Gnome Main Menu applet? I can't find anything and It appears to be hardcoded in...I'd like to remove the thing.
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<jamest> Alan_: fwiw, the data input form program (gnue forms) was inspired by Oracle Forms
<jamest> so if you used that then I think you'd feel comfortable w/ the gnue forms
<Alan_> I do a lot of Domino based business applications so forms based business tools are my kinda thing.
<jamest> wendall911: i don't, sorry
<wendall911> jamest: that's cool...I'm dumping all the gconf settings to a file and starting there
<wendall911> jamest: I think it's compiled into the applet
<jamest> Alan_: but you're asking if it's worth putting time into working on GNUe
<jamest> I'm a little bit bias but I'd say yes, if you understand that those years would be spent building the system you need
<jamest> its also worth saying that most of us do this for free when time allows
<jamest> reinhard is the current exception
<jamest> derek too I guess
<Alan_> yes, I have a bit of time and would like to have a play with the system
<jamest> so things get done as the need arises
<jamest> and some of us go missing for months (like me :)
<jcater> shame on you, jamest
<Alan_> I am just trying to get a feel as to whether I could propose a more concerted (and funded) effort.
* jamest thwaps jcater
<Alan_> if just a couple of companies collaborated to fund building of GNUe rather than each spend megabucks on existing systems then a heap of time could be contributed.
<jamest> i'm ok with people be paid to work on gnue
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<jamest> but we do require that all contributors of code assign copyright to the FSF
<jamest> nothing makes it into svn without that
<Alan_> that would be a given.
* chillywi1ly thwaps everyone
<chillywi1ly> *thwap* *thwap* *thwap*
<jamest> chillywi1ly: hey gnome lover, wendall911 needs gnome help from someone that actually runs that stuff
<wendall911> heh
<wendall911> jamest: I thought chillywi1ly was a KDE guy
<chillywi1ly> Gnome 0wnz y0u 4ll
<holycow> alan
<holycow> i have the same intentions as you
<holycow> but no time
<Alan_> hi holycow
<chillywi1ly> I've been running Gnome for a while now
<jamest> wendall911: no, he tried kde for a while, but couldn't handle it being so close to perfection, so ran back to gnome
<jamest> more issues to work out means more fun i guess
<chillywi1ly> not
<holycow> hi Alan_
<holycow> i run gnome too
<wendall911> only if you try to update on Deb
<wendall911> Updating 2.4 to 2.6 is broken badly
<chillywi1ly> mainly the desklets like thing in KDE did not work....so I was playing with them on Gnome instead and decided to stay
<jamest> Alan_: i'd suggest you play w/ the tools some
<jamest> and get a feel for where were at
<jamest> usually someone is in here to help, i should be most the weekend myself (for once)
<jcater> if you have trouble, please ask
<jcater> because docs aren't our strong point
<holycow> i just like the gnome minimalist approach, having preferences available on every right click on everything is annoying
<jcater> we acknowledge that
<chillywi1ly> that should be in the topic
<chillywi1ly> "docs aren't our strong point"
<jamest> wendall911: i do the 2.4 -> 2.6 upgrade on every debian box I run, when did it start breaking?
<Alan_> I will, I think I will start playing tonight.
<jcater> right-click preferences?
<holycow> i think the breaking was fixed last week with the big library update
<chillywi1ly> it worked for me
<jcater> what's that?
<holycow> before last week it failed on every machine for me
* jcater always goes to Settings | Configure <App>...
<chillywi1ly> they even fixed the silly task switcher window sticking bug
<chillywi1ly> yay
<chillywi1ly> that was damn annoying
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<jamest> chillywi1ly: task switcher window sticking bug?
<wendall911> jamest: really?
<jamest> i'm seeing that in KDE
<chillywi1ly> I think it is related to X
* jamest runs off to break, er, upgrade his box
<chillywi1ly> when I foudnt he bug it was reassigned a bunch of time then finally stayed in the xlibs
<wendall911> jamest: I was going from testing to unstable and It always fails with dependency problems...
