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<neilt> morning all
<neilt> What is the state of gnue-packages?
<kilo> bad :D
<neilt> Is someone working on them?
<neilt> Is there a plan?
<neilt> is there a roadmap/
<neilt> ?
<kilo> yes, plan is to wait for an active contributor :)
<neilt> does what is there currently work?
<kilo> hmm i think yes
<neilt> kilo: Were you the only one involved in creating them?  If not, who else?
<kilo> well basically me only
<kilo> Sacha in the beginning
<neilt> I was the major creator of "gnue-oldpackages"
<kilo> i know :)
<neilt> when you looked at them, what did you decide to do differently?
<kilo> because new format arouse it seemed appropriate to do a rework
<kilo> not saying the old one was bad at all
<neilt> in the original design of the old corba middleware we discussed the concept of an application.
<neilt> did this make it into the current design of appserver?
<kilo> reinhard?
<reinhard> I'm not sure I understand what you mean
<neilt> the ability to configure what classes where installed into appserver
<reinhard> ah
<reinhard> well
<reinhard> basically we have that, by just reading in those GCD files that contain the classes you want
<reinhard> or do I misunderstand?
<neilt> So I could have a simple item class for simple billing application and a more complicated items class for an inventory application
<reinhard> yes
<neilt> So it basically is the shell script for loading up appserver (readgcd readgld etc)?
<reinhard> appserver supports a module path
<reinhard> the idea is as follows
<reinhard> you have the gcd gld files as packages in your "normal" package management system (fink, debian, ...)
<reinhard> the package management can also care about dependencies et al
<reinhard> just a sec, phone
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<reinhard> back
<reinhard> ok, you have gcd gld in e.g. a debian package
<reinhard> appserver can define a path like /usr/share/gnue/packages
<reinhard> debian package installs gcd + gld files in that path (or subdirectories thereof)
<reinhard> and sends SIGHUP to appserver
<reinhard> then appserver scans through the whole directory tree starting at /usr/share/gnue/packages and reads in all those files
<reinhard> so after installing e.g. gnue-invoicing debian package, you have tables in the database, objects installed in appserver, and everything you need
<reinhard> without even having to restart appserver
<neilt> cool
<neilt> where is the gld gcd programming manual?
<neilt> ... assume this appserver process assumes a clean database, no capability to clear out previous bad version of gnue-invoicing?
<reinhard> appserver will never delete columns or tables, but it might add tables or add columns to existing tables
<reinhard> manual: http://www.gnuenterprise.org/tools/appserver/docs/manual/devguide/index.html
<neilt> what is the procedure for clearing out the db.  run sql commands?
<reinhard> clear out db?
<neilt> db = database
<reinhard> best is drop database, recreate it again
<reinhard> with gnue-createdb.sh
<reinhard> no
<reinhard> gnue-setupdb
<reinhard> not gnue-createdb :)
<kilo> who knows, something like that :D
<neilt> where is the gld /gcd programming manual?
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<reinhard> http://www.gnuenterprise.org/tools/appserver/docs/manual/devguide/index.html
<neilt> the version is svn will not build because version.texi is missing
<neilt> gnue-appserver/doc/devguide
<neilt> Is this the same version as on the web site?
<reinhard> yes
<reinhard> version.texi is generated by the makefile
<neilt> ok, thanks
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<neilt> reinhard: do you mind if I make minor edits to the devguide?
<reinhard> au contraire: I would appreciate any improvement or additiion
<neilt> reinhard: thanks
<neilt> reinhard: I assume that you can not have any characters in the class name and module name except a through z?
<neilt> for sure not "_" underscore!
<reinhard> no underscores
<reinhard> a-z and (IIRC) 0-9
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<reinhard> IOW everything that's valid as a SQL table/column name minus the underscore
<kmk>  /msg NickServ IDENTIFY turkuabo
<neilt> does that mean that it may vary based on the database backend
<neilt> kmk: you might want to change your password
<neilt> it was posted here
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<chillywilly> hi
<reinhard> neilt: AFAICT all SQL backends support the same characters for identifiers
<reinhard> it's fixed by the SQL standard
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<reinhard> at least that was my understanding
<neilt> reinhard: excellent, thanks
<neilt> http://www.gnuenterprise.org/developers/docs.php
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<neilt> BTW the devguide is excellent, this should be on the web in the docs section
<reinhard> it is in the user docs section for appserver
<neilt> reinhard: which is where?
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<neilt> if i go here:
<neilt> http://www.gnuenterprise.org/docs/
<neilt> all i get is a directory listing
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<reinhard> it is http://www.gnuenterprise.org/tools/appserver/
<reinhard> this page has a doc section
<reinhard> the "developers docs" are meant internal docs for developers of the tools
<neilt> cool, it was kind of hard to find from the home page.
<reinhard> yep, there should be a good docs page
<reinhard> but gnue homepage is still work in progress :(
<reinhard> (for some years now)
<neilt> given that, I still think this version of the site is the best one over the years.
<reinhard> agreed
<reinhard> and actually before server move it was pretty stable
<reinhard> but IIRC the docs section was never working correctly (i.e. always giving directory listing)
<kmk> The wiki seems to be offline at the moment. Any chance, to get it working anytime soon? (I might contribute some content from the newbee perspective)
<neilt> kmk: evidently it has been down for some time after the server move, not sure what the real issue is, but I was told yesterday or Sunday that it was a known issue
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<kmk> Yesterday, I was able to produce some connected forms of suppliers and goods with gnue-designer and fill them with gnue-forms. Next, I need to use the data to produce valid orders. I guess, gnue-designer should be capable to this with file/new/report. Unfortunately, I can't seem to get anywhere. The GUI just looks like the usual gnue-designer less the forms construction site. Alas, I don't even understand the examples in
<kmk> usr.share.doc.gnue-reports.examples. Can you get me started?
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<dimas> hi all
<dimas> http://developers.slashdot.org/developers/05/10/10/0650207.shtml?tid=156
<dimas> reinhard: have you seen that?
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<dimas> would be great to be able to use appserver in addition to SQLObject
<dimas> even our friends from treshna were mentioned in the discussion
<reinhard> wee
<reinhard> ;-)
<dimas> :)
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<reinhard> yep, seems as it would give us a web frontend kinda for free
<reinhard> and, as they say they can use *any* kind of object, maybe you even *can* use appserver objects
<reinhard> (which can be mapped to python objects using the language interface)
<dimas> there is some talking about possibility to use any ORM tools or just XMLRPC to reach the backend
<dimas> and if anyone will watch the video, please tell me the impression :) it's just too much for me to download
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<neilt> in the dev guide the gld module tag has the attribute 'language="C"'.  Is this used and if so, how?
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<johannesV> this is because you can provide different labels for all the languages you like
<neilt> does the "C" stand for anything
<johannesV> it's the same as locale
<johannesV> so you could have language="en_US" or "de_AT" or just "de"
<johannesV> but also "C" as a general 'fallback'
<johannesV> if no other language-specific translation is given
<neilt> does it have to match anything, like the file name in the example address-de.gld?
<johannesV> appserver will use from the most specific to the most general (=C)
<johannesV> no
<johannesV> the module-tag of a gld specifies the language for all it's labels and messages
<johannesV> no matter which filename
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<neilt> johannesV: thanks
<johannesV> neilt, np
<johannesV> i'm glad to see that someone is *trying* what we've made the last few months ... :)
<neilt> yes, walking through everything step by step, in order to learn it.
<neilt> it looks very well done
<johannesV> thanks :)
<johannesV> it was really fun coding it ...
<johannesV> but i'm sure we can improve it
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<neilt> whenever someone from Europe (Germany) has a chance, please look at section 4.3 of the appserver dev guide
<neilt> gnue-appserver/doc/devguide and give me a real german translation for the gld file.
<neilt> Thanks
* neilt is away, 
<btami> jamest: Template file view.tmpl not found or template directory /var/lib/twiki/templates not found.
<btami> the file is there, but it's empty
<jamest> lots of those are empty though
<jamest> i figured that was ok
* jamest isn't a twiki user
<btami> hmm
<jamest> i couldn't find any valid reason for it to be failing
<jamest> but remember!
<jamest> [3:17:05] jamestisn't a twiki user
<jamest> :)
<btami> lol
<btami> jcater ?
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<btami> 'night
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<reinhard> good night all
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<jamest> i believe the wiki should be back up now
<chillywilly> hi jamest
<chillywilly> I like moin moin I think...
<jamest> i like what jcater setup and I only have to spend minimal time getting runing again better :)
<jcater> chillywilly, we accept patches :)
<chillywilly> that makes no sense
* chillywilly contributes nothing of value to anyone
<ajmitch> now is a good time to start
<chillywilly> looks who's talking ;)
<ajmitch> yes, i obviously do nothing anywhere in the free software world
<chillywilly> welcome aboard ajmitch
<ajmitch> :P
<chillywilly> you know I wa kidding
<ajmitch> chillywilly: going to go to UBZ?
<chillywilly> I don't even know what that is
<chillywilly> :(
<ajmitch> ubuntu below zero
<ajmitch> in montreal
<ajmitch> oct 30th - nov 10th
<chillywilly> how the hell would I get there?
<ajmitch> swim, drive, fly?
<chillywilly> I don't have the money to fly all over the world
<chillywilly> I don't even have a car right now
<ajmitch> all over the world? it's right in your back yard :P
<chillywilly> it's still in the shop
<chillywilly> not ;)
<ajmitch> you'd better fix it then
<chillywilly> it is getting fixed
<ajmitch> so that you can do a road trip to montreal
<chillywilly> they wouldn't let me across the border ;)
<chillywilly> it's only a 19 hour drive
<ajmitch> not long
<ajmitch> man, you could do that without sleeping
<ajmitch> no problem
<chillywilly> geeze, google maps says go through detroit
<chillywilly> that place is such a crap hole
<ajmitch> hah
<ajmitch> don't worry, I'm flying through vancouver to get there
<jcater> chillywilly, no
<jcater> at least crap holes have a purpose
<jcater> oh, snap!
<chillywilly> our "detroit" location still does pretty well
<chillywilly> I drove there a while back too
<chillywilly> to upgrade the computers
<chillywilly> 8 hr drive or so
<chillywilly> one way
<chillywilly> ajmitch: I need new tires too
<chillywilly> no way would I drive that without getting some new tires
<chillywilly> I wore them out driving to Florida
<chillywilly> and back
<chillywilly> :)
<ajmitch> I get to spend hours in airports!
<ajmitch> and go through US customs! yay!
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<kaimartin_> I just noticed, that the gnue-wiki is operational again :-)
<chillywilly> ajmitch: you're a terrorist, what did you expect?
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<reinhard> good morning
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<btami_> good morning
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<johannesV> good morning
<dimas> good morning
<johannesV> hi dimas
<dimas> hello johannesV
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<kilo> good morning
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