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<jamest> testing is evil
<wendall911> jamest: I just need to install unstable in the future and I'll avoid the issue altogether I'm sure
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<danielb> bah
* danielb kicks chillywi1ly 
<danielb> damn RR
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<kilo_> jcater: yellow thinggy is excellent, thx
<jamest> i like the kde3 icons myself
<danielb> you should use Gnome2 icons
<danielb> bitches
<jamest> we'd offer it
<jamest> but we need a gnome lover to bundle them up
<jamest> and make sure they match the right gnome icons
* kilo_ is a gnome lover, but gnome is not a kilo lover...
<nickr> gnome keeps doing things
<nickr> horrible things
<jcater> danielb: there's actually a gnome iconset created
<jcater> it just doesn't have icons in it
<jcater> as , like jamest said, it'll take someone who uses it to pick out the right icons for us
<kilo_> jcater: ok, i will take a look at it later today
<jcater> cool
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<kilo_> jcater: GNOME icon set is in svn
<jcater> excellent
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<kilo_> well i see the dark future for btami, as there is a winxp directory in images...
<jcater> :)
<jcater> hint, hint...
<jcater> though we can't just grab stock windows icons like we can w/KDE or GNOME
<jcater> they have to be free
<jcater> so that might be more difficult
<jcater> s/might/will/
<kilo_> lalala, i dont have xp installed, only w2k, lalala
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<kilo_> afaik standard windows icons are free to use
<kilo_> or am i wrong?
<jcater> free to use, but not likely free to copy
<kilo_> i see
<jamest> no way to just use the ones pre-installed on winders?
<jcater> sure
<jcater> and anyone who wants them is free to recode our stuff to do so =)
<jcater> just ain't gonna be me
<jamest> :)
<kilo_> btami is on holiday...
<holycow> what, are you guys looking for custom icons?
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<kilo_> what if i hand-draw icons that look exactly like windows standard icons, with only 1 pixel diff?
<jamest> surely someone has made a set already
<holycow> what are you trying to solve tho... i left channel so can't scroll enough back?
<jamest> forms now has icon sets
<holycow> *nod* and? 
<jamest> so you can tell it to display kde3 icons, or gnome
<jamest> we distribute those w/ gnue
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<holycow> so on windows your looking for an equivalent or?
<jamest> yes
<jamest> i'd think some windows db app already has them done and gpl'd
<holycow> aha, so your going to ship the images for win instead of coding up links to winlibary ones? k.
<holycow> and you have ruled out shipping say kde type icons along because?
<holycow> they do tend to look a lot nicer than windows ones :)
<jamest> dunno
<jamest> it'll ship w/ default
<jamest> people were just pointing out that someone could put together a windows set if they wanted
<holycow> :) aha! okay thats what i'm not grokking hehe 
<holycow> i thought you needed a win set but couldn't find an adequate one
<holycow> <-- would like to even marginally help
<holycow> :)
<jamest> if someone collected them I'm sure they'd get put to use
<holycow> there's a lot of iconography on the net for windows, but little of it is gpl'd or under any other usefull licence from what i could tell
<holycow> windows users seem to think they can get rich by selling every little thing
<kilo_> well i'll leave now you with windows icons, got to sleep a little bit
<holycow> also you need to be carefull because you don't know if the author actually ripped actual proprietary icons
<kilo_> bye
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<holycow> the law is a grey area in terms of copyright
<holycow> you can base a work on other peoples work, but if its close, it can get funky
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<wayneg> is there any plans to have anon svn up and running soon?
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<jamest> wayneg: i thought it was agin?
<wayneg> hmm ... do you use port 3690 to serve it ?
<jamest> we'd have used the std
<jamest> i'll talk w/ jcater and see whats up
<jamest> i should have time to bring it back up tomorrow if there are no issues
<wayneg> ok thanks
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